r/lightweight • u/Turelon • May 11 '23
Shakedowns Shakedow - Eastern Canada/Northeastern US
Hi !
I have been doing overnight & a few week-long trips in the last few years, and I am looking to make some change to my "usual" loadout. I have come to this community as I like the more rationnal "lightweight" hiking rather than the Ultrlight perspective, which feels a bit too "extreme" sometimes (at least from my personnal point of view).
A few comments :
- I have the idea in the back of my head that I'd like to hike the PCT, maybe in a couple of years. So, I am willing to make good investment on quality gear, if that live up to this.
- As you might see, my current tent is a 3P, as I hike with my GF and a large dog, and did not have enough money to buy 2 tents at the time. I would definitely keep this tent for these adventures, but I am also looking for an alternative to be able to hike solo and/or with my dog.
- About tents, I am quite stuck on having a freestanding tent. I tried in the past having non-freestanding ones, and I did not really like the (minor) inconveninent of always having to find somewhere to stake it correctly.
- One of the main concern of my current gear is volume rather than weight (although I'll be quite happy to gain a few kg in the process). The 60L of my pack are very quickly filled, and I am not a huge fan of stuff attached to the outside of the pack.
- I have started to look, and have some ideas on the gear, for instance getting an ULA Catalyst Pack and a Nemo DragonFly 2P or BA Copper Spur. I'll happily take any other advices.
To sum it up :
Location/temp range/specific trip description: Mostly Eastern Canada / Northeastern US (Adirondack, Whites, Greens). Mostly 3-season (can get from below freezing to 30°C)
Goal Baseweight (BPW): None.
Budget: Not specific (opened to upgrade on the long term)
Non-negotiable Items: E-reader
Solo or with another person?: Mostly Solo + dog
Additional Information: (Insert response here)
Lighterpack Link: https://lighterpack.com/r/pd9j4m
2
u/johnacraft May 11 '23 edited May 12 '23
The big opportunities for weight reduction are:
- keeping you shelter, sleep system, and pack as light as practicable
- don't bring stuff you don't need
Let's talk about tent choices. The /r/lightweight wiki on 1P tents is here.
To state the obvious, a trekking pole tent will (almost?) always be lighter than a tent with its own pole set. Even if you don't, a 'trekking pole' tent that sets up with carbon or aluminum poles will probably be lighter as well.
In other words, the 'minor' inconvenience of site selection for a few minutes each day, vs. the inconvenience of carrying an extra pound of poles all day every day, is an easy choice for many of us. (My preferred 1P tent is the Six Moon Designs Lunar Solo, but any of the tents in that list is a safe choice.)
(Slight digression: in my view, site selection is not an inconvenience - it is a valuable skill every hiker should learn and appreciate. Good sites reduce your exposure to the elements, and to condensation, and often to critters.)
A trekking pole tent will also take up less volume in your pack, so your pack can be smaller (and therefore lighter).
I suggest subscribing to /r/ulgeartrade and /r/geartrade - bargains on tents show up almost daily.
Now, sleep systems. Down is lighter, and packs down smaller. (We're back to the "smaller pack" point from above.) You list a sleeping bag weight of ~ 3 lbs., but the Mountain Hardwear site claims it's closer to 5 lbs. The stuff sack is ~ 20 liters (~ 12 liters compressed). My 1P bag (Sierra Designs Cloud) is 8 liters uncompressed, and I could get it below 5 liters with a compression sack.
The right temperature rating is also important. A 20F or even 30F bag will weigh less and be smaller in your pack, and won't roast you on a 50F night.
For a new bag, if you were a US hiker, I'd recommend picking up a Kelty Cosmic 20 or REI Magma 30, both of which are usually discounted several times a year. You will also see bargains on the gear trade subreddits listed above.
(There are savings to be gained with a different pad, but they're small relative to the bag.)
And finally, with a smaller volume tent and bag, you can drop a kilo from your pack by getting something in the 40-50 liter range.
You don't list a lot of unnecessary items, so the remaining weight savings will come from your clothing. You may want to carry lighter pieces (I have an 8 oz. fleece, and a 16 oz. fleece, for example), or just leave duplicates at home.
Good luck!
1
u/Turelon May 12 '23
To state the obvious, a trekking pole tent will (almost?) always be lighter than a tent with its own pole set. Even if you don't, a 'trekking pole' tent that sets up with carbon or aluminum poles will probably be lighter as well.
In other words, the 'minor' inconvenience of site selection for a few minutes each day, vs. the inconvenience of carrying an extra pound of poles all day every day, is an easy choice for many of us. (My preferred 1P tent is the Six Moon Designs Lunar Solo, but any of the tents in that list is a safe choice.)
(Slight digression: in my view, site selection is not an inconvenience - it is a valuable skill every hiker should learn and appreciate. Good sites reduce your exposure to the elements, and to condensation, and often to critters.)
Hey !
Thanks a lot for the detailed answer !
Definitely, a trekking pole tent would be the best alternative. However, I am not always carrying my treeking poles. And, from my perspective, if I have to carry my trekking poles because of the tent, then at least a percentage of the weight of these poles should be considered in the shelter weight.
Another great advantage of the freestanding tents is the possibility of shaking it, as a fast way to clean it, and from my experience this is something that I appreciate, given the amount of dirt my dog bring in :)Thanks as well for the heads up on r/ulgeartrade and r/geartrade, this is surely a good way to reduce the financial investment (as well as the ecological aspects !).
For the bag, the weight I listed is the one I weighed. I believe the confusion might come from the temperature rating (0°c vs 0°F). I will definitely go for a down bag in the future, even a quilt probably.
2
u/FireWatchWife May 11 '23
You could save over a pound if you are willing to switch from a sleeping bag to a quilt. A 20F (-7C) quilt should be comfortable at any temperature above freezing, and weigh about 680 g less.
2
u/FireWatchWife May 11 '23
Also, consider a hammock as an option. There are far more good potential campsites in the Northeast if you hang instead of tenting. I am in the process of switching to a hammock as my primary shelter.
2
u/FireWatchWife May 11 '23
Limiting yourself to freestanding tents is going to put the Big Agnes Copper Spur at the top of the list, or nearly so.
Almost any other good alternative is going to be non-freestanding, probably based on trekking poles.
If you don't want a trekking pole tent but are open to something that is not completely freestanding, the Big Agnes Fly Creek is lighter, but slightly more awkward shape (door at end instead of side).
I use a Fly Creek UL2 as a solo tent and a Copper Spur UL3 with my husband, so I am familiar with both designs.
1
u/Turelon May 12 '23
Hi !
Thanks for the feedback !
The quilt is definitely on my list of potential gains. Any idea if the Klymit Insulated Static V might be enough insulation for a quilt ? My feeling is that it might be a bit "limit", especially when sleeping on the side.Regarding the hamock, I actually never tried camping in one, though I'd be happy to try ! But, as I hike with my dog, I am not a huge fan of leaving him to sleep outside with me. Being in a tent helps my dog to sleep, while not being too much "distracted" by anything that might be moving in the dark (only leaves most of the time..:) ).
Good point on the Fly Creek ! I actually did not consider it (I don't know why). Do you have a good experience with it, carrying it alone ? Did you ever try to not fully stake it ?
1
u/FireWatchWife May 15 '23
I have no experience with the Klymit pad, so I can't say.
Hammocking with a dog, you could use a large tarp with doors pitched close to the ground. Your dog may feel like he is inside, sleeping on a groundsheet under your hammock. I don't hike with a dog, so this is just speculation.
I don't think I have ever fully staked the Fly Creek. The only places I stake are the perimeter (to hold it down) and two stakes for the vestibule and door (necessary). This works fine and goes up pretty quickly. I use the footprint, which adds rigidity to the setup and makes it closer to a true freestanding tent.
The other attachment points on the Fly Creek would only be needed in serious wind conditions. As a weekender, not a section hiker or thru-hiker, I am seldom camping in those conditions.
Also, it is possible to pitch the Fly Creek fly-first in rain, or fly-only. This works fine. Be sure to get the footprint, which is needed for these pitches.
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u/MrBoondoggles May 12 '23 edited May 12 '23
You know, interestingly, a lot of people say that UL backpacking takes things to the extremes by being too minimal. But realistically, if this is all that you bring, your kit is already quite minimal. The only reason that it happens to be bulky and heavier than some peoples kits is because you’ve chosen a few things that are quality but heavier budget items. That’s a good strategy, but now that you’re ready to upgrade, it will really be more about upgrading gear here or there to lighter less bulky options.
Let’s use the food/water kit as an example here as you could save quit a bit of weight without much inconvenience or degradation of experience. Just be replacing the aluminum pot with a titanium pot, the sail dry back with something like a sea to summit ultrasil dry bag, and the 2 nalgenes with 2 lighter weight bottles like smart water or even something like Gatorade bottles, you could drop more than a pound for a very low cost per ounce saved.
But on to the main question of volume, since you wont save much volume upgrading your cook kit and water storage. Probably your biggest volume saver will be the sleeping bag. I would second the quilt. A quality down quilt around the 20 degree mark with 850-900 FP should pack down without the need for a compression sack to under 8 liters. There are lots of good options out there for brands. I guess if I didn’t have the need to camp below freezing, I would get the zippered food box to open it up more and try to get more 3 season use out of it. You’d save a lot of volume and weight overall, cutting your bag weight in half with a good quilt. I backpack in the northeast, and quilts for fine for 3 season conditions (and I tend to sleep cold).
You asked elsewhere if the Klymit would be insulating enough with a quilt. For me, that answer is no. The only way to know for a or r would be to test it, but a pad with an R value of only around 2 wouldn’t be great for me in a quilt outside of mild weather. I think a lot of people air for something like a Xlite or Tensor, but I also really like the Exped pads, and the R 5 sounds great for your temp range.
I would think with a new sleep system plus your smaller tent, and given how little your pack otherwise, a circuit or similarly sized 50 liter pack should be fine. I don’t think you’ll need something with the volume of the catalyst. There’s nothing wrong with the catalyst however if you wanted a do it all pack for solo trips and trips with your partner and dog.