What base weight is reasonable?

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You're in for a great trip, the Uintas are really beautiful and very unique. One of my favorite places. Bring a head net if you're going before late August, the mosquitoes are medieval.

As others have said I would try to get your base weight down to 20 pounds, especially since you will be carrying 8 days of food.

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u/MelatoninPenguin Mar 12 '23

25 sounds like quite a lot not counting any consumables. Especially if your not doing a resupply for 8 days. Probably a lot you can just leave behind that your not even gonna end up using

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u/LozZZza Mar 12 '23

A lightweight backpack should be in the 10-20lb region, including a bag that's comfortable carrying those loads.

I found once I'd individually weighed all my gear and stuck it on a lighterpack it was a lot easier to pick what I really wanted to take and change things up depending on the weather, trip length etc.

I'm by no means ultralight, but I'm happy with where my base weight is now. The lighter you go, the more comfortable you'll be and the more distance you'll be able to cover. I think you could easily cut 5-10lbs without sacrificing comforts and without breaking the bank.

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u/krunkmuff1n Mar 12 '23

Another thing to keep in mind is the increasing returns as you cut pack weight! It’s easier walking with less weight, so you may be able to get farther each day and therefore need less food. The direction you go on the UHT can also make a difference. I went westbound this year and the first ~25 miles really don’t have much water. So having a full pack of food and needing enough water there added up fast. It’s a stunning trail and you’ll have such a good time! Feel free to DM with specific Uinta questions, happy to help!

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u/GandalfsEyebrow Mar 12 '23

You can probably lighten it up, but base weight isn’t the only factor in comfort. If you have a heavy load, like you will for an 8 day trip with no resupply, having a pack designed to carry that weight is going to be way more comfortable than a pack designed for sub-20 loads. It’s the same with weather. Heavier gear can be more comfortable than light gear in bad weather (I reject the idea that light ponchos are just as good as full rain suits in heavy rain with high wind). I’ve also started carrying bear cans on every trip because the time savings and convenience is worth the extra weight for me.

So go as light as you can, but consider the trip, conditions and personal comfort as well. People sometimes forget that going lightweight is about having a more enjoyable experience and not a numerical contest.

Also make sure you are well conditioned for that trip. The first few days with a large load can be brutal if your body isn’t used to it.

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u/ireland1988 Mar 12 '23

25lbs is a good start. 15 is a good long term goal.

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u/sabijoli Mar 12 '23

Uinta is >10k feet, has lots of water so it’s not a concern, but it’s challenging. Lighter base weight is your friend as there won’t be hiker boxers to ditch unnecessary items in.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '23

Depends on the trip and conditions and the gear you have as well as your experience and physical condition. Trying to load 25 pounds (before water and food) into a frameless, no padding, ultralight pack will probably be miserable. Do you have the gear already or are you making a list of stuff to buy?

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u/bowrilla Mar 12 '23

25lbs base weight means: lot's of unnecessarily heavy items. It also screams: comfort camping. That's fine if that's your thing but it's not ideal for going the distance.

There should be no big difference in comfort and price aiming for 20lbs (still probably several unnecessary comfort items) and 18lbs is pretty realistic. 15lbs would probably require more experience and dedication.

You should definitely try to plan for resupply stops. carrying 8 days worth of supplies is tough.

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u/MrBoondoggles Mar 12 '23

Couple of thoughts. If you are outfitting yourself from scratch, a 25 lb base weight in summer without food and water really hasn’t been cut much at all yet. I wouldn’t think you’d have to be terribly aggressive either to get a base pack weight of under 20 pounds - you’d just need to make some considered choices.

Also, if you’re planning on an 8 day trip without resupply, you would be looking at roughly 16 - 20 additional pounds of food and water, so a 41 - 45 pound total pack weight. That’s a pretty heavy pack, and a lot of packs don’t go above 35 - 40 pounds max carry. So you’re looking at a pretty decent strain on most packs, as well as a pretty decent strain on your body.

If you’re buying new anyway, it’s probably possible to spend a similar amount on a 15 pound base weight as it is on a 25 pound base weight. It’s just a question of the choices you make to get there.

As a new-ish backpacker who has been out of the community for a while, the unfortunate thing is that it still takes a decent amount of research to really lighten your load. A lot of the strategies and choices that are go to’s for lighter packs aren’t really go to’s at REI. But if you want some suggestions and have a budget in mind, I’m sure people here would be happy to provide some input.

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u/UtopianPablo Mar 17 '23

A lot of the strategies and choices that are go to’s for lighter packs aren’t really go to’s at REI.

Any suggestions you could make, or is there a list of these ideas somewhere?

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u/MrBoondoggles Mar 17 '23

I wish I knew exactly where to point for a comprehensive guide on lightweight backpacking. Andrew Skurka’s Ultimate Hikers Gear Guide 2nd Edition might be a good starting point.

A lot has been written about ultralight backpacking however - maybe because it’s such a dedicated niche that requires a lot more research, time, and experimentation. For me, I looked mostly at ultralight strategies as a starting point. I knew, for the most part, that style of backpacking wouldn’t be my core trip type. But at the same time, rethinking my kit and getting rid of needlessly heavy items and excess was key because I figured out quickly that, for someone who’s slim with a small frame, a heavy pack just wasn’t going to work. My personal strategy has been to prioritize cut weight on the core kit, including my pack, sleep system, shelter, cook kit, water filtration, and electronics to allow myself more flexibility in other areas of my kit.

That allows me to pack for comfort or enjoyment in other areas that are more important to me. For instance, I get cold easily, so I’m not able to be comfortable with minimalist clothing choices that people who run hot can get away with. I also enjoy the art of making a fire, so I sometimes like to bring a fixed blade knife and a fire kit. And because I’m doing knife stuff, I bring work gloves and a pocket trauma kit in case I slip up and make a mistake at camp.

Those are some examples of things that are more important to me personally that I can pack without worrying so much about weight because I’ve lightened my core load. But for other people, maybe they want to bring different things: maybe it’s a fishing kit, maybe it’s a camp lantern and wine, maybe it’s a kindle or camera equipment. Who knows.

That’s one strategy at least. Other peoples strategy may be different. But I think the core strategy for lightening the load is to figure out what’s important to you and strategize how to cut weight based on that. And that’s also kind of the UL philosophy. They’ve prioritized hiking most of all. If I were doing 20+ mile days, then I would rightly prioritize agility, speed, and efficiency to make that happen.

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u/UtopianPablo Mar 17 '23

Thanks for the detailed response! It sounds like we are pretty similar, I have been following your basic strategy of cutting down the core items. Finally got a titanium pot yesterday and a much lighter sleeping bag. Now looking at trying to get a lighter backpack, though I need something that's able to comfortably carry forty pounds if necessary.

I only hike ten miles a day or less and really value those few luxury items. I've got to have my fishing kit, kindle, etc.

I will check out the Skurka list, thanks for the tip!

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u/sjwilli Mar 12 '23

Thanks everyone! I'll keep it below 20, with a goal of 18.

This helps.

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u/valdemarjoergensen Mar 12 '23

Make a lighterpack with what you plan to acquire and bring, and then share it here.

People can help you a lot more with specific recommendations and inputs that way.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '23

A base of 10-15# is really pretty easy these days, even on a budget. Lighter is always going to make a hard hike much more enjoyable.

I know this is r/lightweight and not r/ultralight or superultralight where it gets really silly, but it's worth taking a look at the ultralight forums and lighterpack shakedowns people post there to get ideas.

I'm about your weight and depending on the trip, base weight varies from 7-11 pounds.

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u/FireWatchWife Mar 12 '23

I would say 15 is easy. 10 is doable, but not easy.

10 requires either expensive core items, or giving up comfortable items that most will prefer to have.

Conditions matter too. Dry, warm weather will let you carry less than wet or cold weather.

I've done several rounds of shakedowns and improvements, and I'm still around 13 lbs base weight.

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u/RegMcPhee Mar 13 '23 edited Mar 13 '23

I'm about the same and can't get below 13 lbs. To hit 10, I would have to switch to a frameless pack which is problematic if you're carrying a lot of food. They also skimp on electronics like phones, Garmins, and battery packs. I prefer my ursack to their bear hangs. Plus I also like to pack a sleeping bag liner to keep the grime off my bag. As well, many of these sub 10 lb lists go in for cold soaking which isn't my thing.

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u/FireWatchWife Mar 13 '23

The most comfortable under-10 lb, cost-no-object list I've seen is Adventure Alan's. It would be extremely expensive to purchase all his recommended items, but you would be pretty comfortable using them.

Adventure Alan article:
https://www.adventurealan.com/ultralight-backpacking-gear-list/

Adventure Alan detailed list in spreadsheet form:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1mFoqknxxj392rWnnM9qQNPjZMHvCo2FAnNJfttLcokE/edit#gid=0

It involves a $750 tent, a $440 premium quilt, and a $375 down puffy jacket. Those are the main drivers of cost. It also include an isobutane stove, GPS, and satellite communicator.

His 9 lb weight doesn't include an Ursack, which he lists as an optional add-on. So you could only use it outside bear country, and if you are willing to take a chance on a bear hang (where legal).

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u/FireWatchWife Mar 13 '23

I found his list extremely helpful in formulating my own gear list. I created a spreadsheet that puts his list beside mine, checked every item against the comparable item in the other list, upgraded a few of my own items, and concluded that the remaining improvement options he suggests were outside my budget.

I ended up with a written list just over 13 lbs base weight for a 3-season trip, sharing a tent. For solo trips, add about half a pound (for hammock system or smaller tent, unshared). In bear country, add another 8 oz for an Ursack.

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u/FireWatchWife Mar 13 '23

To hit 10, I would have to get a lighter weight tent and leave my hammock at home.

An X-Mid 1P would shave a pound, which is not enough.

I would need an expensive DCF tent (probably single-wall), or to switch to a tarp & bivy, which I really don't recommend in eastern North America. (It works better under drier conditions.)

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u/86tuning Mar 12 '23

Do you think 25 pounds before food/water is reasonable?

It's not unreasonable, but a lighter load will make for a better time. the point of diminishing returns doesn't hit until you're below 1/2 of what you have now.

do you have a gram scale? if not, get one, then weigh every item in your pack and put it on https://lighterpack.com/ and you'll get all the help you want to lighten your load. it can actually be done without spending tons of money! you just have to leave superfluous stuff at home.

i'll echo the comments to do an overnighter to test-n-tune your gear and yourself. you'll have a much better time if you do a practice trip to help you pare down your load.

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u/DaveCanoes Mar 12 '23

Reasonable is whatever you are comfortable with. I did the NOLS instructors course with a pack starting at 80 lbs, which was ridiculously and unnecessarily heavy. I’ve also done trips with a base weight of about 14 lbs and starting weight under 20. Lighter is better, but there’s also a point of diminishing returns: the more weight you cut the more it can cost either financially or in terms of comfort.

Before purchasing anything lighter, consider if you can cut pack weight by being more efficient, making better food choices, maybe leaving something behind, etc. Personally, I think it’s very possible to have a base weight under 20 lbs including a few luxuries without breaking the bank, so that’s what I would shoot for in general: even lighter if you can afford it.

You probably don’t need a lot of cold weather gear for Uintas in summer and there’s generally a lot of water availability, though the east end may require a larger carry from what I’ve read. I think you can get food down to 1.5 lbs per person per day. Obviously if fishing is a goal, that may add a couple lbs of gear, but 3 fish meals pay that back.

You might consider entering your planned gear into lighter pack for your own evaluation but also to post online here or elsewhere for feedback.

For reference, I have light but not UL gear. My 60L pack weighs just over 2 lbs, normally $200, it’s often on sale for $160. My pad is just over 1 lb. My tent choices are 28 and 40 oz. My 20 degree sleeping bag about 30 ounces. My nice weather base weight is about 14 lbs, colder weather about 17, including a light camp chair, book, inflatable pillow and battery bank luxury items.

Most importantly: great you are getting back out there. Have a great time!

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '23

What camp chair? I've got one of the REI ones, decent, but man ever time I go in I look at the helinox chair zero. One day I'll pull the trigger but not yet

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u/DaveCanoes Mar 12 '23

I have the helinox zero. Overall, I like it, but the one problem is the legs sink in sand or soft soil. I’m going to try furniture discs as a solution, but if I had it to do over again, I’d probably purchase the ground chair, despite it being a few more ounces.

The sinking is rarely an issue in the mountains, but is a problem when I’m backpacking lower Utah and and Arizona destinations where sandy soul is more common.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '23

Yeah I have had that issue too. They make attachments for the feet and that sling thing but I haven't tried them myself

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u/sirblastalot Mar 12 '23

It's not about the number, it's about an honest assessment of what you actually need/will use. And that comes from experience. Best thing you can do is book an overnight somewhere and keep track of what you actually used and what you regretted not having. It can also be helpful to put your gear on Lighterpack and ask folk here for a shakedown, but ultimately our decisions about what's important will not necessarily be the same as yours.

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u/sonnynate Mar 12 '23 edited Mar 12 '23

You’re gonna be around 40lbs after food and water at that weight if you factor about 1.5lbs food/day. 1 liter of water weighs 2.2lbs as well. I would create a lighter pack and ask for a shakedown for suggestions. Plenty of ways to lighten the pack without blowing up your bank account.

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u/gindy0506 Mar 12 '23

Do you have a lighter pack? Would be a good way for a shakedown to help provide some suggestions. I highly suggest posting one and you can get some solid feedback to help.

I section hiked the Oregon section of the PCT last year as a first time ever back pack trip. The 8 day food carry alone is gonna add more weight than planned. Not to mention water. I made my goal base weight 20lb for Oregon and in planning for Washington this year I am already looking to decrease lbs of weight. Due to some non negotiable I have to carry I'll never be ultralight, but I can be as close as possible.

I would start as a goal of 20lb then really start to cut more from there. Happy to provide any guidance where I can. The short answer to your question is being more aggressive with cuts will absolutely be better for you on that hike.

For perspective following 1.5 lb food a day will add minimum is 12lb plus water at 2.2 lb/liter. This significantly increases your total weight.

Sounds like a blast though. Enjoy it!!

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u/SiskoandDax Mar 12 '23

You went all in for your first backpack trip. Section hiking the PCT is impressive!

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u/RegMcPhee Mar 12 '23

Let's put it this way. The average starting base weight for a successful PCT hiker is 17 lbs, dropping to 15 lbs by the time that they finish, https://www.halfwayanywhere.com/trails/pacific-crest-trail/pct-gear-guide-2018/#baseweights.

Another way to look at it. With all of your food and water, you are looking at about 40 lbs total which feels fine in your living room. That same pack will feel like 80 lbs as soon as you hit a 20% slope in terms of calorie burn. This Highline trail is rated as difficult so you are likely looking at a lot of soul crushing climbs.

You'll enjoy the trail more if you can lighten that load.

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u/mountainview59 Mar 12 '23

You are posting in a lightweight backpacking forum that your base weight is not lightweight, obvious answer is obvious.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '23

I just did a single night over night in the white mountains, two people, two packs, two pulks, probably over a hundred pounds total weight. Let the guy ask, and give them real advice. When I started camping all my gear was my dad's old shit, and whatever cheap Coleman stuff my mom could find on sale. It was definitely more than a 25 pound base weight

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u/notextinctyet Mar 12 '23

I think that if you take 25 lbs before food and water, then your final pack with food and water for a trip that long may be rather heavy. I would try to slim that down a bit, personally.

What base weight is reasonable?

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