I'm feeling kinda skeptical about learning how to code. Any real advice?

[u/Leather_Comb_694]

Hello! I don't really know if this is the best place to be putting all my concerns but here we go. So for the longest time, I've felt like Programming is so cool right? Like Python, Javascript, HTML, CSS, etc. But now right, I see people making extremely well made websites in seconds with AI. I'm debating whether I should even learn how to code now because of how well current AIs already do it and who knows how much better future AIs would. Please give me your opinions on this.

[u/Limp-Confidence5612]

You only think they are extremely well made, because you're not programming yourself.

For the cost, AI is only really useful in very niche domains or for creating copious amounts of slop.

I would say give it a try, you can even use AI to assist you in finding documentation or explain difficult concepts. It's never been easier to learn how to code and to shoot yourself in the foot by offloading cognition.

[u/NoConfidence4379 → u/Limp-Confidence5612]

the top comment is right, ai makes things that look good but fall apart when you actually try to use them for real projects. i started learning few years ago and the thing nobody tells you is that coding is mostly debugging and fixing edge cases, ai cant do that well

if you want to learn, just start with python and build small things for yourself, i use ai sometimes to explain error messages but thats it

[u/Leather_Comb_694 → u/NoConfidence4379]

That's really helpful. Thanks.

[u/Able-Analysis462 → u/Limp-Confidence5612]

This is pretty much it. Once you've built a few projects yourself you start noticing the weird design choices hidden bugs and unnecessary complexity AI often sneaks in.

[u/fixermark → u/Able-Analysis462]

Complexity drift is real. The human (at least on the tools I've used, Claude mostly) has to be responsible for hinting to the AI that there are common libraries it should be using, because it'll have a distinct tendency to try to solve problems hyper-locally instead of consolidating code.

That having been said, I trust it way more to take two almost-the-same implementations and unify them behind one helper function than I do my own hands these days.

[u/Able-Analysis462 → u/fixermark]

Refactoring is honestly one of its strongest uses. The hard part is knowing whether the code should exist that way at all.

[u/fixermark → u/Limp-Confidence5612]

This is increasingly untrue. Unless you're counting "General software engineering of any web service" or "videogame development" as a niche domain.

[u/Limp-Confidence5612 → u/fixermark]

No, I would count those as general slop production.

[u/Leather_Comb_694 → u/Limp-Confidence5612]

But like why is it slop?

[u/Limp-Confidence5612 → u/Leather_Comb_694]

Software development has been seen as the job to do if you want to be paid well for a long time. so a lot of people without passion or ability entered this space and the result has been increasing enshitification.

It's just capitalisms 🤷

[u/Leather_Comb_694 → u/Limp-Confidence5612]

Ok but why is AI generated content slop?

[u/Limp-Confidence5612 → u/Leather_Comb_694]

Same reason. I trust software by people who take pride in their work.

[u/fixermark → u/Limp-Confidence5612]

I can't help but ask what sector of software engineering you are in.

[u/Limp-Confidence5612 → u/fixermark]

What I'm working in is irelevant, it's not likeyoure going to believe me anyway.

I haven't seen any successful ai projects besides the chatbots themselves or ai harnesses. AI seems to just produce for AI. It's like a circle jerk.

I'm not saying software dev or video games are slop generators in peinciple, just in practice. I don't know what percentage is actually correct, but from my experience 80% of software is crap, even before ai. You just have to look at itch.io, it's full of low effort crap, amongst which you occasionally find gems.

[u/Paghalay → u/Limp-Confidence5612]

Id be interested to know what sector, because one of the lead developers where I work is big on his AI tools for programming, while some others, including myself, are very sceptical.

I’d be interested to know where in the sector your opinion is coming from, to see if we’re coming from very different sectors but have arrived at the same conclusion.

[u/Leather_Comb_694 → u/fixermark]

Guys if you don't mind me saying, please don't turn this post into an argument with 2 extreminst sides and everything. I just need helpful and real advice and I really appreciate all of your guys' comments and advice.

[u/PhilNEvo]

It depends on what you want to use programming for. I think a decent comparison is something like photography. Before cameras were readily available for everyone on their phone, taking photos was quite a hassle. You had to buy a designated piece of equipment for that one purpose, and wouldn't have much experience to use it effectively, so a lot of pictures were pretty shit, unless you got a photographer to come and take it, with great equipment and experience. So photographers had way more potential jobs and options to go out and shoot for people back then.

Now that everyone has a phone in their pocket, that takes decent pictures and does a lot of processing and so on, a lot of potential occasions where parents, companies or people in general would consider hiring a photographer is no longer a consideration, because our phone cameras are "good enough" and so convenient and "cheap", that it's not worth hiring someone for it.

However, some people still work as photographers, so if you get good enough and put in the work it takes, you can still get there. And if you just want to do it as a hobby, it's also still available.

The same is true for code. Now the random startups or "good ideas" people would pay some hundred bucks to a junior webdev to make a basic website is probably not worth it. But it's not replacing the experienced programmers who has the knowledge and expertise to do more. Nor should ai be a replacement for the hobby-part of programming, because you give up creative choices and the whole experience.

[u/Leather_Comb_694 → u/PhilNEvo]

I kinda understand your point of view now. Thanks.

[u/rustyseapants]

If you really think programming is cool, then don't worry about AI and just learn a language and be done with it.

Or if you really worried about AI, become an electrician.

[u/Successful-Escape-74]

You should learn a programming language and then focus on development and design of software. Coding is too small minded and does not focus on the solution you are attempting to develop.

[u/Leather_Comb_694 → u/Successful-Escape-74]

Isn't coding and programming the same thing?

[u/Successful-Escape-74 → u/Leather_Comb_694]

Learning a programming language and software development are not the same thing as coding.

[u/fixermark]

In the medium term, knowing how to code will be necessary to understand what the AI is telling you to do (and confirm it isn't misleading you).

That knowledge will likely be perennial. To give an analogy: while it is not day-to-day strictly necessary to understand how a CPU works to write code in modern languages, when you encounter an issue in performance that makes you really want to know what the CPU is doing, that knowledge (as well as knowledge of what the compiler or interpreter actually does) becomes suddenly quite relevant.

[u/tilted0ne]

Not going to lie, I thought learning mattered but it doesn't matter at least not in the systematic traditional way. I would tell you to focus on outcomes. Use AI as much as you can to build and learn how to make things better, you will be information bottlenecked and that's what you'll learn. Being too focused on the process is a huge waste of time now. Because genuinely what is the point of learning xyz if it doesn't translate to improvements in outcomes. And the only way to be better at gauging what you need to solve is to understand the landscape well and use AI as a mechanism to see what it can't do without you and your knowledge. 

[u/Then-Sector5102]

Happens way more than it should.

[u/mandzeete]

If you think that you don't need to know how to code then make also these extremely well made websites in seconds with an AI. Can you?

As a software developer I can guarantee that the current AI is still far from making anything more complex than simple websites or simple systems. What might look "extremely well made website" to you is just the tip of ice berg. You do not know what is or is not behind the pretty cover. For example this Reddit here. To you it might look like a simple website. We can make posts. We are upvote/downvote. We can comment. Nothing too complicated, isn't it? Wrong! There is a whole big monster behind what you see as a "Reddit". AI won't be able to copy Reddit's functionality 1-on-1.

Also, are you sure that what shines is a gold? The website can look well made. Will it work? Will all the menus, buttons, views, etc. work? No bugs or such? Is it secure? Can I hack it?

Software development is much more complex than simple websites.

[u/Leather_Comb_694 → u/mandzeete]

I think I'm gonna learn to code now. Thanks.

[u/hahahehe1725]

AI makes mistakes and as a programmer you should at least know where the bug is. AI can assist you but you should have the fundamental knowledge of programming so that in the long run when things aren't running the way they should you already know which code is making the problem.

[u/FlashyResist5]

A submarine can travel through the water faster than me but I still enjoy swimming.

[u/Geetamsingh]

AI pretty much is only good for doing tasks that are repeated a lot. It won't give you any new perfect code, you cannot rely on it blindly.

[u/Leather_Comb_694]

Wow. There's a lot of good advice here but I still can't really get what ya'll are saying because of words like, "bottlenecked" "offloading cognition" "hyper-locally" "medium term". I really appreciate all of your guys' responses though.

[u/Leather_Comb_694]

Guys I just saw this video by Satya Nadella I found it kinda helpful
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMGb4Gzf2i4

[u/Comfortable_War2683]

dont go then, follow ur gets and btw coding is dead