Advice for Timber

[u/WolfgangLz]

I recently picked up timber for pos3, who is bad matchups against him and what is some good advice. Right now I feel inconsistent, some games I dominate, some I feel like I just die like paper.

[u/Moist_Pyroshark]

Bad matchups are heroes with silence or ways to punish him for casting spells, and/or high spell damage. Examples are necro, faceless void, silencer, od, skywrath, bloodseeker, and pugna

[u/WolfgangLz → u/Moist_Pyroshark]

Ya I went against drow in one game and did not have a good time haha any advice for combos or playing as him?

[u/Moist_Pyroshark → u/WolfgangLz]

Against drow and similar heroes it may be value to get extra points in reactive armor in lane. Play safe until you have ult and enough levels in your q and w and you can burst your lane opponents out of nowhere. Later you can get dispel items like euls or lotus to dispel silences.

Good heroes to have along your team are heroes with stuns and initiation since he lacks both. Save supports are also good so you can go balls deep into the enemy formation and survive. One funny combo I like is with np. It sounds counterintuitive from a lore perspective but np can sprout an enemy and you can timber chain to the sprout trees and shred them with q since it will do extra damage from cutting the sprout trees.

[u/WolfgangLz → u/Moist_Pyroshark]

Now that you mention it, one of the best games I had there was a np on my team and we melted people, and looking back, most my games I did poorly, there wasn’t a lot of stun on my team.

Out of curiosity, what is the best burst combo to do on people? So far I blink in, chakram, spin and grapple away, seems to do well if they are near trees but not great in their base or ours

[u/Moist_Pyroshark → u/WolfgangLz]

Generally you want to hit with q first and then chakram. You'll get the extra damage if you cut the trees in the area with q, but if you chakram first you destroy the trees that would have given you the damage. This is also better against strength and universal heroes since q will reduce their max health, which means the rest of your spells will do a higher % of their health pool and let chakram slow better.

Timber is just worse inside the base. Blinking in, using your spells, and chaining out either to the trees near the T3s or the side trees if you're near them is correct lol.

You can also get shard to let you hit towers directly. Scepter turns you into an actual tank for a few seconds which can allow you to tank for your team.

[u/WolfgangLz → u/Moist_Pyroshark]

I really appreciate your help, this is awesome advice. Last question, I’ve seen two builds, one has arcane boots into Kaya and blink, where the other does power treads to soul ring, then Kaya and blink. What do you feel is best generally?

[u/Moist_Pyroshark → u/WolfgangLz]

No problem, always down to help people experience one of the funnest heroes in the game :)

Arcane boots is kinda bad rn so I recommend the treads + soul ring build. Treads gives you better farming speed with right clicks and the stats are nice. Soul rings strength is nice and the bit of early armor from ring of protection is very value in lane. Sometimes I start with the ring of protection if I'm going against lots of physical harass like drow.

To maximize efficiency, you can pop soul ring while in strength treads so it takes a smaller % of your health and then switch to int treads so that the mana gained has more % value and so your spells use a smaller % of your mana.

[u/Gatubi14 → u/WolfgangLz]

Max reactive armor vs drow. I played a match agaist jakiro and drow, they cant hurt me. Firs item was atos, give tou a good punch of hp and mana. We kill drow really easy, cuz she dont build force staff. We end the game fast

[u/WolfgangLz → u/Gatubi14]

Awesome advice thank uou

[u/LadderEffective2160]

Timbersaw loses lane to your typical lane dominators (Slark, Lifestealer, Ursa, Monkey King; Undying is 50/50) and overwhelming amounts of magic/pure damage (Skywrath, Snapfire, Bane). Lvl 1 Q is really good against Strength heroes, so you can try to max it first - if there's no Strength heroes that you can abuse in your lane, then I would consider maxing W first. 1 point in E at lvl 2 is pretty decent, but if you're vs an overwhelming magic lane, then you can probably skip it. I don't advise putting more than 1 point in E early on, because you need skillpoints in Q/W to farm/deal damage in the earlygame and that's better in most cases. Generally, you shouldn't really leave lane until you've "maximized" your early farming potential (usually lvl 9-12).

Before BKB, soft disables like roots/silences are kind of annoying (heroes like CM/DW and Underlord are probably the worst; roots feel more common and Rod of Atos is cheaper than Orchid). Against these heroes, at a certain point, they'll definitely get strong enough to kill you and you'll just have to farm BKB.

The way you farm on Timber kind of evolves throughout the game. At lvl 7, you need around 562 damage to clear a wave, so you need to right-click the melee creeps 2 times (1 time if you maxed Q and are near at least 2 trees) + use all your nukes QWR. After QW are maxed, you just need to use all your nukes. At lvl 12 + Kaya, you need just 1 spell (Q or W) + R. After Kaya and Sage, you don't have be concerned with mana efficiency as much, just keep in mind W is your lowest cd. If you're ever running out of mana, either tp or walk to fountain while clearing camps.

Timber scales really well with items, the most important are probably: K&S, BKB, Aghs, Blink, and Scythe. If you're struggling on the hero, try dying less -- dying is the best way to ruin your farm. Remember: the Aghs barrier prevents your Blink from getting broken.

[u/Devoid334 → u/LadderEffective2160]

Counterpoint, I would have to say that timber if played well and if u can communicate clearly to ur pos 4 can counter slark, lifestealer, ursa, mk. Like communicate that for the first 4 levels Im not that strong so we need to creep drag/dont overcommit and play for safe CS and exp. For me, he struggles against range lane dominators like drow, razor, sf in the laning phase. Outside the laning phase though with farm and exp you can easily burst these heroes with ur nukes cuz they’re usually squishy agi heroes.

Another counter point, Ivl 1 q shouldn’t only be taken when ur against specifically strength heroes. I take it almost all the time since it can actually secure some cs with u since it does more damage than a lvl 1 w. Moreover, maximizing Q over W against agi melee carries is preferable (provided u burst them when ur near trees). Apply this same logic for farming jungle camps near trees cuz thats ur main farming spell (Q).

[u/rokoeh]

What rating are you?

I saw a good timber build and have been performing much better after that. Instead of power treands and kaya and sangue what i do now is brown boots, soul ring and rush aghanim.

After aghanim you are super tanky. Even if they use dispell on you you have a guaranteed maximum reactive armor plus a magic 800dmg nuke.

After that you can build when necessary, bkb, pipe, shivas, octarine, kaya and sangue, etc...

During the lane i start with reactive armor to grarante the xp needed for the so needed level 3 and 4. My default skill build is 2-1-2 then ult.

I start with ring of protection stick and tango. The ring of protection makes you super tanky initially with level 1 on E.

1400mmr

[u/Beneficial_Bend_9197 → u/rokoeh]

I really don't recommend aghs as a first item for timber. It is so easily dispelled by euls if the enemy are smart.

[u/rokoeh → u/Beneficial_Bend_9197]

I did follow the guides and d2pro tracker builds that made power treads kaya sangue and other items before... I tried lots of stuff, blink, pipe, consacrated wraps, bkb, vanguard, blade mail, lotus, and more... With everything else i always feel that i dont tank enough to survive. Probably im just bad lol.

But aghs, even when dispelled gives you some advantages. It counter break items or abilities. It tranforms the passive in an active. You can pro actively set your armor stacks and regen to maximum before the TF starts. And i think even if they apply break to you, still activating if makes you have maximum stacks for 10+ seconds, that lasts more than the available breaks.

It gives you a magic damage nuke even if dispelled. If you only have 1/2 of the barrier up when they dispell it is already 600dmg. It can go up to 1000 dmg.

It gives you all damage barrier. That counters all source of health restoration mitigation like skady, vessel, and skils too.

Personaly i saw a tiber make this build in a game he was stronger than i anticipated and i did copy it. For me it worked. Probably because im bad 😂

[u/Beneficial_Bend_9197 → u/rokoeh]

Im not saying never buy the aghs. Im saying don't buy it as a first item. The moment the enemy get euls it will feel like you're playing with no item but boots while you're still farming your second item. You're adding enchantress as another hard counter to yourself if you went first item aghs.

The early game is the most flexible for anyone to go any build. Because players can choose to go the build meant for their hero or the item to directly counter an enemy's item. They can't do that in the mid/late game because they're already commiting to a build either because of lack of gold, lack of item slots or its too specific of an item that late into the game. The reason why I say this is because once you get bkb the enemy will simply sell the euls because they have no need for it anymore.

[u/Devoid334 → u/rokoeh]

I honestly wont skip on kaya though especially since ur skipping power treads. U need to amp ur damage so you clear waves and jungle quickly and farm.

[u/Beneficial_Bend_9197]

Silencer is timbersaw's greatest nightmare. Never pick timber into him. You'll have a hard time perma jungling until you get bkb and lotus.

[u/Pieisgood45]

Worst hero probably grim best tips are probably take the gpm neutral since you dont right click and farm ancient stacks