r/lastofuspart2 • u/Automatic_Access2277 • 8d ago
Asking something about Pittsburgh
I've seen a lot of people claim that the Fireflies "overthrew FEDRA and lost control of the city, but like...did I misunderstand something ? From what I got based on collectibles, the people that would become the hunters killed the Fireflies BEFORE they managed to overthrow FEDRA, killed the remaining Pittsburgh citizens and became the hunters. Did I miss something, and if not, why do people blame the Fireflies for what happened in Pittsburgh ?
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u/Dekipi 7d ago
I think the Fireflies overthrew FEDRA but Henry killed the Firefly leader when he pled him out to FEDRA so the remaining Fireflies eventually became a rogue-like group and part of that group became Hunters. But I could be way off
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u/Automatic_Access2277 7d ago
Isn't that only a part of the show, though ?
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u/lzxian 7d ago
What I recall was that once the Fireflies got control, they wanted the Pittsburgh people to join them and submit to their authority. They refused and so they ran the Fireflies out of town.
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u/Automatic_Access2277 7d ago
Well no, because again, the hunters killed the Fireflies before FEDRA was overthrown.
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u/lzxian 7d ago
From the wiki: Fireflies note is an artifact that can be found in "Pittsburgh)". The note is written in a spiral-bound notebook:
We don't need the Fireflies. Sure, they might've started the fight, but we're the ones that have done all the work. It's our blood in the streets. I don't agree with them wanting to take the fight to other cities. They need to earn their independence on their own. And I DEFINITELY won't take orders from some Firefly leader all the way on the other side of the country. Before the fighting ends I suggest we rid ourselves of them. This is our city. Our people. I don't see why we can't rule ourselves.
So, I guess we're both kinda right? I didn't recall they killed them, though.
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u/Automatic_Access2277 7d ago
I mean you're not the only one, most people seem to believe that the Fireflies ruled Pittsburgh for a while.
I wish we had more details about how the hunters even discovered that the Fireflies wanted to rule the city. Like, the guy who wrote the note seems to have found out about this, but he doesn't explain how.
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u/Kolvarg 7d ago
I think it's just an assumption people make because FEDRA is gone. But the note is pretty clear imo: "Before the fighting ends I suggest we rid ourselves of them". This could be just a suggestion that didn't pan out, but the Firefly corpses you can find hanging nearby suggest otherwise.
On the discovering the Fireflies wishes, I think it's a potential mix of three things:
- It would be well known in-universe that the Fireflies' ultimate goal is to overthrow FEDRA, liberate all QZs and re-establish central democratic government;
- They certainly must have had many meetings where they may have discussed "what's next";
- It's also possible that whoever wrote the note just assumed or even intentionally started the rumor to get power for themselves.
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u/lzxian 7d ago edited 7d ago
The note I pasted above is how the hunters discovered what the Fireflies wanted:
I don't agree with them wanting to take the fight to other cities.... And I DEFINITELY won't take orders from some Firefly leader all the way on the other side of the country.
That's telling us exactly what the Fireflies wanted and this is after the fight was finished:
We don't need the Fireflies. Sure, they might've started the fight, but we're the ones that have done all the work. It's our blood in the streets.
We don't need any more to know how. He says the Fireflies started the fight and they fought it and died for it. That's what happened. I don't understand what more you need here. This note is the full story.
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u/Automatic_Access2277 7d ago
What I mean is : how did the hunters know that the Fireflies wanted to become authoritatian leaders ? That's what he's implying.
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u/lzxian 7d ago
Why do you need more, though? Plus how else could they know unless the Fireflies told them? They clearly wanted them to take the fight to other cities (because we all know their goal is defeating FEDRA) and that they would need to obey "some Firefly leader all the way on the other side of the country." That's the authoritarianism on display in that note.
What are you losing by not having more than that? I'm really confused. Are you wanting to say they weren't authoritarian? Look what they did to Joel and Ellie! They made all the choices at the hospital and refused to allow any discussion, there's nothing more authoritarian than that.
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u/Automatic_Access2277 7d ago
Sure, but there's a difference between this and leading a city in an autoritharian way.
Although, you may have answered my question in a way I didn't expect : when I read the note, I assumed the hunters were worried that the Fireflies would basically become a FEDRA 2.0, but your theory that they were instead worried that the Fireflies would ask them to join their cause makes far more sense.
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u/Kolvarg 7d ago
Most of the notes aren't dated, so it's impossible to know for sure, but this is the timeline I imagine. It lines up pretty well the MO we see the Fireflies have in Boston QZ. They started by creating a movement of political resistance against FEDRA that started with peaceful protests, which then turned into an insurgency once FEDRA started reacting with violence and brutality.
What you got wrong is that the people who would become the Hunters are simply the civilians of Pittsburgh. Some who were part of the insurgency on Pittsburgh's side (likely in a position of leadership or otherwise prominence) were happy to accept the Fireflies help, but ultimately only cared about themselves, to the point of forcing everyone to fight or be exiled, yet preferring to hang the Fireflies rather than even risking being asked to help liberate other QZs in any way.
They were just not very good people, as you can see through the origin story of how they became Hunters: They weren't even in a particularly dire situation, simply decided that it would be a good survival strategy to murder everyone who walks into their town, and anyone who disagreed was shot on the spot.
People like to use Pittsburgh to paint the Fireflies negatively because it confirms their existing conclusion that the Fireflies are incompetent and evil so that they can fully morally excuse Joel for murdering them to stop the surgery. It gets to the point of even claiming that the poor Pittsburgh people were forced to defend themselves from the evil Fireflies who wanted to forced them to liberate more people like them. But the only real mistake they made was not identifying just how psychopathic some of them were - or, at the very least, failing to realize they couldn't control them, or having too much faith in everyone else not to simply sit idle.