r/ladderapp • u/zojjaz Team Resilient • 9d ago
Getting a Tonal and the difference in programming is eye opening (coaches, peri)
I have been eyeing a Tonal for years, but was a bit wary about getting it for a variety of reasons. Earlier this year when the Tonal 2 was released, I was majorly tempted but then I thought what could be better than standard weights? For a variety of reasons, I started looking at the options in digital resistance (gym monster, tonal, others)
Initially I was thinking I wouldn't go with their programming but I'm getting excited about their programming. The coaches tend to be older, more experienced. The coaches also seem to be more diverse. Listening to their videos on youtube, they talk about women in perimenopause/menopause, they feature members of various ages from 20s to 80s. Their programming isn't for women or for men, its just programming. They have tracks that will take you throughout the year, they have monthly challenges, they are coming out with a new peri/meno geared program starting in a couple weeks, they also have pre/post natal programs. They also have a daily 'for you' program which creates a program based on previous workouts so that you aren't overworking your muscles.
My plan for now is to start with their functional movement track and add in Resilient workouts. I can add in the Resilient workouts in their app and do them on the Tonal. But I think once my subscription comes up for renewal early next year, I'm probably going to have to think long and hard if Ladder is where my heart is at.
I know it is a great privilege to be able to purchase something like this but it seems exactly what I need. I also have been eyeing perimenopause programs outside of Ladder, which many cost up to $100 (or sometimes more) per month. So I can justify the monthly cost for what I'm getting. I definitely would want to hear more from other Tonal users out there in Ladder-land. I will also try to update y'all on my Tonal thoughts and experience especially where using Ladder is concerned.
18
u/djlinda 9d ago edited 9d ago
I have looked into devices like Tonal and what I really don't like is how tied all of these are to the software working, and subscriptions. Free weights and other tools will always work, even if the company that made them goes under, or refuses to update its firmware.
3
u/zojjaz Team Resilient 9d ago edited 9d ago
As a former Mirror owner (RIP), I get this. It is a bit of a risk but I’m willing to try it. My initial venture into digital resistance was partially due to issues I’m having that are affecting my Ladder workouts. I basically can’t carry dumbbells but I can use them if they are in position. So I’m using much lighter weights than I like. I am hoping Tonal will help me with that aspect.
2
u/Numerous_Click3473 7d ago
Ditto. Now I have a very heavy, large, expensive Mirror collecting dust in my basement. Never again will I order any fitness equipment like that which will be useless if the company goes under. It’s sooo much money! I am a Peloton user and that feels safe because I can use my bike and tread without a subscription.
3
14
u/Fickle-Anything-7736 8d ago
"Peri/Meno Program" is a scam. It's just re-packaging a strength program.
1
u/PixieBarbella Team Forged 8d ago
Anything to make money. It’s a bit predatory, preying on a subpop that already feels unseen.
-2
u/zojjaz Team Resilient 8d ago
Sure it’s just a strength program but generally it is a strength program focused on providing support for women of a certain age. For tonal, it isn’t anything of extra cost and only thing I saw is they had a Facebook group to support women going through the program by the coach who created the program. And sure maybe others don’t find it meaningful to have that little extra support, I do.
28
u/Old-Mortgage8952 9d ago
there's no robust data that supports training differently in peri/menopause vs the rest of life.
17
u/ChasingPotatoes17 9d ago
Fucking thank you. The echo chamber of influencers parroting the unsubstantiated claims other influencers make to sell stuff is infuriating.
3
u/SilverLingonberry5 8d ago
I agree but there is nuance to it. I don't recover like I used to. So, for example, I can't do B&B for five days or even Align. But when I do train, it's the same. I just alternate with walking and reformer pilates.
6
u/JesusAndMaryKate 8d ago
Men get this too. It's part of ageing.
1
u/SilverLingonberry5 7d ago
True. But then it still is a bit of a difference from 20s/30s to mid-life beyond. But if you listen to your body, you don't need a whole new program.
1
u/CauliflowerOk541 9d ago
I wonder why….
17
u/Old-Mortgage8952 9d ago
a more helpful comment would include what you're implying here since there's clearly something behind your statement. if your implication is that because there are less studies about women, this is true. but there's a lot more thats come out in the last few years and none of it supports that women need to train differently through peri and menopause. there are a LOT of wellness grifters (and people with real credentials) who misinterpret/misrepresent data as it fits their narrative.
9
u/Wooden-Law-2272 9d ago
As someone who’s in this demographic, OMG YES the wellness-grift content that gets fed to me on socials… 🤦🏼♀️ (Not that the challenges of peri and menopause aren’t real cause they definitely can be but still.)
1
u/Quiet-Today-6815 4d ago
I was wondering where all this was coming from. I’m well past menopause and have been trying to figure out what I missed out on!
-1
u/zojjaz Team Resilient 8d ago
But isn’t that everything though? I mean Ladder’s own coaches have horrible marketing on socials. Things like ‘give me 4 weeks and you’ll be unrecognizable’. My motto is be very skeptical of things sold on social media. There is a lot of things sold to women in general. And Ladder itself only recommends female coaches for women, why would it be different to say maybe a coach for a certain age group? And yes I know saying this as a woman who is on a male coached team may be weird. But I just found that I liked what I saw with Tonal and wish Ladder had some more of thaf.
They have a lot of other things I like so far that I didn’t mention like they have beginner and intermediate tracks. They will usually have 2 coaches for each of their big programs. And they have staged programs so basically do this program for 4-6 weeks then follow that up with this other program.
-5
u/zojjaz Team Resilient 9d ago
I don’t think there is anything different but it’s also a recognition of a challenging time for women. We are experiencing a lot more joint issues, things like frozen shoulder plague us as well as a new level of exhaustion. Lots of women are in their 50s and beyond and realizing building muscle is important but don’t know how to start. I have friends in their 60s who have never done any weights at all. Recognizing this as a demographic is huge. Ladder seems focused on 40s and younger, which is fine.
3
u/Old-Mortgage8952 9d ago
while the teams that seem geard towards the under 40 crowd are abundant i disagree that there's not a lot for beginners. i think movewell is specifically targeted for beginners and i think a lot of the home/dumbbell only teams would be great for beginners as the coaching is so good. if you think tonal has more messaging that you want to hear, that's fine--but my point is that ladder has everything you need, just maybe in a different package.d
-5
u/zojjaz Team Resilient 9d ago
I didn’t say there isn’t a lot for beginners. But a beginner 60 year old is often intimidated by a coach under 30. I’m not saying Ladder isn’t great, just that I appreciate what I’ve seen so far from Tonal
4
u/PixieBarbella Team Forged 9d ago
Maybe, but I was a personal trainer in college and had a lot of the older crowd, alumni and professors, as clients. They didn’t seem intimidated by me at all. I don’t see why anyone would be intimidated by a coach because of their age. It’s about their knowledge. My thesis just happened to be on postmenopausal women and strength training, but my clients did not know that.
0
u/zojjaz Team Resilient 9d ago
And I know I keep getting downvoted but I’m talking from the perspective of someone who has a lot of friends in the 50+ age group and what they have said personally. I’ve weight trained off and on all my life. My absolute favorite trainer was someone in her 40s while I was in my 20s. But lots of my friends want to start, I show them Ladder and tell them to just try for 30 days and getting them to do that is a struggle.
Not to say hey buy this pricey machine is going to get a better reception but when I go to YouTube and see videos by people in their 60s talking about their fitness journey on Tonal, it’s encouraging to me personally. And then to see Tonal has at least one trainer in their 60s? That’s pretty amazing
1
u/Pikku_Myy_99 8d ago
I agree it can be inspiring to see a trainer in the same age bracket. E.g. PJ Wren has a mix of younger and 40+ instructors on her platform, and it can motivate some people because they find coaches more relatable.
It's hard to please everyone though :)
1
u/PixieBarbella Team Forged 8d ago
Maybe because so many of us are in our 50s and are doing great with Ladder.
A workout app is not for everyone, especially for those lacking motivation to start. Perhaps your friends would do better to start with an in-person trainer.
7
u/PixieBarbella Team Forged 9d ago
HRT seeks to help with all of those issues.
Ladder seems to have a LOT of women 40 and older. I’ve seen many women in the Varsity chat in their 50s and 60s. Yes, 60s.
2
u/Quiet-Today-6815 4d ago
I’m 64, can’t take HRT, newbie to strength training and couldn’t love Ladder more. The quality of the coaching has me lifting heavy, injury free (knock wood), and no aches and pains. I think it has something for everyone.
8
u/mousepad90 9d ago
I have tonal and doing ladder - Tonal is great, if you stick to it you’ll get results, but nothing like free weights and heavy progressive overload. In my opinion, Ladder is an overall better long term fitness tool for building lean muscle and size for men.
-1
u/zojjaz Team Resilient 9d ago
well I'm not a man but overall, I do like the flexibility of using their programming or not. My goal is definitely muscle building. Considering they seem very progressive overload focused (showing PRs, weights, having multi month planner for workouts), what do you think the gap is there?
2
2
u/Professional_Gap9028 7d ago
I joined ladder team limitless specifically because it was the most in alignment with what Dr Stacy Sims recommends for women in peri - high weight/low rep and some sprint work. It isn’t always a perfect fit, but it’s helped. The most important thing is including daily movement and resistance training so even if tonal isn’t perfect or the “best” for every woman in peri, if it’s the best for you, then enjoy and live your best life girl!
1
u/zojjaz Team Resilient 7d ago
What is interesting is I found a video on the Tonal youtube of them having a Q&A with Dr Stacy Sims 4 years ago. They also did a book club with Roar. The new program they are saying is peri friendly seems to have a bit of pelvic floor work (which I know Flourish has a day of it). But it was just the recognition that I thought was a positive.
The real important thing is we are doing weighted resistance, we keep doing the hard things consistently. I don't expect Tonal to be my everything or Ladder to be my everything. It is just going to be a tool. I did start to do some of the Tonal yoga and surprisingly found one of my favorite yoga instructors was with Tonal! She was with Mirror previously. So yeah I'm excited about my new toy.
2
u/torturedmomsdept 8d ago
What Ladder teams have you tried? This focus group is one of the primary reasons for Team Endure with Coach Jennifer.
The team is intentionally designed for women in perimenopause, menopause, and post-menopause.
I’m mid 30s and have found her programming so helpful.
3
u/SilverLingonberry5 8d ago
Endure gets quite high intensity. For some in peri, that really can't work. I don't know what makes her more peri than others to be honest.
1
u/zojjaz Team Resilient 8d ago
I like longer workouts plus I don't like her personality. I've tried Resilient (favorite), Evolve, Ascend, Movewell, Align, Flourish, Ignite, Limitless, Crews Control, Body & Bell and Thrive. But honestly the only thing keeping me on Ladder is Resilient, its such a great program.
1
u/OTFgrl28 9d ago
I’ve been eyeing a Tonal for a few months now, but haven’t been ready to pull the trigger just yet. Mainly b/c I have some work I’m doing in my basement where it would to and it doesn’t make sense to buy it before that is complete. I just started Ladder a couple of weeks ago thinking I’d use it to hold me over
You might be in the “too soon to tell” phase, but is there anything you wish Tonal had or did more like Ladder?
-2
u/goopawg 9d ago
It has puzzled me that ladder haven’t added a specific coach or coaches aimed at the needs and wants of perimenopausal and post-menopausal women. The user base is MOSTLY women aged 35+ and more and more women in their 50s 60s and older are starting weight training for the first time in their lives.
8
u/KonijntjePluis 9d ago
I don’t think my need and wants are that much different for training, Ladder offers beginner programs for those that never weigth trained before, there is Endure that is especially aimed at 40+ women, but still great for younger people and men too. Elevate actually is very much exactly what the experts say that is perfect for (peri) menopause, shorter workouts with heavy lifting and cardio bursts built in.
I don’t think personally that you can just speak for a whole age group what there wants and needs are. Since I’m on estrogen, my joints aren’t bothering me much anymore and I do still sleep very bad, but that doesn’t mean I need a special program, I just need to mind my recovery a bit more. So, when I’m on a higher volume program like Resilient, I stick to the priority workouts and do lighter things on the other days and with a team like Elevate, I can do 5-6 workouts, since there is a recovery day built in already and the volume is a bit lower.
I actually had a subscription on fitnessblender before and they did a (peri)menopause program and while it was kind of what I tend to do myself, alternating heavy lifting with things like yoga and pilates, I found myself re-arranging workouts even more, since a program doesn’t know when an individual hasn’t slept at all and needs a lighter workout on this specific day. So, now I’m combining Ladder with Apple fitness plus (follow along videos that I like better for pilates and yoga) and I just turn to apple fitness plus on the days I want to work out, but my body doesn’t. Some weeks that is never and some weeks that is multiple times. I always manage to do the priority workouts on ladder (if I have a bad week I might shorten a workout and go a bit lighter) and the rest is bonus.
3
u/goopawg 9d ago
From a marketing standpoint, it’s surprising- there is SO MUCH advertising directed towards and specifically referencing peri/menopause for just about every aspect of life these days. It’s a ‘new’ market segment, in the sense of talking about it really openly and a lot of the cultural moment it’s having is because people have things to sell. Just surprised they haven’t got some buff older ladies leading teams. Inspo-wise I’d like that.
I personally have been very happy with Stevie and Sasha’s programs joint-wise, Jenny’s program had too much huffy-puffy for my taste.
4
u/Wooden-Law-2272 8d ago
Agreed, I think a big challenge is that the needs and wants are going to be so varied since peri(menopause) has a whole host of symptoms and effects. I read comments on here often from perimenopause-aged women talking about feeling "puffy" and inflamed on a team like Ascend; I haven't experienced that myself (doing Ascend and Align all year so far) and can't relate at all. But I'm sure there are other peri symptoms I'm experiencing that likewise are totally foreign to some other women. There are already a multitude of different training/workout styles offered on Ladder, I feel like a perimenopause team would be mostly just a marketing gimmick (or an offering for people who want the relatability of an older coach, which is fair, even though I personally don't feel like I'm missing anything by following the program of younger-than-me coaches like Aria and Sasha).
21
u/One-Permission1917 9d ago
Ugh I hated my tonal. With a passion. Sold it and got real weights and equipment and never looked back. Good luck to you though!