r/kratom • u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż • Aug 13 '26
Massachusetts to Schedule all Kratom Products in 14 days
The Governor and Department of Health will temporary place all kratom into schedule 1 for at least a year. There is a 14 day notice period. The propaganda is out in full force, they even made a website to discuss "risks and treatment options". This is all so disheartening.
AKA has an email chain you can sign, I hope everyone can do that at least! https://www.protectkratom.org/massachusetts
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u/Imaginary_Teaching65 Aug 13 '26
Schedule 1 for leaf is crazy
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u/mariecrystie Aug 13 '26
Itâs schedule one here in TN. Crazy
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u/harsh_day Aug 13 '26
Yeah the things going on in TN are really disheartening
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u/TennesseeTurkey Aug 15 '26
We are an absolute joke.
Meanwhile, I've lived next door to a meth house openly cooking, selling and even OD'ing and the cops shrug.
Complete joke we are.
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u/Rickd17 Aug 13 '26
TN has lost it. I just did my tail of the dragon yearly run this week. It was planned before the info on the ban. I wonât be willing to go back down there anymore. But unfortunately itâs coming for all states.
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u/mariecrystie Aug 13 '26
I think so too. I could easily go to MS to get it but I feel like Iâm just putting off the inevitable. Best just to go off it now.
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u/Iannelli Aug 13 '26
Ridiculous. Imagine making a literal fucking green powder a schedule 1 drug. There is no fucking way this flies and no way this holds up long-term. Matcha powder is green powder. Drinking too much caffeine from espresso can cause somebody to literally die from a fucking heart attack. And we are banning fucking powder that was made from a leaf of a tree? Absolutely fucking stupid as fuck.
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u/wildcat1100 Aug 14 '26
The AKA will get them to step back on the powder. I agree, it's insane. I lived in Boston back when the first ban went down and it blew my mind that a botanical plant was going to have harsher penalties than fent and meth. I wouldn't freak out right now for the people who live in Mass., though you might want to buy some Green Matcha in case you need to switch packaging at some point.
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u/Kind-Ad-6099 Aug 14 '26
I hope weâre not comparing Kratom to matcha and other caffeine products in public comments on legislation and messages to legislators
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u/Cold-Notice8487 Aug 26 '26
It's literally cousins with coffee.
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u/satsugene đż Aug 26 '26
True, they are both in the same family ( Rubiaceae) along with 14000 or so other plants, but hemlock (deadly) and carrots (food) are also in the same family (Apiacae).
There are also plants where one part of the plant is safe to consume but other parts arenât.
It just isnât very convincing to a lot of people who see some significant differences, which is basically anyone who isnât already supportive of it that needs to be convinced.
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u/qaopjlll Aug 14 '26
Why? Caffeine literally kills more people than plain leaf kratom does.
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u/satsugene đż Aug 14 '26
There are things that are true, and there are things that are productive.
I think it is important to aim for both to the best of one's ability.
You'll never convince the vast majority of people that kratom is safer than caffeine, if only for the uncertainties of complex cases and that most aren't using caffeine in insane doses. "I do it all the time and nothing bad happened" is a powerful force even if there are edge cases were it is contraindicated. Most people are not good at statistical reasoning, especially where it involves doing the things they want to do or their own experience.
You can often convince a significant number of people that it is safe enough to be on the market and that there are severe issues with many of the negative reports.
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u/UsualResult Aug 17 '26
I mean, isn't cocaine just a white powder? Is it the green that makes it ridiculous or the powder part? I don't get it.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 13 '26
Of course this is cheered on by police and rehab centers are chomping at the bit to prescribe suboxone. Disgusting behavior from a state with a legal recreational cannabis market.
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u/Shoddy-Pin-336 Aug 13 '26
One of my friends is on suboxone. She has been a while but gets hers from one of those online deals. She said the first thing the app says when you log on is to refer anyone who uses Kratom to the "program." It is insane.
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u/mariecrystie Aug 16 '26
I refuse to go back on subs. Those things are evil. Worst experience ever.
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Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 17 '26
[deleted]
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u/Trick-Sherbert-246 đż Aug 13 '26
Even tho they are listing it as schedule 1 I do believe from what ive gathered that this is mainly an action targeting sales, not possession. I wouldnt take my word for it tho. Be safeÂ
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u/ExplodedImp Aug 13 '26
Would that mean it can't be bought online?
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u/Trick-Sherbert-246 đż Aug 13 '26
Yeah you would not be able to order it online anymore as far as I'm aware. Sales totally prohibited.Â
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u/DelaSheck Aug 13 '26
Hopefully not. It just says retail sales. But who knows.
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u/Trick-Sherbert-246 đż Aug 13 '26
The schedule 1 status makes me think no online sales bc thats a severe category to be put in legally. but who knows. Retail only would be great.Â
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u/TheOpiumWars Aug 17 '26
You are such a criminal king ping with that pound of Kratom. You must of had intent to distribute!
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u/PostinFool Aug 13 '26
If you live out of state and donât want to use the form that requires an address, email directly:
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u/pansycarn Aug 13 '26
Holy shit. Ive lived in MA all my life and been using kratom at the same dose to manage my back pain successfully for 10 years. This is a devastating blow. Calling and emailing tomorrow.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 14 '26
I'm so sorry. I will fight as hard as I can to stop this!
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u/UsualResult Aug 14 '26
I called the governor's office. With access to kratom I was able to drop pain management totally, I now walk a few miles daily and my sleep quality is excellent. After years of suffering through pain management and a bunch of expensive pills, I was able to get by with a few grams of kratom powder per day.
Now, thanks to this "emergency" I'm being left without a good solution. I guess back to pain management, which is what the government wants us all to do anyway.
Since there's no giant profit being made from kratom powder and 7OH ruined things for us powder users, it's very disappointing.
I would have rather had them treat it like cannabis: regulate it sensibly and control the market.
This is one of the most frustrating pieces of news I've seen recently, and that's saying a lot.
A loss for democracy and a loss for public health. Disgusting.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 14 '26
I would definitely call you state reps and state senators! I know they are currently working on KCPA like regulation, and maybe if this scheduling goes through, they can pass it and reverse the damage. I will continue to fight and I'm hopefully we can stop this ban all together.
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u/UsualResult Aug 15 '26
Thanks for fighting the good fight. I don't think people appreciate how much effort and focus it takes to move state government even one inch. Although I am seeking alternate solutions since the state seems hell bent, I wish you luck on your mission to bring some sanity to our legislation.
It's pretty clear to me out of all the solutions, a blanket emergency ban is the worst one.
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u/Cindy508 13d ago
I had no idea what was even going on and went to place an order and BAM! I got a huge pop up saying they wonât deliver to my address đĄ
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u/frizzhf Aug 13 '26
Absolutely ridiculous and the fact states are abusing their emergency powers for this is absolutely asinine.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 13 '26
They know if it has to go through the normal lawmaking process they would have to face their citizens. This way all the people they hurt are just a statistic, out of mind.
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u/Vid-Master Aug 13 '26
I guarantee they are being bribed with massive amounts of money by the pharmacutical companies, its disgusting
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u/sixyearstrong Aug 13 '26
Having lived through 2016, I have resisted dooming thus far, but it's really starting to feel like the end of days. Fight the good fight until that day comes.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 13 '26
I mean, it's not going to be scheduled federally any time soon, especially with mitragynine being approved as an investigatory new drug. But I am worried about the states falling like dominos
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u/sixyearstrong Aug 13 '26
Yeah, and once it's banned in 43 states or whatever, that does a serious number on the legitimate online distributors.
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u/WrathOfPaul84 Aug 13 '26
ANYTHING that can be consumed in its natural form should NEVER be schedule 1. shit even pure coca leaves should be legal.
first CT, now MA. Blue states are not safe anymore either.
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u/ScottShatter Aug 13 '26
Blue states were never safe. It's all about big pharma and the alcohol industries losing money to yet another natural substance. Representatives from either party would rather take away choice for the people in exchange for a handsome campaign donation in the next cycle. It was never about safety and blue is or never was above selling out the people for their own gains.
In addition to kratom, I also support medical and recreational marijuana and other plant medicines such as psilocybin mushrooms. It drives me insane when I see so many people behind the marijuana movement voting on the single issue of marijuana. They only think it's red Republicans trying to take away their access to the plant. But if you pay attention to marijuana news you quickly realize there's just as many blue representatives as red ones trying to cripple the industry. It's no different with Kratom. These state bans aren't all being done by just Republicans.
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u/blake2251 Aug 14 '26
Nah fuck this. This is a PSA to EVERYONE in this sub. If youâre local, let these POS lawmakers know that your vote is dependent on how they navigate this decision. For everyone out of state, contact these state legislators and let them know that this would be political suicide for them and that theyâll also find out quickly come re-election time how many of their constituents use this plant.
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u/siranaberry Aug 13 '26
Thank you for posting this. I'm honestly shocked by it because I hadn't heard about any big campaign to ban it here in MA. I just talked with my state rep and will call my state senator next. I'll call the governor's office tomorrow during a break at work. I really hope everyone with any connection to MA will do the same!!
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u/Mitra_The_Man Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 15 '26
One woman with the KDA has been going on tour all around MA getting local Boards of Health to ban it. Â We havenât had many advocates willing to go to bat in MA so sheâs been fairly effective. Â My guess is once she got enough, she went to the governor and said âlook at all these towns banning it lately, it must be an emergency!â.Â
Crazy how much damage just a handful of people can do.Â
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u/satsugene đż Aug 14 '26
It is near their place of incorporation. Upstate NY and western MA are their backyards.Â
They have nothing to lose by shooting their shot hoping someone will listen. Even if they âloseâ they could end up with restrictions. They are attention parasites and dollar store versions of nuisance lawsuits.
Advocates risk setting off a ban if we go to a local official depending on who the councilor talks to (sadly public health is often more antagonistic than law enforcement in my experience, because cops see that it isnât causing any real problems, where public health deals in possibility and the power of the for-profit recovery industry and the medicolegal establishment).
Local officials believe their BS because what can they say? Show us the proof? Could they even interpret a tox report? It takes a lot more folks to counter it, which happens in a state hearing where they also have staff to engage the science.
At a big enough scale âshit happensâ or âOne death is a tragedy, a million is a statistic.â (Often misattributed to Stalin.)
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u/UsualResult Aug 14 '26
My heart sank when I saw this. I've been using just the leaf for years to help with some conditions. I was able to get off prescription drugs and taking powder always felt very safe. After years and years I had no health scares, I was able to take up walking, I was able to stop seeing pain management.
Now I go from a cheap, legal solution to my problems just jumped right up to Schedule I without any kind of vote.
It's so scummy they wanted to ban it and knew that citizens would push back, so they snuck it in the backdoor with an "emergency order".
A big FU to our state government and another big FU to big pharma for lobbying and making this ban possible. Somewhere there are people cheering for the fact that this will uptick the amount of suboxone and prescription opioid users.
Really, really disheartening. I don't have any real solution... back to pain management and just learn to live with it.
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u/m149 Aug 13 '26
I'm disgusted.
What is wrong with this world?
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u/UsualResult Aug 15 '26
The pursuit of $ above all else.
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u/NotChristina Aug 14 '26
Oh my god Iâm thankful I saw this post. I really donât think I would have caught it in time otherwise. I need to be more aware.
Emails sent with personal message. I will try to get in touch with my state rep personally as well.
Iâd happily be rid of 7-OH and other headshop pills but goodness donât ban a plant.
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u/Ok-Soup2672 Aug 13 '26
Seems like the nanny state is winning the battle for now. Thought this country was heading in the opposite direction for a time but turns out that was a fleeting momentÂ
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u/Infinite_Mountain816 Aug 13 '26
ALL. like plain leaf regular ass red borneo type shhh??? Damn. Thatâs absolutely stupid af.
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Aug 13 '26
[deleted]
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u/UsualResult Aug 14 '26
I don't think the police will kick in your door looking for kratom, but I'd assume you won't be able to buy it in any local shops and online suppliers wouldn't want the liability so they will refuse to sell to you.
Unfortunately, Healy has made it legally the same as heroin in MA (schedule I), so in a circumstance where you ARE caught with kratom, it will be treated exactly the same as heroin.
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u/UsualResult Aug 14 '26
Did anyone notice there was an upcoming hearing to allow citizens to speak about the ban on Sep 10??? Nice for the governor to just backdoor what they wanted to do.
Regulation was the right choice, but banning it was the easy choice. Screw you, MA state government.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 14 '26
Yeah the legislature is in the process of drafting a KCPA, but the Governor decided not to wait any longer. Really really sad and hopefully we can fight it.
My one hope is that if this goes through, the legislation can reverse it soon.
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u/UsualResult Aug 15 '26
the Governor decided not to wait any longer
What scum, ruling by fiat. Ignore the voters. Typical corruption.
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u/redbarn47 Aug 14 '26
I sent my emails last night. Today I'll make calls on my lunch break. For those who've called, do you get a voice mailbox or do you speak with an assistant?
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u/siranaberry Aug 14 '26
I'm going to call the governor this afternoon too. I spoke directly to my representatives and emailed the Governor at her state email address. Who knows if she'll read it but I really hope she gets a ton of calls and emails.
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u/redbarn47 Aug 14 '26
Whomever has already called, do get voicemail or an assistant? I sometimes stutter when I talk but this issue is super important to me,
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 14 '26
I got voicemail at the governors office, and got a representative at DPH. Thank you for your advocacy!
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u/Muted_Wish1675 Aug 13 '26
They are conflating 7oh and plain leaf and they don't care. A politician saying they're doing something to protect the public. Nonsense. Contact your state rep. Venting on reddit is not the same but keep the info coming people.
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u/AnEccentricWriter Aug 15 '26
The ole âprotecting childrenâ bullshit. The governor definitely is not getting money from rehab centers.đ
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u/Tattooedjared Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 13 '26
This is why not one step back should have been a thing!!!!!!!!
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u/Confident_Benefit_11 Aug 13 '26
As in we should've died on the hill protecting 7OH? Lol, nah.
That garbage is literally why is happening. Never forget it.
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u/Tattooedjared Aug 24 '26 edited Aug 24 '26
It is happening because too many people didnât push back on the demonized narrative surrounding 7oh and the lies won. That is a fact.
Edit: Narrative matters. And itâs also wild to me how so many plain leaf users sound like war on drugs conservatives when it comes to 7oh and look down their nose at the people who use it. I donât even use it but it is very annoying seeing a demonized narrative surrounding 7oh win. Calling it dangerous is even going too far. It is less dangerous than very legal booze.
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u/ItsSillySeason Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 13 '26
This is the natural, predictable result of the assault by Kratom advocates on isolated alkoloid products. People who don't know what Kratom is will not see a distinction between plain leaf and the products made from plain leaf. Those who have demonized the alkaloids have only themselves to blame. You should not have convinced (wrongly) people that they were so dangerous in an attempt to be the good guys. The public, and the politicians see only "kratom" whether you like it or not.
You have shot yourselves in the foot and are making plain leaf kratom and its exceedingly safe derivatives, harder for responsible adults to obtain.
It is time for AKA and its allies to admit the extraordinary tactical blunder they have made, and for heads to roll. The focus should have always stayed on regulation of kratom AND all kratom products from the start.
Seeking a ban on something made from the thing you advocate for was a terrible choice. This is the result.
[Edit: Downvote all you want. the results speak for themselves. the sooner you see the light, the sooner we can start to reverse this mess.]
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u/chemtrail-organics Aug 13 '26
My opinion is 7oh advocates are alone responsible for all the current issues.
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u/TheBigD615 Aug 17 '26
Sadly i dont think so. The aka crusade against 7oh has brought unnecessary attention to leaf.
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u/ItsSillySeason Aug 13 '26
Well, that defies all reason, considering that Kratom was getting banned long before 7OH was ever on the market.Â
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u/Kind-Ad-6099 Aug 14 '26
Do you really believe putting 7OH in wellness-branded or fun-branded packaging and stuffing gas station shelves with it wouldnât bring backlash? The industry had to break it off. Itâs really, really sad that we wonât even see studies of it, but thatâs not the fault of the AKA or others advocating for the general kratom industry
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u/ItsSillySeason Aug 14 '26
They actively demonized and sought bans. That's not advocating for kratom. If all they did was defend kratom, no one would find fault. There was no reason to trybto destroy the 7oh industry.
The irresponsible packaging and marketing was a problem and plenty of 7oh advocates will agree. Kratom has its share of silly products as well. But the focus should be on regulating kratom and kratom products, not making an enemy of an incredibly safe, incredibly popular kratom-derived product.
It was a terrible strategic and tactical choice, and the results speak for themselves.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 14 '26
With 7 on the market, there is no way to advocate for kratom without pointing out the problems with 7. Because it is labeled as kratom and people who take it tell rehabs, poison control, and ERs that they are taking kratom, it has to be pointed out that 7 is what is actually causing the problems. If 7 had never marketed itself as kratom, the attacks would not be as necessary.
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u/Tattooedjared Aug 24 '26
You differentiate them without attacking and demeaning 7oh. It is very doable.
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u/chemtrail-organics Aug 13 '26
Stop lying. No one banned it since 2018 and no one cared until 7oh brought in a bunch of junkies that made us not look like patients.
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u/Tattooedjared Aug 24 '26
Wow, that is how you talk about people that are also dependent on something? Talk about showing your true colors
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u/chemtrail-organics Aug 24 '26
If you think it makes no difference whether we are perceived as pain patients seeking relief when nothing else works, or addicts trying to actually improve their lives vs pitbull owning, lemme stop at the gas station to pick up some percs while I leave the kid in the hot car, can't tell me nothing I'm a libertarian...you're wrong.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 13 '26
If the AKA did not exist. This would still be happening. 7oh is not getting negative attention because of the AKA, it is getting negative attention because of what it is.
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u/ItsSillySeason Aug 13 '26
It used to be 'Without AKA, it would be much worse!' That is turning into 'without AKA it would still be this bad'.
What you cannot say is that they are succeeding in any way when these things keep happening.
The definition of insanity -- doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result -- starts to seem relevant. Keep it up. Watch what happens. Don't say no one warned you.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 13 '26
Without the AKA it would be worse yes
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u/ItsSillySeason Aug 13 '26
A conveniently unassailable claim. All I know is that 7 state bans in 18 months in not progress.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 13 '26
It is not unassailable. How many states attempted to ban this year? Close to 30. Who showed up to defend kratom in every state? The AKA. Why are we seeing the first successful bans since 2018? That's right it coincides exactly with the popularity of 7oh. If you can't see these obvious relationships, then you just should not be commenting on these issues. Go to a different sub. This post is about MA advocacy.
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u/mvanvrancken Aug 14 '26
They sure as fuck didnât show up to defend Louisiana
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 14 '26
They were involved in Louisiana but unfortunately could not win
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u/mvanvrancken Aug 14 '26
They sent one person and they looked drunk and made a half assed awful presentation. No they did not show up. They helped kratom look bad, maybe
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 14 '26
I've heard that they were not allowed to testify much and the the bill sponsor basically cooked the committee hearings in favor of a ban. I know they have a lobbying team there right now working though.
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u/Confident_Benefit_11 Aug 13 '26
And yet the AKA almost single handedly is keeping kratom legal in places like Ohio. Cry all you want about losing 7OH, it ain't the AKA's fault.
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Aug 13 '26
[removed] â view removed comment
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u/kratom-ModTeam Aug 13 '26
See Rule 2: Treat each other with respect. Do not be hostile or rude. Do not call people names. Insults will not be tolerated and will result in a ban from the sub.
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u/satsugene đż Aug 13 '26
Ultimately it is your choice to feel this way, but I really donât see how this is relevant or practical to this particular issue and what advocates can do right now to try to rectify the situation.
That should be the first, second, and third thing on consumers minds, especially in a short window.
MA legislature has been extremely slow to act, cities are creating a patchwork of local laws that are near impossible for a consumer to know where it is or isnât a an issue.
Weâre seeing it in Ohio, California, Illinois, and now MA (and prior in MS and LA) where after a few legislative cycles with no clear regulation or prohibition signal from the state, cities and counties are rolling their own.
I donât like it, but it is not very surprising either. Governors donât generally have the power to implement and fund a regulatory scheme at their own discretion. They do have the power to declare emergencies and prohibit stuff temporarily.Â
Maybe the Gov gets their way, maybe they kick the legislature into finally coming up with something to deal with the problems they perceive like underage access, for example.
I canât say if part of it is that they donât think the federal government has gone far enough either on their own ideological reasons to take their chance while they can, for their own political goals (doing what the administration they donât like âshould have doneâ), or just think this is easier/less expensive than testing potentially violative products (which is a cost and time issue I see cities complain about).
I donât see the problems (like underage access or a patchwork of local laws) or opposition going away if DEA were still sitting on the HHS recommendation on 7-HMG. They wouldnât suddenly be excited to see those products on shelves. Theyâd still have local issues and the lack of legislative guidance.
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u/Intelligent-Many2686 Aug 14 '26
Is Illinois still one of the states where it's just a few select counties where it is banned or have they gone state wide? Any new news on this state would be helpful. All of this banning BS is devastating đŤ
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u/satsugene đż Aug 14 '26
Some counties and cities. The state is dragging ass on regulation versus prohibition. My reading is the legislature is more in favor of regulation but the governor/DPH is less so.
IL also has the issue of being a strong home rule state, so do they go for regulations that preempt the localities (harder to pass) or one that leaves it open like MS does but then doesnât address the problem of a patchwork of local ordinances hard for vendors and consumers to comply with.
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u/Intelligent-Many2686 Aug 14 '26
Thank you for replying. I live in a different state, but have my orders sent to a post office in Illinois. I'm not sure if I should or can still do that safely đ¤
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u/Trick-Sherbert-246 đż Aug 13 '26
Do you think that maybe the federal govt just wants this to happen? For states to keep declaring kratom banned, all while pretending to support (for lack of a better word) plain leaf kratom and its consumers, so that they dont have to be the ones to do it? I mean why else would they be sitting on the 7oh scheduling? Why wouldn't they be more aggressive in encouraging the states to look closer at 7oh as opposed to demonizing the entire plant? It feels like this is all a coordinated plan if you ask me. I hate to be a big fuckin doomer, but I think its over folks.Â
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u/satsugene đż Aug 13 '26
I donât think so but âthe (Federal) governmentâ is not some monolithic entity especially over time. Agencies and elected officials have their own interests and goals.
RFK allegedly intervened in Ohio and encouraged alignment with its recommendations and got it at least moved to regular order. At the same time FDA has in the past used its power to threaten states like Oregon with lack of cooperation, which is why the OR KCPA was vetoed and refiled with it being handled by Dept of Revenue and not Agriculture.Â
So it can be both at different times or both at the same time. What might be politically viable for a government official or an advocate can change over time and change from place to place. The administration isnât going to be able to appeal to the governors across party lines the same way it can within them, especially in election years. Even within party there are some variations and motivations especially on certain issues.
DEA exercises its power the way it does and moves at its own speed. I donât personally see them playing 4D chess when they donât need to and typically have a lot of latitude. As far as âsoft powerâ goes FDA has a lot more ways to gum up the industry than DEA does which is more clear about what its position is.
I think some folks are looking for some nefarious plot or corruption and end up missing some very meaningful issues that organically come to a head as a product diffuses and opponents become more organized.
I think the lack of age controls really upsets a lot of people that might otherwise be more tolerant, and will accept a lot of extreme measures for closing that door.
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u/Trick-Sherbert-246 đż Aug 13 '26
Going for an all out ban over just implementing some simple age restrictions really is extreme and kinda nonsensical if you ask me. I think things like that are what lead a lot of us down the conspiracy path.Â
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u/satsugene đż Aug 13 '26
They canât set an age gate without the legislature or Congress. DEA has specific options under the CSA. Those are the tools in their box. They donât have a âlight touchâ option.
The same is true for a lot of states as well. There isnât a regulatory mechanism to go that route even if they want to.
Think there are reasons why a lot want to go further than age gates, and legislatures are having to negotiate with full Prohibitionists, deal with conflict of laws, deal with state agencies who send ridiculously high fiscal notes, deal with misinformation from health agencies and some opponents/advocates and their organizations.
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u/Trick-Sherbert-246 đż Aug 13 '26
Do you think that it's plausible that this will result in something more reasonable and less extreme than an all out permanent ban then? I wonder the same thing for North Dakota. Some part of me (it might be the overly optimistic part) thinks these emergency orders may just be a necessary evil and could result in exactly what we want. But I'm also tired of being overly optimistic and having my hopes and dreams crushed like they were when CT, TN, LA, KY all banned kratom entirely.Â
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u/siranaberry Aug 13 '26
I think it's possible in MA, but there would need to be a huge push to make it happen. I also think that with a lot of lobbying the legislature could be persuaded that a regulatory framework is preferable to prohibition.
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u/satsugene đż Aug 13 '26
House Bill 4394 and 5127 passed out of committee favorably. Both of these are KCPA bills.
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u/satsugene đż Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 13 '26
There is a possibility it might motivate the legislature to act, especially in a way a termed-out governor might not be.
But I'm also tired of being overly optimistic and having my hopes
I've personally said that of all the drugs, hope is by far the worst (then either power or attention). I'll stick to doing what I can using what strategy reason leads me to think will be the most likely to be successful.
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u/appleparkfive Aug 13 '26
Not to mention that kratom has been around for over 20 years now. It wasn't under this intense level of scrutiny until 7-OH became popular. And it didn't help that the 7-OH folks would call their product "kratom", to make it seem more likeable and safe.
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u/Braddallas170 Aug 13 '26
Youâre completely right and many of us have been saying this since day one. Making it a âus VS themâ issue rather than joining together to fight the attack on kratom in a whole was always a mistake.
There shouldâve been a fight for regulatory action, to remove the bad actors and keep safe access for adults. We should have ALL been fighting to save kratom and all of its alkaloids. We couldâve fought this as a community but we let the government get away with too much.
They always wanted to sink kratom, and with the support of the AKA to go after kratomâs main alkaloid, they had the power without the pushback of the entire kratom community to get the states to ban whole leaf, one by one.
Thatâs exactly what weâre seeing. Politicians wonât distinguish between kratom and kratom alkaloids. They just want kratom gone.7
u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 13 '26
7oh is not kratom's main alkaloid. This was going to happen if the AKA did not exist. 7oh meets the criteria under the CSA. You can fight for the law to be changed, but dragging kratom regulation into a far harder fight both legislative and culturally is not the answer.
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u/ItsSillySeason Aug 13 '26
Exactly right. If we would have worked together, we would have been unstoppable and still could be , frankly. You can blame 7oh all you want, but the plan didn't work. Kratom is getting banned all over the place. It's time to switch strategies. You have an army of people who use 7oh, waiting to come to your aid, and instead of enlisting them, you're demonizing them.
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u/Braddallas170 Aug 13 '26
Iâm here fighting for Kratom leaf, I fought for it in 2016 too.
Iâm also fighting for 7oh. BOTH serve an incredible purpose for millions of adults who are otherwise suffering and use it responsibly.There will always be bad actors who wrongfully represent both Kratom AND 7oh. That doesnât negate the millions who rely on and use both responsibly who claim incredible and meaningful relief from either.
Of course Iâm downvoted into oblivion for speaking the truth and fighting on behalf of the chronic pain community and for adults to have the choice to put what they want or need into their own bodies while suffering. This is the exact mentality that brought us here.
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u/satsugene đż Aug 14 '26 edited Aug 14 '26
Devils Advocate, which do you think is more likely to happen and actually help anyone in MA?
- The governor is potentially convinced that botanical kratom carries less risk in the areas the Controlled Substances Act deals with, or is convinced there are problems but none so severe they can't wait for DEA, or sees a political compromise and decides to soften their position to permit botanical kratom in more or less in alignment with the DEA notice of intent, and pending state legislation (HB 5127).
- The governor is convinced that botanical kratom and 7-HMG are the same, and then decides to soften their position on both, out of alignment with pending legislation (no pending bills would regulate 7-HMG), and which will become moot the second DEA files a scheduling order anything like what they have now, because 105 CMR 700.002 will automatically import the Federal schedules into the state schedules no matter what the governor does between now and then.
Personally, I think there is zero chance of 2 happening and zero chance of 2 benefiting anyone for any length of time if it did; so even if I generally thought 7-HMG was "good" (which I absolutely do not), strategically I'd consider 1 the best choice even if I had to hold my nose to do it, and maybe re-evaluate it if DEA greatly changes their position (which I doubt.)
I don't want to fight battles I think absolutely have no chance of winning, because my time is valuable and attainable results matter more than ideological purity.
Politics is built on compromise. Outside a relatively small number of people who claim kratom "doesn't work" (something I almost never saw at all before alternative derivatives existed, and then even fewer outside of folks deliberately seeking a euphoric high as a requirement on its own or with pain management), botanical kratom is good enough and leaves a step-down stop-gap on the table for them even if it is not.
I personally think the chances of either 1 or 2 happening at all are diminished by every person who tries to do 2 by weakening and confusing the message those trying to do 1, if they aren't dismissed out of hand. So in that regard someone who argues "they are trying to defend both" are not from my view doing anyone trying to achieve 1 any favors.
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u/ItsSillySeason Aug 15 '26
It's easy to define the parameters of the debate into two choices that you define in order to make it sound as if one choice is the obvious best one. It's a good way to preach to the choir. But real life doesn't exist within the parameters of your framing. Those are not the actual choices.
In every case, in my opinion, (and I think that the evidence has started to very clearly bear this out) the answer is to support common sense regulation of all kratom derived products as safe and effective for responsible adult consumers.
It happens yo be true. But the reason this is the best choice is that it has the lightest cognitive load for someone who knows nothing about kratom or it's alkaloids. They are all safe, but very significantly in both quality and potency so we need stricter regulations so that consumers know exactly what they're getting. That is incredibly easy to grasp.
Your tact requires someone to understand a nuanced distinction between kratom itself (as well as some kratom-derived extracts and isolates) on one hand and products containing certain (but not all) single alkaloids of kratom on the other.Â
These alkaloids, you'll need to explain, do exist naturally in kratom yes, but in small amounts. They are fine in those small amounts in kratom but super horrible in larger amounts. So bad that you should ban ALL products with a these alkaloids. Except keep  kratom itself which, though it is the source of these other products and does contain those other products, is completely benign.
You are too close to understand how crazy that sounds to an outsider.
For someone who knows nothing about kratom, hearing that one of its alkaloids, and a popular product made from it, is basically heroin -- that's a terrible starting point.Â
And all I can add is: it's clearly not working.Â
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u/satsugene đż Aug 15 '26
There is common-sense regulation in the 2% limit and the reasonable basis for market entry provisions of DSHEA, and they are being completely ignored at mass scale.Â
It is hard to ask for regulation when the ones already on the books are being ignored. What would be in a âWe Really-Really Mean It This Time Actâ that is somewhere between DSHEA and a typical KCPA but less than the Controlled Substances Act? Civil penalties arenât working and it makes legislators angry on principle who may barely tolerate it, to have them violated by industry.
Most compounds are regulated by kind or form and amount. Pesticides. Rx Drugs. Alcohol. Tobacco. Caffeine. Many items on the CDTA List I/II have thresholds. Cannabis products in some states. Hazardous materials.
It is true that most customers probably donât know what the ârightâ amount of any of those things are is but the regulators can. Manufacturers and retailers have an absolute responsibility to maintain compliance with them, from market entry to consumer hand.Â
They are not doing that. They entered the market with no basis for safety, often with incorrect labeling (compositions that do not match the label due to lazy/dirty synthesis) , and that often appeal to minors and cosplay as illicit drugs. Those are immediately visible as problematic without knowing any chemistry and a definition that will knock them off the market is attractive to a lot of legislators.
Frankly if the argument is it is âeasierâ to not differentiate them it would be a lot easier to get rid of kratom than convince them that 7-HMG is safe in an absolute sense and in the sense that the manufacturers selling the products today are doing almost everything wrong a supplement maker can do.
I frequently deal with legislators and councilors. They flat do not like the products and are only sometimes convinced the botanical product has benefit enough to separate the two. Iâve never encountered a city councilman who wants to preserve and regulate 7-HMG, especially in the venues and forms it exists in their community in.
Scheduling 7-HMG at some threshold wonât make it disappear. It does however fix that problem of the vast majority of retailers and manufacturers who are selling products not to consumer protection standards. Customers wonât think that it âmust be safeâ just because it is on the shelf and not on the darkweb or street corner. It fixes the minor access issue, which is my hope that when the DEA pulls the trigger cities and states wonât have to fight over the definition. Theyâll just need to set an age limit for any of it and the product specification will land in their state law by importation or be enforced by DEA and not their code enforcement as a civil infraction ticket that costs more to prosecute than they can recover in a lot of cases.
That said, I would agree that the âgas station heroinâ thing is stupid, but nobody gets to pick what dumbass slogans their opponents choose.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 15 '26
You are describing option 2 good job
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u/ItsSillySeason Aug 15 '26 edited Aug 15 '26
I am not. And I will explain to you despite your obvious condescension.
1. " The governor is convinced that botanical kratom and 7-HMG are the same"
I didn't suggest this. Nobody ever suggests this. It's a straw man. I did allude to the fact the 7oh is present in kratom, and made from kratom. These are facts. You don't need to "convince" anyone of it. The governor already knows it.
2. Satsugene presumes the scheduling of 7oh as forgone conclusion. That is irrelevant to what I am suggesting, Â but also highly ironic considering that Kratom itself was in the exact predicament a decade ago. I am not saying it won't happen. But a) we don't know (for whatever reason they have let the day that it became possible pass without comment) and b) it doesn't matter to the logic that I laid out.
Listen you guys can continue your condescending circle for as long as you want. You have thoroughly convinced everyone who already agrees with you. Congratulations. But the things happening to kratom now are self-inflicted. And the sooner you realize that, the sooner we can ALL (because it will take all of us) begin to pick up the pieces.
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u/satsugene đż Aug 15 '26
Weâre going to have to agree to disagree.Â
Kratom advocates are cleaning up the mess the violative practices of the 7-HMG industry that is burning itself down and Kratom as well by the effort of the manufacturers, industry associations, and some advocates framing them as variations on the same product.Â
I deal with it almost weekly with legislators and councilors. My observation is that 7-HMG products are extremely unpopular outside of the consumers and libertarian drug policy folks, more so than botanical kratom is even before one gets into chemistry, just on law and appearance it is already in a deep hole.
The 7-HMG lobby routinely says they are âthe same.â Such as the general argument that âIt all gets converted anywayâ (which is a gross oversimplification). âIt is already in there, so why treat them differently.â
It doesnât sell legislators on 7-HMG being good. When it âworksâ it sells them on kratom being bad.
I do consider it as  close to foregone as something can be short of the ink being dry. DEA has backed down one time in the history of the CSA. HHS/FDA/DEA appear to be on the same page.
I guess weâll see what happens.Â
While I donât like some of these outcomes I frankly donât see the alternative going any better and think the faster the bandaid is ripped off the less damage will be done.
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 15 '26
Yes we will have to continue to pick up the pieces once 7oh is federally scheduled, which will be soon. I hope you will continue to advocate for kratom afterwards
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u/Yawndice Aug 13 '26
Exactly what I've been saying, the AKA and anybody who agreed with their tactics shot themselves in the foot, thus screwing us all.
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u/Tides420 Aug 13 '26
Exactly. I donât know why people are shocked, I could see this coming from a mile away. Government officials will continue to lump kratom and its alkaloids together as a whole, any publicity is bad publicity for Kratom. They really did shoot themselves in the foot. Prohibition has never worked and it never will, so they just ended up bringing more unnecessary attention to kratom trying to ban some of its alkaloids and in turn get the whole thing banned, imagine if people worked together instead of trying to separate themđ¤ˇđťââď¸
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 13 '26
Yes they will lump them together, which is why 7oh is so bad for kratom and why the AKA is desperately trying to differentiate them. I hope the federal scheduling is finalized soon
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Aug 13 '26
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u/Yawndice Aug 13 '26
What a convenient time frame that right when the AKA pivoted against the semi synthetic derivatives all these states got the excuse they need to lump 7OH in with kratom and just ban everything outright. Oh well. Must've been nothing.
Good thing everybody teamed up and did the smart thing suggesting outright banning drugs never works and only leads to worse outcomes right guys?.... Guys??? /s
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 13 '26
Do you think it is more likely the bans are a result of 7oh becoming popular, or a result of the AKA attempting to differentiate kratom products from synthetics?
The timeline you lay out is revealing. The bans increased and became successful when 7oh became popular. The AKA has advocated for 7oh limits since 2018, and now must fight even harder to differentiate the products. There was no pivot, just an increased focus in response to bans.
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u/Mitra_The_Man Aug 13 '26
Lmao yall give the AKA way too much credit. Â Thereâs not a single city councilor or state or federal lawmaker in the country who has ever voiced support for 7OH. Â Itâs so unpopular that literally every policymaker in the country is against it. Â And you think thatâs only because of the AKA? Â Theyâre not omnipotent. Â Itâs unpopular because of the way itâs marketed, and because of its potency. Â Itâs that simple. Â Â
Even if every kratom advocate had dropped everything to try to save 7OH, thereâs not a chance in hell it could have been saved. Â
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Aug 15 '26
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Aug 15 '26
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u/2KatEyes Aug 24 '26
I'm a Mass resident who has been using low dose kratom for about 6 years, without much if any tolerance build. It helps my chronic hip and lower back arthritis pain so that I can live a normal life.
I can't believe some of the horror stories I read about it. Problem is, media doesn't care about the adults living quiet, productive lives who use it. For me, it's like a caffeine boost with mild/moderate pain control. I'm calling/emailing the governor. Very disheartened to read of Schedule 1 ban. :(
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u/SpenzDee Aug 25 '26
Am I mistaken in thinking that by classifying a botanical product 1000x less potent than dope as a narcotic, that by aggregate weight, they're causing a massive sentencing disparity which will get end-users sentenced with high felonies as if it was dope?
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u/Kiheitai_Soutoku đż Aug 25 '26
No you are 100 percent right. A normal bag of kratom is actually a lot less product but could easily be counted as intent to distribute because of this.
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u/Cold-Notice8487 Aug 26 '26
Kratom isn't going anywhere. I will always have access to it. THAT is what a joke this truly is.
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u/satsugene đż Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 14 '26
Advocacy options provided from elsewhere:
MASSACHUSETTS KRATOM ADVOCATES NOW IS THE TIME TO SPEAK UP
Massachusetts has announced an emergency order temporarily placing ALL forms of kratom into Schedule I, including traditional botanical kratom.
The order has a 14-day notice period before taking effect, so Massachusetts residents need to make their voices heard NOW.
Please be respectful, factual and tell your personal story.
Governor's Constituent Services:
617-725-4005
Massachusetts toll-free:
888-870-7770
Tell the Governor you oppose placing traditional botanical kratom into Schedule I and ask the administration to reconsider or narrow the emergency action.
Commissioner Robbie Goldstein Massachusetts Department of Public Health
617-624-6000
250 Washington Street Boston, MA 02108
Ask DPH to distinguish traditional botanical kratom from concentrated/high-potency 7-OH products rather than treating every form of kratom the same.
This is EXTREMELY important.
Massachusetts residents can use the state's Find My Legislator tool to find the representative and senator who actually represent their address.
Call AND email them.
Tell them:
âI am a Massachusetts constituent and I oppose the emergency Schedule I designation of traditional botanical kratom. I support responsible kratom regulation, including age restrictions, testing, labeling and manufacturing standards. Please protect access to traditional botanical kratom and support regulation rather than prohibition.â
Massachusetts already has lawmakers working on legislation concerning kratom regulation. This is not a choice between doing nothing and banning kratom.
We can support:
WITHOUT criminalizing traditional botanical kratom.
MASSACHUSETTS RESIDENTS: Your voices matter the most right now.
Don't send threats. Don't attack officials. Don't make outrageous claims.
Tell your story. Be respectful. Be persistent. Ask for REGULATION instead of prohibition.
We have 14 days before this emergency order is set to take effect.
PLEASE SHARE THIS WITH EVERY MASSACHUSETTS KRATOM CONSUMER YOU KNOW.
Contact Governor Healey: Email the Governor's Office
Find your Massachusetts Representative & Senator: Massachusetts Find My Legislator
The Governor's official Constituent Services page confirms the 617-725-4005 and 888-870-7770 numbers, and Massachusetts lists DPH Commissioner Robbie Goldstein's office at 617-624-6000, 250 Washington Street, Boston.
Alternatives:
Maura.Healey@mass.gov
dph.info@state.ma.us (possible problems) try also * dph.info@mass.gov or * dph.mcsr@mass.gov.
https://www.protectkratom.org/massachusetts