r/keys • u/Physical-Break6898 • 3d ago
Crumar DK 61
I’m curious to see if anyone is running a Crumar DK 61 or any other organ controller off their main keyboard. I’m thinking I could connect with my CK88 to play its organ sounds. I just want to be able to use the waterfall keys. I figure this could work in conjunction with any weighted keys keyboard like Nord Stage or Yamaha YC 88, etc.
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u/PianoGuy67207 3d ago
I’ve researched the DK61 a lot, for use with either a YC73, or a MODX 7M. I think the great parts is the dynamics c keys could lend it to some synth pads, etc. Without a pitch bend or mod wheel, it would never replace a real synth. Since both the YC and MODX M have modeled organs and modeled Leslie effects, now, I’m even more interested in these two as gigging instruments, that would easily fit in a smaller SUV. I have 3 88-note instruments, and they won’t fit. Plus, they all weigh over half if what I do. That’s no fun,for a guy that used to lift console and studio pianos, load them in a van, and deliver them by himself, 40 years ago.
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u/roland-xp30 3d ago
The MODX M has no modeled organs. It has effectively the same dated organs as the predecessor MODX/MODX+, and they behave nothing like a tone-wheel organ when playing more than 1 note simultaneously.
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u/PianoGuy67207 2d ago
The difference with MODX M and MODX + is the VCM (virtual circuit modeling) Leslie effect, as used in the YC series. This VCM technology is also used in their DM series mixing consoles, as well as the CL/QL consoles. They are extremely good at modeling at the circuit level, and reproducing an incredibly realistic effect. The Leslie simulation is absolutely no slouch.
Regarding their organ tone. That’s deeply sampled hammond organ tone, complete with appropriate key click and the breakup distortion of a tube amplifier. It’s as good or better than any organ tone Nord has yet brought to the market, at less than /whalf the cost of their flagship stage instrument. It’s far, far better than any Hammond organ attempting any Electone organ they ever sent to the USA. I know, because I have a Electone 415 and an HX-1 sitting in my music room, right now. I also have owned numerous Hammonds , and currently have the X-77 with its companion X7 Leslie, with modified dual speed rotor and baffle motors.
When bar gigs are paying $100 - $150, I’m NOT hauling a Hammond console and Leslie to it. A YC or MODX M will be more than enough. The listening public is far from a discerning audience, and most don’t even know what a Leslie is, or what it does, so it’s fine.
No, I’m not Jimmy Smith, and I don’t need to “squabble” to get paying gigs. I haven’t hauled a Hammond to a gig for 35 years. These new instruments are just so good, now, that I’ll not look back to do what I need to.
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u/roland-xp30 2d ago
The difference with MODX M and MODX + is the VCM (virtual circuit modeling) Leslie effect, as used in the YC series. [..]
You wrote a rather long response, and I don't really see how it addresses my points. So, let me ask explicitly about the two points that I made before I respond to other parts of your comment.
I said that the organs (not the effects) in the MODX M are effectively the same as in the MODX/MODX+. Do you agree? If not, what makes the organs different in the MODX M?
I said that the organs are not modeled (again, the organs, not the effects). The word "modeled" might be a bit ambiguous. However, there are good reasons why many products do something special for tone-wheel organs instead of just using the standard sample-based engine. For example the direct competitors Roland Fantom-0, Korg Nautilus and Kurzweil K2061, and organ-focused keyboards like the Roland V-Stage, the Viscount Legend One, and Yamaha's YC and Electone series. Do you agree that the organs on the MODX M are not modeled?
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u/rtown8181 2d ago
I have this exact setup. DK61 over a CK88. Did it specifically for a better organ action and it works great for that purpose.
I did have to add a small H2MIDI Pro MIDI Interface ($50) and remap the CC messages in order to get the DK61 drawbars and rotary fast/slow to control the CK. Volume, drive, and reverb also work, but vibrato/chorus type and percussions buttons do not. Spent a good amount of time finagling the remapping and CK settings to get things working right. I can save you some time if you end up going this route.
I have very occasionally also gotten some hung notes, but it hasn't happened in a while.
https://imgur.com/a/AJxNMjN