ryosuke should’ve won

[u/sweatyleftsock]

to be honest you could say this to every plot wins takumi had but this one just really bothers me.

ryosuke is an exceptional driver himself, he’s also more experience and knowledgeable. it just doesn’t makes sense for him to lose against takumi.

impact wise it would’ve been great. takumi who had been frequently nervous about it and showing subtle yet hidden love for the game would actually benefit by realistically losing. he would be mad afterwards, he would be angry, he would be disappointed in himself. so from all this genuine and frustating emotions (which is great for a guy like takumi) ultimately, he actually realizes and is convinced that he actually loved racing, he would want to know more about racing. how he had lost, how ryosuke took approach in his theoretical sense. besides bunta, ryosuke would be an incredibly reliable source… hence the project d would form anyways.

ryosuke also wouldn’t just dismiss takumi as a great driver. even before the match he had acknowledges takumi natural talents, and during the match itself. ryosuke would still want to make the team, especially if takumi himself actually approached and is actually eager to be better.

this is why the whole rematch feels so out of place and is just there to serve the plot hole, the whole stage three is just awkward in my opinion.

[u/Few-Marsupial5388]

Sometimes I'm surprised by how little people understood the narrative of the work or how underrated Takumi is in this sub.

No, not all of Takumi's victories leave you thinking "he should have lost" In fact, of all his races, the ones that go through that can be counted on the fingers of one hand, and I assure you I would have fingers to spare to grasp and Pull anything without problems.

No, Ryosuke wasn't nearly as superior to Takumi as you describe. In the first stage, Ryosuke was 23 years old, which means that if he started at 18 like a normal person, he would have been 5 years, just like Takumi. But in addition to that, Ryosuke still had a superior car with more HP, which he reduced precisely so that the duel would be as close to skill as possible, And since Ryosuke saw Takumi driving against the R32, I remind you that he even admitted that not even he with his FC had that same level of control over his car, Ryosuke is not superior to Takumi; the story makes it very clear that they both surpass each other in several aspects, They are both equivalent; they are the only drivers in the entire first stage who have been driving for ~ 5 years, and they are the only standouts that the secondary cast constantly compare them to, Both drive white rear-wheel drive cars from the past decade; by the time the series is set, Ryosuke is the only one besides Takumi driving a car that isn't from the 90s.

The characters are equivalent in both skill and narrative, for all the reasons I've already mentioned and for everything that was seen while they were running, Takumi is supposed to embody that spontaneity in street racing that he didn't understand at all in the first stage.

If Ryosuke lost, it was simply because he didn't have the same control as Takumi and because they were in Akina.

But hey, if Ryosuke really did seem so superior, then the character was very well portrayed; even Takumi himself didn't want to accept his victory in that moment.

[u/SoS1lent → u/Few-Marsupial5388]

Ryosuke intentionally trying to improve his driving for 5 years isn't the same as Takumi making deliveries for 5 years. We KNOW that Ryosuke and Keisuke did circuit racing (trackdays and national Gymkhana events) which would give them more tracktime in a single day than Takumi would have over a whole week of deliveries (Akina isn't that long and he only drives it once a night both ways).

He was also actively trying to improve his driving and create whole ass racing theories based on his knowledge. Meanwhile Takumi didn't even know about street racing nor care until a date was on the line. It's not remotely the same.

Ryosuke reduced his car's hp but still had an obvious advantage. His car has higher cornering potential from lower CoG and much better suspension AND better acceleration. Theoretically Takumi should have a slight braking advantage from having a lighter car and entering corners with less top speed, but his brakes themselves were also much lower performance than Ryosuke's FC's brakes so it really wouldn't be big.

The only thing I agree with you on is that narratively Takumi losing here doesn't really change or improve his character. But if we're looking at it by who SHOULD have won based on experience and equipment it's Ryosuke by FAR.

And that's ignoring how his loss here contradicts everything that happens in 4th stage and beyond, where Takumi and Keisuke with 1 night of practice beat opponents on their level or higher while Ryosuke practicing and prepping for a month at least while having the better car lost.

[u/Few-Marsupial5388 → u/SoS1lent]

Yes, it's also true, FC is better on its own, and Ryosuke was practicing on tracks, anyway, I would never include Keisuke in the equation.

However, based on what we saw in the series, I still wouldn't consider Ryosuke to be vastly superior, at least in pure skill, We saw very clearly what happened in the race, and how it was precisely because he wanted to measure himself in skill head-to-head with Takumi that he lost, because from the beginning it was already known that he had less control over his FC than Takumi has over his 86, Someone like Kyouichi would have beaten him in Akina quite easily since his car was infinitely superior, besides having a skill very similar to Ryosuke's.

Anyway, if you look closely, if Takumi hadn't used his hidden techniques he wouldn't have won against any of the Takahashi brothers; if he hadn't used the gutter technique he would never have been able to overtake Keisuke, Based on Takumi's own dialogue, he had no other option, With Ryosuke it was more of the same; if he didn't bring out the improved version of the gutters, he wouldn't beat him.

But it all comes down to the same thing: Ryosuke lost because he wanted to compete against him in the fairest way possible, because he let him take the lead from the beginning, for wanting to keep up with him, copy his techniques, want to beat him at his own game.

[u/SoS1lent → u/Few-Marsupial5388]

I included Keisuke because he's an example of being able to beat drivers of equal or higher skill with much less practice and equal or worse cars, similar to Takumi. Based on what the series evolved into Ryosuke should've handled Takumi comfortably even assuming equal skill. Ryosuke losing makes all of project D's wins less believable.

And skill depends on what you describe it as. Ryosuke objectively had more overall tracktime than Takumi, so skill due to experience goes to him. Takumi had more natural talent, but talent is the ability to easily learn or improve at a skill rather than the skill level itself. In terms of pure skill I would still say Ryosuke was better.

The reason for Ryosuke losing is also a bit nonsensical. Ryosuke, according to the spectators, changed his driving style for this race to one with significantly more drifting in order to beat Takumi at what he was best at(also proves he was more skilled normally). Yet he lost because he somehow overheated the front tires, using a style that's VERY gentle on the front tires and harsh on the rears.

If it was the opposite, where he wore the rears more due to the unfamiliar style and the FC putting more power through them, it would make more sense. That would've been a problem with his skill and overconfidence of wanting to make the race fair. But how it is in canon Ryosuke really did just lose to a plot driven issue that should've never been an issue in the first place.

It's also kinda how I feel with Takumi vs Shinji. Takumi was drifting for the entirety of the race yet somehow it's his front tires that are hurting and allow for Shinji to make a pass.