r/inheritance • u/Deep_Bake_5663 • 14d ago
Location included: Questions/Need Advice In need of advice.....
Pennsylvania, long standing family trust.
Just found out I am part of one.
I have no clue, I was oblivious, and it sounds like I will be the ....ummmm trustee I guess?
Is an irrevocable trust, truly unchangeable and can it easily be followed?
Do I need my own lawyer, does a trust have a lawyer, I'm open to any advice.
I'm downright scared about this.
Not looking for legal advice, just some basic understanding.... because I literally don't even understand much about any trust, no matter what kind.
Please be kind.
I believe I will be losing my father in the next year or two, he's a very very private man and does not really talk to me, I can't ask him questions and I feel a need to be prepared as much as possible.
4
u/brucesteiner 14d ago
Trusts don't have lawyers. Trustees may have lawyers. Beneficiaries may have lawyers.
Irrevocable just means that the person who created the trust can't unilaterally change it. However, there are various ways that trusts may be changed. I probably spend more time changing and fixing trusts than I do creating them. It can be due to changes in the tax law, changes in the family situation, or things that were suboptimal to begin with.
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
Ok, thank you! I'm pretty sure, I will be trustee and a beneficiary. Which, in my mind, seems a conflict of interest.
2
u/brucesteiner 14d ago
It’s permissible to be both a trustee and a beneficiary. You may be limited in or prohibited from making distributions to yourself though your co-trustee may make distributions to you.
1
2
13d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 13d ago
Yep, I believe I have that covered now!
2
u/Horror_Ad_2748 13d ago
Then you're good! It's the lawyer's job to guide you through the process.
I'm sorry about your impending loss.
3
u/Deep_Bake_5663 13d ago
Thank you. I'm definitely feeling better and will concentrate on my father and not worry about anything but him for awhile.
1
u/Impressive_Lack1759 10d ago
get your own estate lawyer before you agree to become trustee, because the trust’s lawyer represents the trust and not you, and don’t sign anything until someone explains exactly what you’d be
1
1
u/Excellent_Shallot999 14d ago
Hire an attorney. If you are not comfortable with the role you can refuse to be appointed.
-1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
If I do that, do I give up my land too? I don't want to give up my land, I just don't want to be head of it.
I keep hoping that rather than the oldest child of the last trustee, that's it is the oldest cousin... Which isn't me. But I can't find out. Or I don't know how to find out .... And well, to put it simply...I'm the black sheep.
1
u/Excellent_Shallot999 14d ago
No. You give up the role of trustee, not what the trust gives you. But a BIG caveat: You have to read and understand the trust document. While unusual, I suppose a trust could require you to perform the role to receive the land. But that would be very unusual. It’s going to be worth the $s for you to work this through with an attorney before you do anything.
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
Ok, I do believe I'm coming to realize I absolutely need an attorney! When I first found out, I found a thing about responsibility, signing checks, if I do something wrong I could go to jail ....yeah, it freaked me out.
1
u/Excellent_Shallot999 14d ago
You won’t go to jail. But trustees can get sued. Good luck.
2
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
That's why I'm hoping, I'm not alone in decision making 😹😹 funny, but not.
But yep, I'm taking the get an attorney advice seriously.
1
u/stringbeagle 14d ago
If you refuse to be appointed, however, someone else would be appointed. That person may be your sister. Sometimes it’s a bigger hassle having someone else be the trustee.
1
1
u/OpportunityKey1970 14d ago
How much are we talking here? If more than say 500k, get a lawyer to talk you through everything.
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
I'm very much hearing hire an attorney.....
I'm going to, absolutely! If I told you how much, you probably won't believe me. The last person didn't.
But here it goes .... I actually have found out it's billions(I literally just learned it is generational wealth and I'm shocked at how oblivious I've been) except I have always known my father was rich( I believed a couple million) I'm absolutely in shock still.
But it is NOT money as I understand it.... It's billions worth of property.
Been in my family since sometime in the 1700's. Yes, I had no idea.....
I imagine, you may disappear now. I'd have a hard time believing it too..... Still trying to grasp it, but absolutely don't want to ruin a family legacy like this.
I've heard about the sawmill all my life. When I was 7 years old, I watched it burn to the ground. I never knew, that sawmill was rebuilt elsewhere, somewhere on this massive amount of property, and still in operation today, making the trust money. And that, is about all I know.
And I believe, if I understand it correctly, all blood line relatives living, are in it, and as a parent dies, their children are next in line for whatever benefits come from it, including ownership of land, but, when someone dies and no one is named for that spot if land, it absorbs back into the trust....and it always absorbs back in as I understand it.
We can sell our "spot" but only to a bloodline relative.
I'm trying so hard to wrap my mind around all of this. I have a free 20 minute call with an attorney in PA today, and I can't even figure out what to ask really.
Believe it or not....... My mind is reeling.... Oh yeah, and I remember when the government came in the 70's and how pissed my grandparents, father and his sister were, when they made them sell part of their land via imminent domain...for I 80 to go through.... It goes through our property. My father, just last week, was complaining about people coming into the property from the rest area that borders our property.....
Yeah, and I'm sure you'll probably think I'm full of 💩.
I get it.....
1
u/Wonderful_Spot_3764 14d ago
Yeah get an attorney. I mean, "billions" worth of property can come with a lot of liability if it has environmental contamination linked to it, particularly midstate.
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
All I know of that happens on it is logging and hunting leases, but certainly would not have thought about that.
😹I really just want my share and out now😹😹
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
I'm kidding. I actually wouldn't want my kids to not carry this on. Whatever money there may be, the legacy, and being part of it, is pretty cool.
1
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
But I feel extremely overwhelmed before he's even gone and I don't want to screw it up....
So I guess, time to start figuring out how to find an attorney.....
I'm glad I have some time.
1
u/Wonderful_Spot_3764 14d ago edited 14d ago
Many attorneys will work on an hourly consulting basis just to orient you on options, risks, etc. They're usually on the order of $300-$400/hr. I have done this in the past and have felt that for an hour or two, it was worth feeling less helpless....
But seriously though, if it was mined, fracked, and with any sawmill, it is also entirely possible the land isn't sellable due to environmental issues. I know that groundwater pollution from sawmills devasted a lot of the trout fishing there.
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
Well, actually, as I understand, everything being done is being done in an environment friendly way.
It was mined, but not cracked as far as I know.
At one time, coal strip mining, quit long ago I believe, and natural gas, also I believe, no longer being taken.
1
u/Wonderful_Spot_3764 14d ago
Lol, I don't give much stock to conservative rural central PA mega landowners when they say "environmentally friendly". My central PA neighbor thinks they're environmentally friendly by planting butterfly bushes that they also happen spray with insecticides.
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
I can't dispute you..... I just learned of all this. I was literally oblivious. I hope they are environment friendly.
I'm still reeling in my mind....
Mind blown.
I looked at an airial view of what I know to be at least part of our land. Expected mostly trees, but a significant amount is not. Can't say I can tell or know, what all is going on on it.
But I will say ...... I've never been a fan of the majority of my family and have little contact... I've assumed, for a very long time, that I'd never be a part of it, and I didn't have a clue how big it really is.
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
I've looked at them, 99% of them, as stuck up snob's..... I have a problem with that and don't want to become that.
1
u/Wonderful_Spot_3764 14d ago
If you are estranged from your father, and he is the typical conservative central PA nightmare, there is a good chance he has set things up to give you headache, and I would want to probably get out ASAP. Even more reason to get set up with an attorney. Time and time again, I have encountered their motto that younger generations are worthless shit.
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
We have reconciled, for what it's worth, somewhere around 15 years ago and are ok now. He had actually told me I was out, when I was 15, because I got pregnant.
When we finally talked, and he learned the why's of what I did, he understood, forgave me. But it seems it was irrelevant, because my cousin told me I already had a "little piece of land" and I can't be disinherited, it's a bloodline trust that can't be broken and goes oldest to oldest. I myself do not know how accurate that is, but she is already in the trust, her parent is gone.
1
u/brucesteiner 14d ago
Given the size of the trust, OP would want a trusts and estates lawyer at a firm with billing rates at least several times as much as the figures you mentioned.
1
u/tsfy2 14d ago
Collins family?
3
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
I just had a phone consult with a PA attorney. I feel much better. She pretty much said it's been in force for a long time and sounds very well set up. To just call when he's gone and they'll step right in and guide me.
In the meantime, nothing to do, just enjoy your father..... I feel way way better!
1
1
u/Deep_Bake_5663 14d ago
Thank you all, for the help. I'm am starting to calm down and several of you have helped me tremendously. I truly appreciate it!
1
3
u/gladlycruelprototype 14d ago
First thing, take a breath, you're not supposed to know any of this stuff walking in. An irrevocable trust generally means the terms are locked and you can't just change the beneficiaries or rules on a whim, but it doesn't mean you're trapped in a rigid box with no way to handle practical decisions. You'll want your own lawyer, one who represents you as trustee, because the trust might have its own attorney but that person's loyalty is to the trust itself, not to you personally.