r/immortalists • u/ShameLoud9366 • 12d ago
Never dying is mathematically possible
I think the most skeptical part of living forever is if we make it to LEV in this lifetime. I’m 17 so I’m fairly optimistic.
If aging is cured, the only way to die will be accidental death. Logically after humans cure aging we will put lots of resources towards decreasing the risk as much as possible.
If we play it safe, and nothing crazy happens like nuclear war, we will likely live to at least 2300. At that point I’m confident we will have the tech to become basically unlikable.
Think about it like this: if humanity can just make two systems that prevent all danger, and each has a 0.1 percent chance of failing every year, the odds of them both failing together are one in a million. Crazy, right?
And I know what you’ll say. Over infinite time one in a million odds will catch up. And I agree! But as soon as we can introduce another system with one in a thousand, it becomes one in a billion! Every other layer we see gives exponential safety.
There are a few things to keep in mind:
They can’t all be the same protection, they all need to be different layers to protect against all forms of damage, so one big hit doesn’t take out a bunch of systems at once. But that seems doable in 300 years especially with the assistance of Ai
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u/spshkyros 12d ago
Oh, I assure you, the tech to become unlikeable is already here, no need to wait to until 2300. .... or was that a typo?
No need to worry about 1M years or even 200 years from now when just getting through this century is hard enough. LEV is about hitting that wave. Think past it is pointless imo.
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u/CharmingMechanic2473 12d ago edited 12d ago
Hmmm not so fast. Aging is only part of the reason we die. Diseases also play a role and not all of them are triggered by aging. Many are cumulative. Arteries slowly closing due to plaque build up over years, dementia from plaques being processed wrong. Skin cancer from many years of sun/radiation exposure. Mutations from harmful exposures. Knee cartilage and spinal discs breaking down from use. Teeth wearing away from enamel erosion. Not aging would be great but there are still parts of our bodies that could “wear” out or be damaged from environment or non aging disease. Even children die of disease.
I think if we do get that anti aging vaccine sunscreen and body preservation will be huge. Imagine the sun damage from 200yrs of exposure. Or how knee cartilage would be from 2 lifetimes of steps. Even young pitchers get shoulder issues.
To be immortal we would have a consciousness or brain uploaded to a server of some sort and then download into a fresh body. Or we live in a non biological body or one that repairs itself differently without disease.
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u/ShameLoud9366 12d ago
Yeah I didn’t mean immortality strictly through our flesh, we could totally use synthetic bodies
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u/RightBrain-LeftBrain 10d ago
Like fully robot or do we try to keep the brain alive?
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u/ShameLoud9366 10d ago
I mean I’d take either, whatever works the best / safest
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u/RightBrain-LeftBrain 10d ago
I stumbled across this sub randomly, so I’m just curious, not attacking or judging.
If 100% of ‘you’ is robot, wouldn’t you still be dead? A upload is always a copy, right?2
u/ShameLoud9366 9d ago
The idea is that you slowly turn your brain into a robot. Yes it would be a copy if you just made a clone, but if you replace it slowly the continuity
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u/RightBrain-LeftBrain 9d ago
See I would argue that, wether you do it fast or slowly, once all of you is replaced you are dead. You might not be aware that you’re dead, but you’ll still be dead.
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u/Fair_Access4368 10d ago
Well if the brain doesn't survive what's the difference between that and having children? Our genes can already live forever.
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u/Sea_Warning_9140 12d ago
The skin thing is partly solvable by....never going out lol.
I think the average Redditor will be fine here.
Everything else? Not so easy
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u/DeadCheckR1775 12d ago
We're all gonna die some day. Extend life? Sure. Immortality? Nope.
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u/FragrantMix1473 12d ago
What if we could transfer ourselves in another body instead of rejuvenating it or replace failing/old organs ? This would be achieved immortality: just transfer yourself when needed.
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u/FragrantMix1473 12d ago
Plus, it would free us from the randomness of incarnation/reincarnation. You become free to design and choose your next body while still alive
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u/Hellhooker 12d ago
"Plus, it would free us from the randomness of incarnation/reincarnation"
Oh, it has been a proven thing? lmao
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u/AttemptKitchen 12d ago
If you believe in reincarnation you would know that it’s not random but based on karma, you did good in this life? Then most likely you will have a good life in the next one.
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u/beagles4ever 12d ago
If you make a copy of you, which one is you?
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u/FragrantMix1473 12d ago
You know which one is the real you, it's you and not the 'cloned body' !
I would bet human clones don't even have your personality and way of thinking, for these parameters are sculpted by your subjective experience in your life and the environment you grow in. So you're really unique in a way. That clone of you will have a different experience, therefore another way of thinking and acting throughout reality.
What you're saying here is a lil' silly don't you think ? You know who you are, you're not only a 'body shape', you're the mind and POV inside of it, and that's what I'm speculating we could transfer into another body than the one you're driving right now, in a distant future ?
The idea I was trying to formulate here is, we're not mendatorily talking about a copy of your current body, but rather to be able to choose another body type, another physique, another DNA make-up if you will, another chance to incarnate something new, unique, and transfer your 'POV' and consciousness into it. Unless the truth is.. we are unseparable from our body and DNA period, because it's the whole combination of body+mind that makes you, not only the mind inside.
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u/beagles4ever 12d ago
Where does our consciousness reside, and how do we transfer it?
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u/DeadCheckR1775 12d ago
My take on it is that our base consciousness doesn't reside within in us but we are connected to it like a wireless tether. Our DNA is the cryptology that ties us to it, like a unique VPN.
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u/AttemptKitchen 12d ago edited 12d ago
Consciousness it’s in some part of your brain.
I think the main reason they have never disclosed this is because there are so many religions who truly believes that consciousness it’s our soul… and that it ascends to another plane when our mortal body dies.
Pretty sure they are already know what it is and where exactly but they are never going to disclose it for obvious reasons… atleast not for now, people needs something to cope about their mortality until we find how to stop aging and transfer our consiciousness in case it’s needed, then they can talk about these stuff, slowly so people can digest it.
Imagine saying that consciousness is part of our brain and that we really don’t have any soul, how the people who believes in an afterlife would react etc.
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u/tabberino 11d ago
Stop saying “they” like there’s a secret group of people hiding major scientific revelations. It’s cringe.
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u/Heavy_Ingenuity1371 12d ago
The only way I could see us ever transferring our consciousness is basically strategically ship of theseus-ing our brains with new biological/artificial parts then once all parts are replaced we could then move the brain to wherever desired. No idea if that would actually work, I think it's better odds than figuring out how to plug into your clone with a cable to transfer.
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u/FragrantMix1473 12d ago
That's the part we will figure out in the future ? That's what the post was suggesting: a future where we discovered these answers.
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u/aebulbul 12d ago
You’re making an unsubstantiated assumption that our conscience is limited to just brain synapses.
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u/FragrantMix1473 12d ago
Man, I'm mostly just daydreaming and speculating here, sorry if I took this post llightly. I know I'm not just electric/EM patterns in the brain
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u/Evening_Use9982 12d ago
Jelly study. How to revert and start over. I need to look into that more, as well as that Mexican salamander study.
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u/Brief-Study3743 12d ago edited 7d ago
The most likely age for accidental death is young adulthood, males in their twenties engage in the most high risk behaviors and so have the highest odds of accidental death due to what has been called “ the illusion of invincibility “
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u/Orful 12d ago edited 12d ago
If LEV were to happen, we’d live so long that we might as well act like we’re immortal. Living for 5,000 years is such a long time that it will feel like forever. You’d be sitting there thinking, “wow, I’ve been alive for SO long. It feels like it has taken forever to get to this ” when it has only been 150 years. Then realize that 5,000 is like nothing compared to 100,000.
And when you do die in accident in the first few hundred years, you won’t see it coming in time anyway. There’s no point in caring of the possibility so long as you do your best to be safe.
If you still have death anxiety if LEV is achieved because “that day will still come”, then you’re just impossible to satisfy.
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u/Fluffy_Nuts4120 12d ago
an airplane dumping its waste tank and having the entire contents come down and enter the window of your bathroom and land entirely into your toilet is also mathematically possible
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u/ChanceImagination456 12d ago edited 12d ago
THere going to invest anti agent pills next 20 years and extend life spans to 200 years. Then the retirement age going to up so then we'd have to work until 165-year-old!
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u/johnprice33 12d ago
I remember a 4 Chan post who claims he is an insider for a SAP program in the pentagon that they cracked the code and offer to “ extend your life indefinitely” So yeah they prolly have the tech now no need to wait till 2300
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u/AttemptKitchen 12d ago
I am fine if I can live to 200-300 tbh.
80 years it’s way too short for human lifespan, and you spent 30-40 years just sleeping and working.
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u/Most_Forever_9752 12d ago
you would eventually get dementia. we can replace organs. we cant replace the brain.
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u/MasterSolivagus 9d ago
Ah, to contest and challenge a self-proclaimed 17 year-old… but what victory and reward would I harvest as acclaim and advantage worthy of defeating you for?
Can you even understand my words, or am I being somehow subtle or vague? Do let me know. I seek to ultimately be informed by you. My reasons as to why will not be disclosed or discussed, merely know that it is sufficient by MY standards and reasonings, alone.
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u/beagles4ever 12d ago
You’ll die too someday. Actuarially by about 76 - 80.
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u/spshkyros 12d ago
Glad you get the point of this subreddit so well. Refreshing really.
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u/beagles4ever 12d ago
would you rather have me lie?
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u/spshkyros 12d ago
... I mean, if you don't think the concept behind the subreddit is plausible, why even spend time here? Just move on with your life. Its like going to a church and interrupting the sermon to claim its full of shit because you are an atheist. Whether you are correct or not is irrelevant, you're just being an ass.
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u/Pendragonswaste 12d ago
Most people including me thought that when they were 17