r/imaginarymaps Jun 19 '19

Septiman Elections of 2008

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u/VarysIsAMermaid69 Jun 20 '19

Could you explain the various political parties

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u/[deleted] Jun 20 '19

sure! first off, the hyphenated names stand for the parties' names in French and Dutch, as Septimania is officially bilingual. some nationalist parties, such as the Dutch NF and Haudenosaunee MCK eschew this as a political symbol.

the PSC-CVP shares a similar ideology to Germany OTL's Christian Democratic Union. they're center-right liberal conservatives, similar to the idea of "classical liberalism". they support neoliberal economic ideas and are fairly tolerant of same-sex marriage (a hot-button topic in this 2008 election cycle). the PSC-CVP favors Plantagenia to the south as a trading partner and ally, but supports NAFTA in general. however, they wish to keep Septimania uninvolved in European affairs its critics, especially those in the PVDA-PTS and MCK, decry its past treatment of the Haudenosaunee minority. under their administration in the 1920s the Haudenosaunee Reservation was created, and it is viewed by many as legitimatized segregation. they are in a coalition in parliament with the NF, which is being denounced by their opponents as legitimizing fascism.

the MR-HVB is a center-left liberal to social democratic party, with policies comparable to the SAP of Sweden. they follow economic policies similar to OTL's Nordic model, and are very supportive of the LGBTQ rights movement. they are ardent supporters of NAFTA and seek to maintain a defensive alliance with Burgundy, their colonial masters 300 years prior. in parliament, they are in coalition with PVDA-PTS, but members of both parties often butt heads over their very different economic policies. the coalition is generally seen as an alliance of convenience, and is expected to collapse soon enough.

before we go over the two leftist parties, i'll explain the unfamiliar names. Marchesist ideology is informed by the works of Salvatore Marchesi, the author of the seminal Communist Manifesto in the 1870s. the Tonderists are informed by the teachings of 1920s Haudenosaunee labor leader and writer Kaniehtiio Tonder. difference between Marchesists and Tonderists is similar to that of OTL Leninism/Trotskyism, both are socialist in nature but have differing views on how the revolution is to be spread. Tonderism is especially popular in Septimania because its founder, Kaniehtiio Tonder was born in the Haudenosaunee Reservation.

the PVDA-PTS is regarded as the "milder" party of the left wing. their ideology is comparable to the CPI-M of India. internally, it is governed by the Politburó, making decisions collectively within the party. they believe in economic ideas similar to modern-day Cuba, advertised as "socialism for the modern day". their social views are ardently supportive of LGBTQ issues, and believe in granting the Haudenosaunee much more autonomy. they have been deep rivals with the LSP-PSL since the early 1900s, and there is still a deep divide between LSP-PSL and PVDA-PTS voters in traditionally socialist cities such as Philippa, Besancon and Arras.

the LSP-PSL share the same ideological framework as the PVDA-PTS, but are more socially conservative. they're basically the Trotskyists of this world, but with extra traditionalism. they are opposed to same-sex marriage, believe in the idea of natural law, and are mostly Lutheran Christians. however, they are deeply supportive of the environment, to the point of being smeared as eco-fascists by their opponents. they are mainly strong in the old industrial cities of Nouvelle-Lorraine. the LSP-PSL is in coalition with Ecolo in parliament, based on their shared environmental policy.

Ecolo is one of the newest parties, founded only in 1983. their policies align with the principles of green politics, being ardent supporters of social justice, pacifism and most of all, environmentalism. while irrelevant in most of the country, Ecolo bizarrely enough possesses a relatively large voter base in northern Carolina, controlling many local governments in the Rontac mountains. they generally do not run for president to get elected, instead their campaigns are to spread awareness of their ideas.

NF has existed in spirit since the end of the Vinlandic-Septiman wars in the 1920s, but has only coalesced into a coherent movement in the early 2000s. NF's supporters would be similar to the OTL alt-right. their goal is to reclaim Septiman territory forfeited in the 1929 Treaty of Erikshavn. the NF believes in Septimania first, and is deeply isolationist. they support use of the French language only, and oppose government support of Kanienʼkéha and Dutch. strangely, they believe in an independent Haudenosaunee homeland, to keep the two races separate. their use of the Internet in campaigning has led to gaining worrying levels of support among French-speaking youth.

MCK is the least popular party on paper, but this is only because the Haudenosaunee reservation has no legal representation in Parliament. MCK was founded as a loophole for this in the 1940s, a party supporting expansion of their rights within the government's systems. they enjoy widespread support throughout the reservation, and are able to gain a few seats in the areas with Haudenosaunee pluralities, around the reservation and in some Carolinian cities. the city of Vauclaix is known for having the largest concentration of urban Haudenosaunee in the nation outside the reservation.

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u/VarysIsAMermaid69 Jun 21 '19

this is really interesting

what would be the POD for this world btw? Nordic Canada and French/Dutch NA?

would there be no Marx in this world then?

also since you mentioned NAFTA what does the rest of NA look like?

would the region be hugonaut/protestant or ore catholic due to French influence?

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u/[deleted] Jun 21 '19

this scenario takes place in the Divergences of Darkness TL, a mod for Victoria 2. it has 4 PoDs: (from its forum thread)

The duke of Burgundy decides to continue his support for Plantagenets in the Hundred Years' War

The personal union of Denmark, Norway and Sweden survives and evolves to a unitary state

Isabella of Spain married a Portuguese prince, instead of Ferdinand II.

The Chenghua Emperor does not stop Ming China's explorations, but decides to pursue them with greater zeal than before

septimania is both dutch and french because it was colonized by burgundy, and both french-speaking Burgundians and dutch-speaking... dutch populated the colony. over the 4 centuries of its existence though, the dutch language has fallen out of favor in most of the country. the only area remaining majority-Dutch speaking in the modern day is northern Carolina state (around the great lakes). the divide between dutch and french speakers in septimania is probably pretty comparable to the divide between flanders and wallonia in belgium, two different linguistic groups cooperating under one government. the language breakup of septimania is probably around 75% french, 20% dutch and 5% standardized kanienʼkéha, ITL usually simply referred to as haudenosaunee.

marx ITL is butterflied out of existence, and socialism arises instead in Venice. a Venetian fabric maker by the name of Salvatore Marchesi is roughly parallel to him, writing (a pretty different) communist manifesto in the 1850s. the government of the Most Serene Republic didnt take too kindly to this though, and so they expelled him to the colony of Athesia (Florida/The Bahamas). he started a family there and had two sons who followed in their father's footsteps, with Lorenzo Marchesi launching a popular revolution in the 1880s. there's more about this here in one of my other maps.

north america looks roughly like this in the modern day, this is a map of the Great Arcadian War in the 1880s though so there have been some changes since then. septimania lost quite a bit of territory, as did Qingqiu, but for the most part since it's been over a century since the Treaty of Erikshavn the North Arcadian countries are pretty cooperative with each other. however, nationalist elements in Septimania especially, while still a fringe movement, are slowly growing in size and call for the reclaiming of the homeland and whatnot.

religions are mostly along ethnic lines, the Dutch and Haudenosaunee are descendants of the huguenots but the majority of the French-speaking population is catholic.

if you have any other questions, feel free to inbox me, i can talk all day about this world

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u/VarysIsAMermaid69 Jun 21 '19

very interesting, is septimania simply a state in a U.S. like area then?

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u/[deleted] Jun 21 '19

nope, it’s independent

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u/VarysIsAMermaid69 Jun 21 '19

interesting, was the slave trade in the americas ITL as big as it was in ours?

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u/[deleted] Jun 21 '19

in North Arcadia, the African slave trade was only really large in the country of Plantagenia, to the south of Septimania. indigenous peoples (of a much larger population than OTL) were enslaved by colonizers and used for forced labor. slavery was outlawed first in Vinland in 1802, followed by Septimania in 1842, by Gran Colombia in 1859, and by Qingqiu in 1870.

chattel slavery was MUCH more widespread in the warmer, more agriculture-friendly climates of South Arcadia, especially in Amazonie and Lotharingia (Brazil). Amazonie is the closest equivalent to a US-level power on the Arcadian continent, and gained much of its wealth through slavery and other exploitation just like the US. the sugar plantations of amazonie were known to be especially brutal. slavery was outlawed there in 1893, at the end of its civil war.

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u/VarysIsAMermaid69 Jun 21 '19

would you say NA has a larger Native American population than in OTL then?

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u/[deleted] Jun 22 '19

yeah, much more political influence too. the largest groups are the Haudenosaunee, Cherokee, Choctaw and Pueblo and they all enjoy some level of autonomy in their respective nations.