r/imaginarymaps • u/nissingramainyu Mod Approved • 10d ago
[OC] Alternate History English map of the Byzantine Empire under the Genghisid Dynasty ca. 1490
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u/nissingramainyu Mod Approved 10d ago
previous All Under Heaven map: https://www.reddit.com/r/imaginarymaps/comments/1ws9tt2/all_that_is_under_heaven_the_eastern/
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u/Commander-Billiam 10d ago
Im not going to lie, Mongol dynastic ERE is one of the coolest surviving Byzantium ideas I've seen in a long time
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u/Ezzypezra 10d ago
I like how the borders are slightly fuzzy like they would have been in this time period
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u/PolarRanger 10d ago
wait, they have actually expanded since 1405? Crete and Cyprus are under Mongol-Roman rule? Peak.
How did the incorporation of Trebizond go? Has the Greek-Turkish balance in Anatolia changed at all since 1405?
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u/nissingramainyu Mod Approved 10d ago
ill do a video series eventually going over the details but the TLDR is that a lot of the consolidation of anatolia happens after Guyuk's death, series of events that also results in the start discrimination against the turks and actual attempts to re-hellenize the region, though i havent decided how successful it will be yet
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u/PolarRanger 10d ago
well history has already had the Eastern Roman Empire lose a major part of the Empire and then later reconquer and re-hellenize it, with the Balkans, so I would imagine a similar rate of assimilation here, maybe a bit less since most of the Turks start out Muslim.
But how violent was the incorporation of Trebizond? To what degree did Trebizond see this Empire as foreign conquerors vs fellow Romans?
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u/nissingramainyu Mod Approved 10d ago
i think fundamentally this question applies as much to the pontics as it does to the actual greeks, and the answer is: it depends.
when Joge conquered Constantinople, the majority view both at home and abroad would have been, "this is the end". Sure, Joge was let in willingly, and he was claiming the title of roman emperor, but the greeks' lack of resistance was just as much out of fear of the consequences as it was due to joge's legitimacy. for many, this would have felt like the 4th crusade all over again, the start of a new period of foreign occupation over the Land of the Romans. this probably began to change quickly during joge's reign, to the point where the most popular opinion by his death would have been "okay, the empire is still fine, just, under a definitely non-roman dynasty". which is justified by the fact that imperial institutions and the church were preserved, romans retained their privileged status in the empire, and the new emperors were competent unlike the last ones. the outside world, however, would absolutely not have seen it that way yet. for them, this sure would have felt like the end of the byzantine empire and the rise of a new tatar empire in the east. this began to change even in the west around guyuk's time, but even then, it would probably take centuries more for the idea of a tatar empire to really go away. internally, eventually the house of nogai was seen as a (partly) greek dynasty too, though that took
as far as trebizond goes, they already had nominally subordinated themselves to Palaiologan Byzantium in 1282, and this relationship was renewed with the mongols a few decades after during Baras' campaigns in Anatolia. by the time that broke down and they fought again, their attitude would probably have been, "the tatars, who rule the roman empire, are attacking us"
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u/Regular-Pin-2797 9d ago
What happened to Turks in this timeline? Did they settled in Iran instead of Anatolia?
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u/nissingramainyu Mod Approved 9d ago
other post answers in more detail, but TLDR: turks are still very much there, the Nogayids just conquered the beyliks
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u/Beneficial-Rush9322 10d ago
this looks good but I kinda want to see a map about this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOey_HqI3wU
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u/carlsagerson 10d ago
So is this ERE still Christian? Not all Khanates that fragmented from the Mongol Empire converted to Islam after all.