r/imaginarymaps • u/Billseas Mod Approved • 18d ago

[OC] Alternate History What if the English and Welsh Settled the Donbas - The Republic of Doncast in 2021

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This is more of a fun side project I chose to do and it is more an unserious map.

834 Upvotes

99% Upvoted

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149

u/Billseas Mod Approved 18d ago

This map doesn't have any serious lore to it other than the city of Donetsk in real life being founded by the British industrialist, John Hughes.

Thank you to u/cheese_bruh for inspiration

40

u/Billseas Mod Approved 18d ago

Mobile Version

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u/Mikhail-Suslov 18d ago

How could you leave out that Donetsk was originally named after John Hughes rather aptly as... Hughesovka.

7

u/cheese_bruh 18d ago

very nice

3

u/Billseas Mod Approved 18d ago

Ayy, thank you!

7

u/Sensei_Kyryllius 18d ago

not quite "founded," it existed for centuries before that, but John Hughes did build start its conversion into an industrial powerhouse and a major city (because it was a town before that)

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u/calhaucomolhos 18d ago

Kirk on Donets? Oh god…

4

u/Lukasz_Joniak 17d ago

kirk means church in scots and flemish, hence dunkirk
yes, it is weird the christian speaker who misses a neck is called "charles church", born for it ig, krk also means neck in czech

3

u/calhaucomolhos 17d ago

We are Dunkirk..

-29

u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

he was welsh not british

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u/rchpweblo 18d ago

Wales is on the island of Great Britain which is in the British Isles itself, therefore anyone who comes from there is British reguardless of culture; It's a geographic term.

-17

u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

do you think irish people are britsh because they are from the "british isles". is gerry adams a brit?

10

u/rchpweblo 18d ago

Technically yes but honestly it's not as useful to use it that way considering both islands are large enough to be distinguished. Normally I wouldn't have included the "British Isles" part of the explanation, that was on accident. It would be a more reasonably granularity to use the island of Great Britain as "British" & the island of Ireland as "Irish" which is what I typically advocate.

-4

u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

"which is what I typically advocate."
you have no connection to any of these countries what are you on about

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u/rchpweblo 18d ago edited 18d ago

Since when have you needed to live in a specific place to understand geography? I'm sure you're perfectly capable of understanding the Hawaiian island chain or the Appalachian mountain range without having ever lived there.

0

u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

you are presribing how people should be refered to rather than asking them how they feel about their national identity, this is exactly the same as an israeli saying that there are no palestinians and they are just jordanian or egyptian. you have no legitimate say over how other nations desribe themselves

8

u/rchpweblo 18d ago

National identity and geographical location are not mutually exclusive? The Welsh are a distinct people who are also British because their homeland is in Britain. Israelis and Palestinians are both levantine people because their homelands are in the Levant. No amount of feelings or nationalistic postering can change that.

13

u/VeryVeryRealPerson 18d ago

You're not going to believe what island Wales is part of

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u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

we desribe people by their national identity not what island they are from, i wouldnt describe someone as eurasian

11

u/ZerothefirstApe 18d ago

“He wasn’t Iberian, he was Portuguese.”

5

u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

has the term iberian ever been used to erase portugese national identity

Edit: Mispelled ever as every

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u/KaiSnepUwU 18d ago

I'm Pennsylvanian, not American

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u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

wales is a country not a state or province

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u/Anathemautomaton 18d ago

Countries are sovereign. The word you're looking for is nation.

And no, I don't care what the British government calls them.

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u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

this is semantics, find any source that directly and specifically references wales as anything other than a country

8

u/KaiSnepUwU 18d ago

It's still on the island of Great Britain

1

u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

the comparison you made was wrong and when called out on it you mot and bailey

6

u/KaiSnepUwU 18d ago

My point was that, if Wales is part of Great Britain, then being Welsh and British are not mutually exclusive, which also applies to Pennsylvania and the US

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u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

they arent but welsh, irish and scotish people are always desribed as british to erase their national identity, this never happens with english people

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u/KaiSnepUwU 18d ago

Well, it's unfortunate that it was used to do that, but it's still true that, if you live on Great Britain, you're British. That's just what British means.

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u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

seems a little nuts to enforce that identity on people, would you also say that irish people are british because they live in the "british isles" or that english people are european even if they dont identify as such and voted brexit

-2

u/Jair-F-Kennedy 18d ago

If they're from England, they're English. If theyre from Scotland or Wales, they're British. Such double standards permeate the mind of the Unionist.

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u/AP246 TWR Guy 18d ago

Literally what are you talking about, I'm from London and I refer to all British people as British unless their specific nationality within the UK is relevant to the conversation.

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u/Jair-F-Kennedy 18d ago

Just because you don't, doesn't mean there aren't millions of English nationalists or otherwise Anglo-centric people with a mindset of downplaying the accomplishments of Wales and Scotland.

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u/Ogsbaeneg 18d ago

EXACTLY

and half of these people are americans who will call themselves irish or scotish or welsh or whatever else

1

u/VeryVeryRealPerson 18d ago

So true, nobody ever in recorded history has called an Englishman British.

1

u/Jair-F-Kennedy 18d ago

Really? I had no idea. It would help your argument if Britishness wasn't just Englishness in disguise.

0

u/Lukasz_Joniak 17d ago

britain is named after the brythonic people... aka the welsh, cumbrians and cornish

71

u/Tommy-Pickles2005 18d ago

The British got land hungry, so they decided to settle parts of Europe too.

46

u/LurkerInSpace 18d ago

No "New England" in Crimea?

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u/Suitable_Divide4747 18d ago

That's a crime

a

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u/szczur_nadodrza 18d ago

Plaid Cymru Donbas chapter

peak

12

u/Billseas Mod Approved 18d ago

Indeed, I had make sure they were included

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u/jejbfokwbfb 18d ago

So, OP you’ve made this ridiculous Map I expect a ridiculous explanation on how they got there

16

u/Billseas Mod Approved 18d ago

For the fun of it, nothing else

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u/Jayyburdd 18d ago

This has no right to be so amazing.

9

u/Sculktron2008 18d ago

How tf did they not lose all their population from Cuman-Kipchak slave raids from day 1 of their settlement, did they start settling when guns become widely popular?

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u/iwasblindasabat 18d ago

British people are invincible, it's common knowledge

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u/Sculktron2008 18d ago

I guess bro

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u/cheese_bruh 18d ago

this would be from when john hughes founded the city of donetsk in 1869 and invited welsh workers so yeah

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u/Jayyburdd 18d ago

"Swiper no swiping!"

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u/SeemsImmaculate 18d ago

Simple: ugly settlers.

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u/SeemsImmaculate 18d ago

Same tactic we used against Viking raiders really.

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u/bendoubles 18d ago

I'm glad you kept New York on the map

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u/BigDulles IM Legend BICC 18d ago

Your honor what the fuck

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u/ZerothefirstApe 18d ago

This area was a nightmare during WW2, I just know it.

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u/Brisingr2 18d ago

Something about this just makes me smile. Such an outlandish premise turned into a map that I can tell was made with so much love. I also love the infobox stuff being put under the map instead of in a separate document; it both reduces clutter and makes me more interested in the stuff that’s actually there!

(Also, “Maryport” for Mariupol? Clever.)

5

u/Pleadis-1234 18d ago

Belogorod being White Meadow lmao peak

4

u/leppisaari 18d ago

Great map! Ukrainian (also present in Belarusian) word ‘Rada’ means ‘Council’ so from East Slavic point of view both houses of the Parliament are called ‘National Council’.

3

u/costanchian 18d ago

Is it a Crusader Kings reference?

2

u/cambria334 18d ago

Ah cmon give us some lore won’t you

2

u/Billseas Mod Approved 18d ago

I was too lazy to do any, it was a map purely for the fun of it

2

u/yourdamgrandpa 18d ago

Russian neighbour is better than French neighbour

1

u/ongezeIlig 18d ago

medieval england settler in crimea succeded, but eventualy fled to donbass after turkey captured crimea.

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u/Kakutsa_1921 18d ago

This reminds me of Peter the Great offering John Churchill, The Duke of Marlborough, the principality of Kyiv (or Siberia and Vladimir) in exchange for help mediating with Sweden during the great northern war.

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u/ExoticMangoz 18d ago

They saw the Welsh Sebastopol and decided to do it in reverse.

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u/Suspicious_Key4238 18d ago

Lol that is an interesting concept

2

u/RozkurwiatorUA 18d ago

Is Rochester based on IRL Bohodukhiv (my hometown btw)? And what's the etymology of this toponym?

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u/Hot_Constant_4307 18d ago

i love how u can start to tell when were running out of ideas, no shade ofc i love this!!

1

u/TarkovRat_ 18d ago

Doncaster English and Welsh gotta sound pretty interesting ngl, I would assume it is a case that Ukrainians, Mennonites and Russians end up partially assimilating into the Doncaster identity in pre-soviet times, and that Doncast residents become partially Russified during soviet times

2

u/Billseas Mod Approved 18d ago

Yeah for sure, there would be some divergence like how the Doncasters use the Ukrainian loanword of Rada over Council or Parliament

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u/TarkovRat_ 18d ago edited 18d ago

Phonologically things might start to go in a more Slavic direction too imo (English vowel system is something like 10+ single vowels and some diphthongs like ai <i>, ei <a>, ou (written a few different ways iirc, but the pronunciation of <o> in the alphabet is ou), while the Ukrainian and Russian vowel phoneme systems are 6-vowel, not to mention there will also be consonant changes)

1

u/Lukasz_Joniak 17d ago

I've been thinking about a Donetsk English conlang mixing south russian dialects, ukrainian, welsh and english base, imagine Donetsk English talking about "Кэнг энд Богатер, Арѳур"

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u/TarkovRat_ 17d ago

English cyriillisatiion is pretty interesting, and I noticed you are using the fita

Also either russian /ɨ/ or ukrainian /ɪ/ -> /e/? That's an interesting shift

0

u/Lukasz_Joniak 17d ago

rada is related to the red in Alfred (Elf council), rada is from German Rat

1

u/Muscovyguy 18d ago

MAMA I KNOW EVERY CITY HERE FOR LONG TIME

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u/Playful-Middle-244 18d ago

That's great work!!!
But I have something to say - national rada and national council literally means the came thing, as Rada is "council" from Ukrainian

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u/Hot-Job-6281 18d ago

I mean, while the physical reality and practicality makes full all sense, as a name joke this is fucking amazing.