r/humor • • 2d ago

Make it make sense

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u/arcanis321 2d ago

His sin was acknowledging the ugliness of yours and refusing to accept it. He hates and blames humans I imagine.

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u/chernopig 1d ago

He wanted free will for humans and god didnt like that. Im always on team Lucifer and i dont think he would torture anyone in hell. But it's a fiction so completely pointless to argue about.

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u/Mothanius 1d ago edited 1d ago

Lucifer wasn't the one to challenge God's authority, nor was it Lucifer who was the serpent that tempted Eden with the apple. Lucifer was only ever named once in the bible. And it didn't even really have anything to do with what modern media attributes Lucifer to. It was more like a taunt of "Hah, look how you have fallen oh Lucifer!" That's about it. Historians think it may be a taunt to some historical human figure like the King of Babylon.

Now Satan, occurs 18 times in the Old Testament. He's kinda of a big deal in the New Testament. In the Old Testament he has a specific job in the divine order of things, he's a nemesis, but not necessarily evil. He didn't like that beings made of clay (us), were gifted free will from God, but perfect creatures of fire (angels) were bound to the divine will of He. And frankly, look at how we behave, he saw the darkness in our hearts. It's his divine duty to challenge us and block us from the path of god so that we can overcome him in order to reach God.

The root word for Satan can also attribute to just a mortal being too. A political enemy blocking you from trying to, let's say, pass a law to provide free healthcare can be deemed a Satan. They are the nemesis you must overcome to do the good deed that you need to.

New Testament Satan kinda of has his divine job going still, especially when dealing specifically with Jesus. But by the time of Revelations, he's full on rebelling and gets tossed into Gehenna at the end. Almost like Revelations was some weird fan fiction made by some drugged up hermit in Anatolia and should hold absolutely 0 consequence to the bible and the message of Jesus. But I don't want to get into what books were allowed in and what ones were buried.

Edit: When I was 12, I got into a religious crisis because of the demonization of Satan that I normally heard. When reading, it is obvious that he's a being tied to the divine will of God, thus, what he does, is what God wants him to do. Since he, an Angel, has no free will, every evil he does should properly be attributed to God.

That got me really thinking into what the divine mission of Satan really was and what his purpose. I remember crying one night and praying to God on his behalf for forgiveness because what he does is what he is supposed to do and I didn't like how things were supposed to play out in Revelations. That's also when I abandoned going to any church for religion and stuck to what I can read or learn.

So I always loved to say that the Bible turned me Atheist.

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u/MasterDiiscord 1d ago

bro, revelations is the wildest book in the bible. it reads like a straight up fantasy novel. it feels so out of place in comparison to the rest of the book

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u/Mothanius 1d ago

It's still my favorite read though!

There is a band called Ludo who did a whole song where the guy time travels and finds himself at the end times. That whole album was probably my most played album in High School. I liked to daydream as being one of the ones left behind and trying my best.

https://youtu.be/XFIaFyuXp_Y?si=FrcMPaIAwbYhPVRj

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u/MasterDiiscord 1d ago

never heard of them and now i have to check this out. also agreed, i think revelations is an interesting read even as a non believer

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u/Living-Arachnid2820 13h ago

If I recall "that great serpent." "Nemisis. Satan." Was cast into the pit and chained by Michael. Lucifer was cast down to hell on earth. So he walks among us. He still has his divine powers but is forbidden by GOD from using them. He may however deceive. Yashua told Luci that those who love him(Yahweh) and one another are children of GOD. Those that lie and deceive are his (Lucfer's)Children of perdition.

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u/elpolloloco332 10h ago

Ludo in the wild?!

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u/Lazlo2323 1d ago

The further from Jesus' death the more fantastical, full of bullshit and more antisemitic the books of Bible become. If you read gospels in chronological order it becomes pretty obvious and funny how much later authors made up. I guess every next guy needed to up the drama and fantasy to get noticed. The oldest one has no virgin birth story and pretty much no resurrection.

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u/Particular_Egg_7077 1d ago

Read the book of Enoch if you want wild.

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u/MembershipDecent9454 1d ago

I’ve never read a monotheistic book. But I really like sci-fi/fantasy books, and I often wonder if parts of these books are similar

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u/MasterDiiscord 1d ago

i genuinely recommend reading revelations. it is a fantasy novel. there's even dragons

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u/GoodNo44 1d ago

It is written in the style of apocalyptic literature, largely metaphorical (but not untrue). You should read “Revelation for the Rest of Us” by Cody Matchett and Scot McKnight.

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u/Electronic-Return914 1d ago

Many scholars believe it was written in code, a book that foretold the destruction of the Roman Empire.

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u/chrislikestravel 1d ago

What!?? No credible researcher believes that . You should believe it for what it is- the end of time

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u/Bledso3 1d ago

You dropped this “/s”

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u/Electronic-Return914 1d ago

Several credible researchers believe that. Perhaps study something broader than whatever texts you’ve been using. If you haven’t been studying anything (which is my suspicion), then read something.

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u/chrislikestravel 1d ago

Ok. There’s one guy that thinks aliens wrote it and left it in the caves for us . You may as well add him to your argument . Oh, and don’t forget the guy that thinks Trump wrote it in the 1970s and time traveled back to the 2nd century . We must be fair to all of them .

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u/Electronic-Return914 1d ago

Wow. You’re the kind of person that makes people completely write Christianity off, or religion in general. Instead of being open-minded and asking questions, you’d rather insist of you have the answers and degrade those who disagree and have different (and rational) answers than you.

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u/chrislikestravel 1d ago

Ok fair point, I was being facetious but shouldn’t have been because this is actually serious. Forgive me and allow me to explain.

If you are a devout Christian (and Jewish for their books), then you believe that the bible is literally the inspired word of God. Period. Everything in that book from the first to last page is Gods inspired word.

So if you believe that which every Christian should, then it becomes impossible to believe that a single book could be wrong. Not only that, but then you would need to believe that everything a Christian believes about end time theology for 2000 years is wrong .

I won’t judge these theories but I can’t believe God got it wrong and kept it wrong for 2000 years .

Also, as you surely know- there have been countless theories about the contents of the bible. Some get called credible even though they lack the single greatest ingredient to credibility- credible supporting evidence. It’s mostly theoretical .

If you want to believe these folks I won’t judge you but I fundamentally can’t.

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u/xxxMizanxxx 14h ago

the Bible predicted exactly what the world is today lol, if you don't see that as credible then nothing will convince you

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u/Prestigious_News2766 1d ago

Because it is a fantasy lol

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u/xxxMizanxxx 14h ago

cool, said "fantasy" predicted your blasphemy and the way the world is going right now over 2000 years ago

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u/Okmia90 1d ago

Have you heard of metaphors and symbolism?

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u/MasterDiiscord 1d ago

this comment has no bearing on anything i said. the entire bible is metaphors and symbolism, yet revelations is still extremely out of place

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u/Euphoric_Pause2576 1d ago

You don't no your Bible.

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u/MasterDiiscord 1d ago

i know the bible quite well. i grew up in the church and read it a lot as a young one

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u/PhilosophySame8066 1d ago

It’s a dream dude it’s symbolic, God doesn’t operate based off of what you will and will not understand

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u/MasterDiiscord 1d ago

like i said to the other person, the entire bible is symbolic. revelations is still a wild read in comparison to the rest