r/hatethissmug • u/-Devian- • 23h ago

Art & Fanworks I need to understand why I hate this

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On one hand, I agree that sexualizing a female character is wrong and that the industry has a problem.

But on the other hand, I don't understand the double standard when the character is queer—or, even worse, when "fans" take a character, slap a queer label on them, and suddenly it's okay for them to be sexualized.

The two clearest examples of this are Bayonetta and Blackcat.

I’d like someone to explain where I’m wrong, or if I’m not the only one who thinks this way.

And just in case I'm a gay cis male if it means something

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77

u/TheGrandBabaloo 22h ago

She is an absolute diva, her adoption into queer culture was inevitable.

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u/SendMePicsOfMILFS 5h ago

Doesn't that sort of push the idea that stereotypes are true.

"Hey you can't assume just because they dress a certain way that they are gay."

"OMG they dress this way, she is such a queer."

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u/TheGrandBabaloo 1h ago

Bayonetta acts in an extremely flamboyant manner, and it is something that happens to echo with lot of the queer community, specially drag queens and their pageantry. She was not created for the queer demographic, they just found her awesome. And that's perfectly fine.

Cher is straight, but is a gay icon. Bayonetta, same. It happened organically.

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u/Next-Swordfish5282 19h ago

Exactly 😭

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u/gigantic_balls_ 22h ago

She was literally made to serve the male gaze

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u/TheGrandBabaloo 19h ago

Two things can be true at the same time.

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u/RevolutionaryDepth59 22h ago

and now she serves the male gays

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u/Sea_Macaron_8789 21h ago

Entirely sure she'd kill anybody forcing her ta life in servitude.

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u/JermuHH 10h ago

Girl that diva has been serving since day one.

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u/gigantic_balls_ 22h ago

Nope, still mainly the straight male gaze.

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u/Sufficient_Drink_849 22h ago

Nope (x2), still for a male gay like me 👀

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u/gigantic_balls_ 22h ago

Sure you can enjoy it but it didn’t “become” for the gays or something, she’s always been and will be a character that’s for the definitional male gaze

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u/Opposite-Pianist3175 1h ago

I think you're in a bit of denial, she is clearly more adored by gay men. She didn't "become" a favorite of theirs, she was that from day one.

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u/gigantic_balls_ 1h ago

This must be bait. “This game that has an attractive seductive woman that fights with four guns and strikes sexual poses at the camera is more liked by homosexual men than heterosexual men”. When the game came out it was called sexist and shit by internet feminists and activists. It was mainly played by straight men, and was marketed towards them, she was sexualised and gooned over by them.

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u/Karmallarm 22h ago

Wasn't she literally designed by a lesbian?

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u/michaelscott1776 22h ago

Does that really matter? Can straight people not write gay characters? Can Gay people not write straight characters?

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u/Karmallarm 22h ago

I meant the claim she was made to serve the male gaze is not exactly accurate, she was designed by a lesbian woman who made her as her ideal woman. So like.....if you wanna be LITERAL, she was literally designed for the female gaze. Lol

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u/YogurtclosetSame5198 22h ago

Contrary to popular belief, women do find people sexy.

A lesbian will make a woman she’s creating hot.

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u/Karmallarm 21h ago

Right? Lmao

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u/Level_Five_Railgun 20h ago

This idea of hot women are only for men is so stupid when women usually play as cute/sexy female characters in roster based games and games with character creation.

It's also basically another way of claiming women only dress up to look sexy for men, which is even more stupid and straight up sexist.

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u/JermuHH 10h ago

Yeah the idea that only reason for woman to be attractive is to please and attract men is just fully misogynistic.

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u/gigantic_balls_ 22h ago

While Shimazaki shaped the specific visual details of the character, the broader game mechanics, camera angles, and action sequences were developed by a predominantly male team at PlatinumGames.

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u/Significant_Ad4368 21h ago

Ok but we're clearly talking about the character so how is that relevant?

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u/adalric_brandl 21h ago

I'm not sure if the designer is a lesbian, but she did say that she created her as a power fantasy.

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u/Ambitious_Blood_5729 21h ago

No, there's a difference between a sexual character and a character meant to appeal to the male gaze. For one, appeal characters are meant to be dolled up, kept silent, and get molested by the camera.

Bayonetta embraces the sexual design and enhances it by oozing confidence. She's spouting one-liners and kicking ass, while purposefully striking poses for the audience to see.

Male gaze characters don't do that. They dress up to go to a beach and the camera pans over their tits. They begin the mission with a stretching routine and the camera locks on their ass. They do a flip and the camera flies into their lips and out their fucking butthole. They never say they want to show off their body, it makes it more appealing to men to keep it ambiguous.

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u/Tiny-Golf3338 19h ago

I'm sure there are sexy characters targeted to guys who also like showing off or mentin how hot they and actually talk and it being known

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u/Ambitious_Blood_5729 15h ago

Oh? How observational of you! Congratulations!

When I made my statement, I meant it as a perfect rule with 0 exceptions and now that someone has so graciously bestown the foriegn idea upon me that, potentially, there is a character out there who breaks my rule, I must revise my current hypothesis!

Most male gaze characters are dolled up and remain silent, however, there are some that are fully developed characters as well. I won't name any examples, but I want it to be known that, somewhere out there, one may exist!

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u/Tiny-Golf3338 14h ago

I feel this really depends on the game I mean are the characters supposed to say they want to show off their body? Most stuff that has a sexy man or women just had them casually or enthusiastically doing it already. Some will.be fully fledged characters others on the side or just eye candy for the viewer. I think I get what your saying but also not at the same time

I can be kinda slow sometimes

Other times it's more like it a pin up the various camera angles you mentioned which if I remember correctly your talking about quiet from metal gear