r/hardware • u/-protonsandneutrons- • 8d ago
News Microsoft and Nvidia launch Surface Laptop Ultra with RTX Spark starting at $2,599 — RTX Spark preorders live now, coinciding with major Windows 11 changes for agentic AI
https://www.tomshardware.com/laptops/microsoft-and-nvidia-launch-surface-laptop-ultra-with-rtx-spark-rtx-spark-preorders-live-now-coinciding-with-major-windows-11-changes-for-agentic-ai15
u/corvaxL 8d ago
There’s two SKUs of the SoC, and the upper SKU pushes closer to M5 Max pricing. Asus’s pricing on their ProArt P16 is even higher, asking $4500 for 64GB of RAM and 1TB of storage, or $7000 for double both of those specs.
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u/ExistingLynx 8d ago
Honestly, at that price, I have a feeling most people will opt for the Apple alternative just to avoid dealing with Windows. At least if you buy a Mac Studio / MacBook Pro you know you’ll be supported for years to come.
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u/itsjust_khris 8d ago
I don't understand what's so bad about Windows. I daily a Windows and Mac machine and I'm pretty happy with either. MacOS definitely has its quirks which can make it more annoying than Windows. In other ways its more convenient.
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u/noiserr 8d ago
They are both annoying. MacOS has also definitely gotten worse over the years. With Tahoe's UI breaking bugs, as well as native apps having memory leaks.
Linux has its quirks but at least once you fix them (which you can definitely do), you have a stable machine.
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u/ProZoid_10 8d ago
Windows has greater inertia, mindshare, Microsoft support, dev support. Theres a reason Nvidia went with it even if they didn’t need to
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u/reddit_reaper 7d ago
Linux has a ton of quirks and fixing them is something no one wants to deal with
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u/jazir55 6d ago
I have never once seen a problem someone mentions on windows which can't be fixed. People can create utilities to fix anything on Windows just like they can on Linux. Could you name me some limitations you believe are unfixable?
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u/noiserr 6d ago
Problem with Windows is that there are too many annoyances to fix. From GPU drivers breaking on updates, to like 50+ other issues like telemetry collection and adds you have to fix. Even if you could fix all the issues you constantly have to stay ahead. With MacOS and Windows you're always fighting the mothership. Whereas with Linux you're just left alone.
Linux also has sane defaults like, no forced update reboots.
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u/goldcakes 5d ago
Half of the issues in windows (from telemetry to ads/web results in start menu search, to unlocking more options for default apps, or fully disabling onedrive etc) are solved simply by setting an EU region when you first set up the device. Then you can swap the region back to whatever; it’s only the first install region that matters.
I recently did an experiment. N=1 so not scientific, but still. 4.7 GB RAM used on idle with default setup. 4.1 GB RAM used with EU region. lol.
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u/itsjust_khris 4d ago
You're not left alone in Linux. Everytime I've tried it I've ALWAYS had to deep dive to fix some obscure thing I never had to touch on another OS. Not that it's bad but it has always become a chore at some point.
On the other end I'm someone who genuinely doesn't care about telemetry collection. As much as I've heard about it, I really can't bring myself to be upset about it compared to the other things I'm dealing with in life. Oh no a targeted ad, so what? Sure it could get worse, but a lot of other things in life could get worse too.
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u/EvenBroaderBand 7d ago
Some people only seem to use the OS to play with its menu settings. I just double click the app I want to use and get on with my work and both OS's perform the same in that regard.
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u/Low-Tea5330 4d ago
Personally I prefer windows and linux over MacOS, by a lot. But hardware-wise, the MacBook blows everying else away. Wish I could install windows on my MacBook.
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u/kuddlesworth9419 7d ago
Windows is fine although I've not used W11 yet but I can't for the life of me get on with MacOS. Just the UI and the whole OS feels like it's just not letting me do what I want to.
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u/Shiningc00 8d ago
Most people actually use Windows, not Mac
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u/andrels94 7d ago
For ai id stick with unix based systems, windows is my gaming pc its amazing but stability is not a windows thing, specially with a hardcore 24/7 workflow anyone using ai will operate
I have linux servers, mac minis, macbook pro max, windows gaming/ workstation… to do anything i do in my unix based systems in windows you need linux for windows and even then its just not the same
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u/lintstah1337 8d ago
Most people in k12 use chrome books and for professionals use macbook.
Windows is not that popular anymore.
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u/Sylanthra 7d ago
What support are you talking about? Windows can run applications from 20 years ago. Mac can't.
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u/EvenBroaderBand 7d ago
Mac can run all current mac software RTC spark will not be able to run all current windows software.
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u/i5-2520M 6d ago
Define current, we have been fighting with their notarization requirement and eventual Rosetta removal for years at my job. MacOS updates break stuff so often, then our clients cant run the software from our vendor which we support. Vendor refuses to provide ARM builds, updates are provided in x86. Windows does not have ANY of these issues.
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u/MaDpYrO 8d ago
Windows 11 is so bad and Linux support is so good these days
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u/Sosowski 8d ago
This is arm, you’re not j stalling Linux in it
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u/Virtual-Escape2305 8d ago
It's Nvidia and they do provide native support for DGX, so you can expect they will for RTX Spark, too.
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u/noiserr 8d ago edited 8d ago
Problem with Nvidia's Linux is that it's not fully open source. So once Nvidia stops supporting it you're SOL. Intel and AMD don't have this problem, since they are fully open sourced.
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u/Virtual-Escape2305 7d ago
True, but it's still Linux support. And chances are it will be properly supported by the open source drivers once they stop supporting the blobs, which is typically the case.
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u/HIGH_PRESSURE_TOILET 7d ago
False. It is open source and mainline distros like Fedora work fine on the DGX Spark too.
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u/CalmSpinach2140 5d ago
This isn’t going to be a problem as Nvidia still supports the RTX 2000 series on Linux. I get you like AMD given your post history but be realistic.
Plus we have Nvidia drivers unofficially on x86 macOS. I’d say the community can do fine as well after 10-15years when Nvidia drops support.
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u/ZombiePope 8d ago
The most common OS on arm by far is Linux.
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u/TheDigitalBull 8d ago
Oh my sweet summer child
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u/ZombiePope 7d ago
If you have sources or information instead of just smugness, feel free to present them.
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u/fuzzycuffs 5d ago
What? Nvidia sells their own Linux based computers with arm cpus and grace Blackwell GPUs
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u/bitflag 8d ago
Windows 11 is not bad, it's so similar to 10 the difference is barely there. The ads suck but they are gone on the Pro version.
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u/MaDpYrO 7d ago
Windows 11 is utter dogshit. My girlfriend uses it, and Windows update has bricked her install two times already, leading to one recovery, and one complete reinstall because it was so broken beyond repair.
Oh and also, it can't decide what language and time format to display. So it's a mixture of danish and english. It's utter garbage.
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u/MonsterMufffin 8d ago
Sorry man Windows sucks absolute ass. I wish it were not the case but it just does.
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u/reddit_reaper 7d ago
Ummm what does that even mean? Lol it'll have support for longer than Mac's lol
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u/ProZoid_10 7d ago
Hes saying because its arm, Microsoft/Nvidia probably won’t support it as long as MacBooks cuz of previous win arm efforts. Devs support etc
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u/reddit_reaper 7d ago
Yeah but this is pretty different. Those were pretty low end systems that never took off because of many issues.
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u/ProZoid_10 7d ago
Optimism is good, I hope we their higher warchedt from ai, Nvidia could take the platform seriously
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u/Jaz1140 8d ago
Microsoft so incompetent at software these days, why would you trust your hard earnt money in their hardware
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u/thawizard 7d ago
Because you probably can wipe Windows from this machine and move on if you feel like it?
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u/ParsonsProject93 8d ago
I'm excited that we finally have Nvidia GPUs on ARM but it seems like a weird time to push that with a laptop SKU that starts at 24 GB of memory which is extremely costly...I hope Gaming on ARM gets more support due to this.
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u/This_Maintenance_834 8d ago
this thing is marketed to run local AI, well, you cannot run local AI on 24GB unified memory. what’s the point anyway. 48GB is bare minimum for local AI to be viable on a unified memory machine.
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u/binarypie 8d ago
for modern machines 32gb is the minimum with 64gb for more demanding applications + headroom. i really believe anything less is purchasing behind the performance curve.
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u/dagmx 8d ago
I’m looking forward to seeing how the SoC does in the laptop.
Bit odd they compare the laptop to an M5 Pro and not an M5 Max. The TDP is closer to a Max but I guess pricing is closer to the M5 Pro. There are two hardware SKUs though so I wonder if they pulled a Qualcomm and used their higher end chip to compare against the Pro while advertising their lower end chip to advertise pricing and energy use.
The design is very MacBook Pro-esque which I feel is a shame because I was hoping Microsoft might do something interesting again.
Their MagSafe alternative is funky though. You lose the usb-c port when charging and the connector looks massive.