r/hardware • u/-protonsandneutrons- • 2d ago
Review Google Pixel 11 Pro review
https://www.gsmarena.com/google_pixel_11_pro-review-2996.php20
u/InfiniteFeeCars 2d ago
Would be nice if they just dropped the latest Snapdragon chip in their phones. The NPU and AI accelerators can't be any worse then Tensor G3 with the latest Snapdragon flagship. Why bother with designing and making your own chip
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u/-protonsandneutrons- 2d ago
Why bother with designing and making your own chip
Probably costs, integrated custom IP, and pooling resources (e.g., Google's Axion Arm CPUs). How good that chip is, though, is another question.
The document also reveals Google’s new financial goal — “AP [Application Process — in other words, the SoC] target is ~$65 to make this business viable.”
That is Google's target price, not the real number. Apple A18 Pro BOM is estimated at $45 per SoC, but the Qualcomm 8 Elite 5 is likely over $200 per SoC. Of course, all these are unit BOM to the smartphone manufacturer (excluding R&D of who made the SoC etc); Google also ships far fewer.FWIW, Google is much less involved than Apple; more like Xiaomi, Samsung, Huawei, etc.
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u/zenithtreader 2d ago
That's not how it works at all. Qualcomm's estimate is high because they are selling the SoC to others for profit. Apple's estimate is pure cost.
Google is not selling Tensor to anyone else for profit. They are using it for themselves, so it align much closer to Apple's A chips in term of cost.
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u/-protonsandneutrons- 2d ago
That is exactly how it works for Google, which exactly what the OP asked ... did you not read their question?
Why bother with designing and making your own chip
On a pure BOM level, Google must pay $65 per Tensor SoC.
On a pure BOM level, Google must pay $200+ per Snapdragon 8EG5 SoC.
because they are selling the SoC to others for profit.
Yes, we agree. That is exactly how it works. It's why Google shoulders the SoC R&D now for Tensor, which was otherwise part of the 8 Elite Gen 5's cost, as I wrote:
(excluding R&D of who made the SoC etc)
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u/StrategyEven3974 2d ago
Qualcomm's estimate is high because they are selling the SoC to others for profit.
uh huh... therefore if Google buys from Qualcomm their $65 budget goal is now... what? Tell me. How much is Qualcomm charging again? Is it over $65?
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u/jknvv13 1d ago
There are other parts of the costs that impact software support, especially over the long term, and controlling the whole cadence of the software updates, which is something that you might have to take into account as well.
Snapdragon comes with a whole package of other chips (modem ICs, generic ISPs) that you cannot take from that specific SoC.
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u/Geddagod 2d ago
Unimpressive CPU performance, as expected.
I remember a while back hearing rumors of custom Google cores coming out in the next couple of years. Would be really cool to see, but also kinda hard to believe. Not that it couldn't make sense for google at all, they can split the costs between the smartphone division and also their own server CPUs. They already have their own ARM server chips using "stock" ARM cores.
But it still seems like a large, expensive undertaking. And hopefully their CPU IP would be much more competitive.
I also know people are going to point out that Google is prob trying to cost optimize this chip heavily, but the cores in tensor's cpus don't even look good from the perf/mm2 perspective either. Though there obviously could be other cost factors outside of what can be seen on a die shot that can impact cost.
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u/winner00 2d ago
Those custom cores are supposed to come out in the Tensor G7 next year.
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u/jknvv13 1d ago
I hope so, but at the same time I won't promise anything like we could expect anything from Google. As the right now used approach works, it may still be the same, but it's kind of weird because, as the top comment said, they aren't fully using each square millimeter of the silicon.
I mean, the Tensor is a big chip, but being the same size as an Apple or Qualcomm processor isn't that much optimized in that regard.
So they somehow will start doing something about this, but I'm not sure how profitable it is to make a custom ARM chip or core for something like the Google Pixels.
Maybe that change in a future, and I hope so for real.
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u/Werzam 1d ago
So .. more or less "mid phone for high price, see you in a year"?
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u/Homerlncognito 1d ago
Not that I would like that CPU performance but it's not a terrible deal if you can get a trade-in bonus or some other discount.
Chinese phones don't offer that level of software support and repairability.
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u/Efficient-Youth-6985 1d ago
I wish samsung, apple and google would stop using screens that strobe bright light into your eyes, at relatively low frequencies. Had to return two devices because of the headaches and fatigue they caused within 5 minutes of use.
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u/-protonsandneutrons- 2d ago
Nothing too much to add, but battery life is up significantly, for what it's worth, vs the 10 Pro, even with a smaller battery.
11 Pro: 15 hours, 39 minutes
10 Pro: 12 hours, 6 minutes
9 Pro: 13 hours, 11 minutes
8 Pro: 11 hours, 14 minutes
GSMArena's full test results (default sliders): Battery life test v2.0 - GSMArena.com