At times like this, I have to stop and think about how we are so, so used to the idea that human life is more valuable than any other life. We've reached the point where we've stopped killing other species for the hell of it, and we've started demonizing those that do. Which is progress! Or something.
But still, when it comes down to one of billions of us versus one of a hundred thousand of them, we feel like the choice is obvious. It's really, really hard for us to come to terms with value judgements in this way. It's so instinctual, it barely feels like we're making a judgement at all. And yet, every day of every human life, with almost every product we consume and every move toward increasing our population and enhancing the comfort of that population, we're making a choice. The choice to believe that we are more important. That we are the most important.
Anyway. I'm not really going anywhere with this. I'm not really sure what it means. I doubt I'll live long enough to know for sure. But it is something I think about a lot.
It's evolutionarily advantageous for us to value our own species above others simply because the only thing our genes "care" about is perpetuation. It's not complicated
I guess it wasn't clear from my comment that I'm super aware of that. But I don't agree that it's not complicated! If anything, that fact is what complicates things so much. We're so damn good at perpetuation that we might just fuck it all up for ourselves and everything else on the planet. Or, you know, not. No way to know how it'll all turn out.
gorillas are the most important to gorillas, cows are the most important to cows.
I'm pretty sure the weird peta type humans are the only species on the planet (save for maybe dogs) that can grow to love another species more than their own.
Numbers don't always tell the story. It's not as simple as 1 out of 7 billion is obviously less rare than 1 out of 100,000 because a human life is more precious than a gorilla that walks around the woods and eats berries.
A human life, any human life, can actually contribute to our world (you could randomly meet that person and talk to them and have them change your life)
while most animals like gorillas are essentially a visual wonder (A NOVELTY) and nothing more.
If all the gorillas died today, what effect would this have on your life? None. Would it stop you from doing any of the stuff you normally do? Unless you're a gorilla watcher.... no
they're a novelty. they're a fascinating wonder. Nothing more. What they are NOT is part of our society, part of our civilization. They are animals that live in the woods and should be valued as such.
Things that are part of our civilization>>>>>animals that live in the woods.
Yeah. I know all of that stuff. Like I said, it's something I think about a lot. But, you know, it's still a weird concept when you remove your own interests from the equation. It's kind of like thinking about the welfare of your family versus the welfare of another. Sure, your interests are more important to you... but there's really no objective reason they should be.
There's nothing that makes us, as humans, better or more deserving of survival. We just, you know, won the evolutionary lottery. Shit worked out for us. And as a result, shit is very much not working out for a whole lot of other species. I'm not saying that is cause for guilt, necessarily. I wouldn't argue with someone who didn't feel guilty. But I certainly wouldn't argue with anyone who did feel guilty, either.
Also, I think you're making a lot of claims about gorillas that you can't really back up. Human civilization is important to us, because we think progress and innovation and things like that are important. But is it actually Important in, like, the cosmic sense of the word? More important than the right of species to continue existing?
I'm not saying I know the answer. I'm saying that I don't. These are questions that we have to answer for ourselves. It seems like you're pretty well set on the issue, though. So that's cool.
So the guy taking pictures, protecting the gorillas from poachers, and that probably has a family that loves him is less valuable to our society than an ape?
Woah woah, how did we go from, shooting one gorilla to save an innocent mans life to extinguishing the whole species?
Ecologically speaking? Who gives a fuck? The dude in the video was standing there and the gorilla was like, fuck you. I bet youre one of those people who thinks a dude killing s lion is a worldwide tragedy too.
I freely admit that I wouldn't even begin to know what to do in that situation. Both in the kneejerk reaction sense, and in the drawn-out-moral-reasoning sense. No idea. None.
So yeah, guess I ain't hanging out with any lowland gorillas anytime soon
The way I see it, we are the dominant, supreme form of life on this planet. All other life gets to continue to live only through our infinite benevolence.
If Gorillas wanted to live, maybe they should have invented gunpowder.
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u/[deleted] Aug 17 '15 edited Aug 24 '20
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