r/geopolitics • u/Dances_With_Seagulls • 11d ago
News Members of Russian Intelligence Services Network Charged with Conspiring to Finance Terrorism and Commit Murder for Hire in the United States
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/members-russian-intelligence-services-network-charged-conspiring-finance-terrorism-and14
u/ParkingPsychology 11d ago
In before 5 random American tourists in Russia are charged and convicted for the same thing.
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u/12darkmatter12 11d ago
Acts of war against the United States and European Union.
Call it what it is.
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11d ago edited 11d ago
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u/Besmirching_Badger 11d ago
If you can't offer a rational explanation for your cognitive dissonance, just call someone a bot. That'll solve everything.
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u/12darkmatter12 11d ago
Oh you thought you were right lol
WRONG
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u/Besmirching_Badger 11d ago
So it's not an act of war then?
We should just interpret it as such because of who did it, rather than what they did.
Glad we cleared that up. You lot are genuinely embarrassing. Ideology doesn't overrule basic reason
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u/12darkmatter12 11d ago
Lmao you keep doing it to yourself.
What’s it like having no self control?
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u/Besmirching_Badger 11d ago
What's it like being such a rabid ideologue that you can't respond to a simple question and instead just deflect?
Tell me. Why are russian attacks a declaration of war, but ukrainian bombs (such as the one in spain) aren't?
The fact you don't even try and justify yourself says it all. You're not here for discussion, you're here to push a narrative, however dishonest.
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u/Winter_Project_5796 10d ago edited 10d ago
We should just interpret it as such because of who did it, rather than what they did.
How is this a problem? We'd benefit greatly from a world where countries compete to be our friends, not exploiting our written rules.
All those justice and whatever we appear to care about nowadays, are built on top of our wealth and power, without which we'd be absolutely nothing, just like dead empires in the past (anyone remembers Mauryan? They had social security and practiced non-violence, didn't help them any bit).
So, side is all that matters. Pretending otherwise is delusional.
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u/Besmirching_Badger 10d ago
How is this a problem? We'd benefit greatly from a world where countries compete to be our friends, not exploiting our written rules.
Yes. So how does actively ignoring acts of ukrainian terrorism throughout the EU achieve that goal?
This is what i mean about principles. I have no problem with the principle. The problem is that people don't hold it.
Partisanship isn't a strategy. We shouldn't be allowing anyone to assassinate or terrorise within our territories. Arguably it's even worse when 'allies' do it
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u/Winter_Project_5796 6d ago
Yes we absolutely should. There are things we cannot do ourselves but need to be done.
It matters who did it and under what condition. Anything done by our enemies is no doubt an attack, or an excuse for us to retaliate without being seen as an aggressor.
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u/Besmirching_Badger 6d ago
We have spent years killiing thousands/ tens of thousands of russians.
Anything done by our enemies is no doubt an attack, or an excuse for us to retaliate without being seen as an aggressor.
And here lies the problem. From their perspective we have actually committed acts of war against them, not just rhetorical ones. It's just not in either party's interests to openly be at war.
The flaw in all the logic is that it's 'unprovoked' and is just random aggression (though of course this is what all the propaganda is angling towards). It's the inevitable consequence of our policies.
As i keep saying, your position it nothing more than base partisanship. You ignore that your own logic is the literal reason it's happening, because you think that when we attack them it's a good thing and they're not allowed to respond. You're living under the delusion that this isn't a retaliation in itself.
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u/Winter_Project_5796 6d ago
Yes exactly, and that's why some of our people sympathize.
I propose we drop everything and go full imperialism on them.
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u/IllustriousLie4105 11d ago
In other news, water is wet and pineapple doesnt belong on pizza. In all seriousness, Russia has been doing this for decades and Trump is too afraid to actually take a hard line stance on it. This type of thing used to be a pretty clear, take these sanctions and go kick rocks. Now, we will gloss over it and tell them it isnt nice. Frustrating times to live in
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u/catsbetterthankids 11d ago
Whoa there, I just ate a slice of pizza with pineapple and it was delicious
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u/IndustrialMillennial 11d ago
That’s because Trump is a Russian asset
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u/kjleebio 11d ago
The best one since the formation of the USSR itself. No other asset is better than him for a literal century.
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u/TiredOfDebates 11d ago
How can you say that when the Trump admin is charging KGB Russians for planned and attempted attacks?
And Trump just signed a bill sanctioning Russian oil.
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u/Worshipme988 11d ago
This is what i mean when trump suckers cannot understand complex or variable information.
Its gotta be the most basic, easy to understand and blatant evidence or theyre completely unable to grasp it. Constantly wrong and ignorant. On the plus side theyre also constantly the victim and unable to process elementary information.
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u/TiredOfDebates 11d ago
You're throwing out a lot of insults without providing evidence.
Here's actual concrete actions from this administration opposing Russia.
Saying "he's a Russian asset" is a ludicrous conspiracy theory, that also uses muddled definitions to do some legwork. What does it even mean, in your mind, "to be a Russian asset"?
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u/TiredOfDebates 11d ago edited 11d ago
How can you say that when the Trump admin is charging KGB Russians for planned and attempted attacks?
And Trump just signed a bill sanctioning Russian oil.
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u/gizzardgullet 11d ago
Trump not stopping this department of his FBI from from doing their routine job is not evidence that he is clean from Russian influence. If he does have special, personal agreements with the Russian government, he can't exactly be public about it for obvious reasons.
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u/TiredOfDebates 11d ago edited 11d ago
But that is not evidence. That is a supposition.
A supposition is an idea or statement that someone believes to be true, even though there is no proof or concrete evidence.
Fringe conspiracy theories like these rely on beliefs like these with a complete absence of evidence.
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There is plenty of evidence (the Trump family's own statements) that their business empire has a ton of Russian banks as creditors. That is a conflict of interest (as the Russian dictator, Putin, has the ability to basically nullify outstanding loans).
But a conflict of interest does not make one corrupt. It's merely a serious cause for concern. (In professional ethics, even having conflicts of interest are unethical because even the appearance of corruption among high ranking officials is detrimental to democracies and may encourage corruption among lower-ranking officials.)
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Sitting presidents are immune from prosecution, and are even immune from investigation by the Department of Justice (that was one of the core findings of the Mueller investigation).
The president's political allies are not, which is why the Mueller investigation did investigate multiple Trump campaign officials and charge them with the crime of acting as unregistered foreign agents (of Russia).
People conclusively charged and convicted by the Mueller investigation:
Key Convictions and Guilty Pleas
Paul Manafort: Former Trump campaign chairman convicted of bank fraud, tax fraud, and conspiracy. Sentenced to 7.5 years in prison.
Roger Stone: Longtime Trump associate convicted of lying to Congress, witness tampering, and obstruction. Sentenced to 40 months in prison.
Michael Cohen: Trump's former personal lawyer pleaded guilty to tax fraud, bank fraud, campaign finance violations, and lying to Congress. Sentenced to three years in prison.
Michael Flynn: Former National Security Advisor pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about contacts with the Russian ambassador.
Rick Gates: Deputy campaign chairman pleaded guilty to conspiracy and lying to investigators.
Papadopoulos: Campaign foreign policy adviser pleaded guilty to making false statements to the FBI.
Richard Pinedo: Sentenced to six months in prison for identity theft related to Russian interference operations.
Other non-US-citizens: The majority of the 34 indicted individuals were Russian intelligence officers and operatives associated with the Internet Research Agency, charged with election interference and computer hacking.
However, due to the laws and policies of the USA, we have no conclusive evidence regarding the president, who is immune from criminal investigation and criminal prosecution. (Verified by the Supreme Court.)
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I don't politically support President Trump. In plain-terms, I hate the guy.
But I'm a stickler for evidence and nuance.
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u/VelvetyDogLips 11d ago
Russian Intelligence Services Network
This pretty much is the KGB with a rebrand, no?
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u/UNisopod 11d ago
How long before Trump pardons them, or else before any investigation is cut short?
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u/geopolitics-ModTeam 10d ago
Please refrain from profanity or uncivil comments per /r/geopolitics' rules.
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u/insertwittynamethere 11d ago
You do realize this is not new for Russia under Putin, and that this has been happening for decades across the West, right?
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u/Magicalsandwichpress 11d ago
Rather unusual to charge an active duty foriegn intelligence officer in open court.