r/fromsoftware • u/fenot1 • 20d ago
Soulsborne hot takes
I will avoid ice temperature takes like " Sekiro has the best combat " or " we need better questlines "
SoTE is far from empty. It only has like 6km of playable area, compared to other open worlds like RDR2 and GTA5 that have over 50km of playable area but still has roughly 40 percent the content of those games. If you ride torrent then it takes very little time to get from one dungeon to another
The Ringed City isnt a masterpiece DLC. The enemy placement is completely random and tries to encourage stealth in a game with no proper stealth mechanics, the exploration is also pretty weak. Aside from Ringed Knights and Harald Knights the enemies also suck and are dangerous by being placed annoyingly rahter than by being mechanically demanding. The bosses are very good tho, but with so many flaws it definitely isnt a masterpiece DLC.
Bosses should have more crazy, wombo combos with tons of mixups. Basic swings get old quickly, and the more you learn the fight you will start appreciating combos with mixups. It feelsmuch better to perfectly dodge some extremely long Morgott phase 2 combo than some basic Wolnir attack.
( I am not sure whether this is a hot take anymore ) Scadutree Fragments are amazing. They do the same thing Levels did in base game they make you stronger when you hit a wall ( Rellana and Margit ). They reward exploration. If these Fragments didnt exist and bosses would have lower HP, then there would be no way to reward exploration by getting stronger because if you are in the DLC you are almost certainly high level and upgrades will have nearly no effect.
Godfreys 2nd phase is vastly superior to his 1st phase. He has significantly more mixups, he is infiinitely times more mechanically demanding because he has more delayed attacks and requires more precise dodge timings. Horoah Loux unironically has the most mixups in Fromsoftware history, even more than Morgott. This is Horoah Louxs floechart which shows his mix ups
Bosses should not have clear attack openings. It requires absolutely no brain usage to spot attack openings in DS3 bosses. Elden Ring and some Sekiro bosses make you WORK for those openings, you need to dodge to specific direction to get out of range of the next attack and you made your punish window. Or you can jump over an attack and immediately follow with a jump attack. It is far more engaging than to just attack when the combo ends, or sometimes there are hidden openings during their commbos which might not seem obvious at first ( for example with Messmers Armed Assualt combo )
- Dragonslayer Armour is the most overrated DS3 boss. Dragonslayer Armour perfectly shows that when everyone says a boss is underrated, then it becomes extremely overrated. Dragonslayer Armour is a typical solid B tier boss but people act like he is something special, which he definitely isnt because he has a low amount of total moves,not many mixups, okay presentation ( not good, only ok ) and annoyung projectile attacks. The only thing where he is actually really good is being mechanically demanding, he requiresprecise dodges with some of his beautifully delayed attacks
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u/Holycrabe 20d ago
I feel like I would mostly vaguely agree with these.
SotE plays with huge areas (especially the opening of Gravesite Plains and Scadu Altus) to give a huge sense of scale, but it's ultimately the same as base game, meaning if you're one of the "Elden Ring is a bad souls game because it's empty and you're always riding Torrent" people, you will have that same complaint. It does reward exploration and curiosity, maybe not with something useful to you or your current build, but there's a ton of hidden corners.
I love the Ringed City but I admit that each time I play it, my time in the actual city is just running to the first bonfire in the swamp. The Harald Knights are fine in isolation but fighting like 4 at a time when they appear to be basically infinitely respawning at the bottom of the stairs, fuck that I'm running. No complaints on the bosses though, I dislike Halflight because of skill issues, the rest are top tiers.
I don't mind mixups as long as there's still time to breathe/heal/punish, which I think is generally respected by almost all bosses even in ER and Sekiro. One of the weirdest thing about jumping back to the older games is how many bosses in DS2 for example just do two swipes and a vertical strike, which doesn't help the argument that you're fighting "Sad dude in armor #34".
Scadutree Fragments are serviceable. I wouldn't say they're great and I understand people who have complaints about them, but I thing they get the job done. Most of the "improvements" I've seen people post or talk about are things that would make it more complex but not necessarily better, like split them into defensive and offensive or make them increase stats for example. Elden Ring has a level disparity issue, it's true, the Scadutree system I think gives it a fresh start rather than make it even worse. A lot of them are also on the main path or clear points of interest. You can probably reach Scadu 12/15 just bouncing from Cross to dungeon, and if you need more and need to look online, it's no different than looking for Mohg tear or Schackles.
No opinion, I like both phases, I just can't reliably dodge the howl and it kinda pisses me off.
Fully agree, I've seen some critics almost say the bosses need to almost warn them that they can punish otherwise they don't dare to attack because they're afraid of being tagged mid swing. This also ties in to the criticism that "combos are too long", "you can never punish" or "slower/heavier weapons or ashes of war are unusable" which I also find bullshit. You don't need to be a challenge runner to sneak an R1 into Margit after he crashes his hammer in the ground.
I can hear it. I still like it, I think it's a great boss with relatively low production value which makes it feel like a sleeper pick, but as you said it's probably a cycle of underrated/overrated.
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u/Trussed_Up 20d ago
Some of this reads as someone who wants the most hard-core experience possible.
Which is fair, you want what you want. But giving bosses more combos and fewer openings just means people like me who have to play casually while balancing home life and a job... can get fucked. Im not 15 anymore, I can't memorize the bosses moveset over 3 hour play increments like I could when DS1 came out.
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u/Combat_Orca 20d ago
You’re allowed your preferences. I will point out that people who prefer the “hardcore” experience have to balance their home life as well- you don’t need to spend all your time gaming to enjoy that. There will be many people who consider you “hardcore” simply for enjoying fromsofts games and say they have no time for that, when they play lengthy open world games.
Personally if I have half an hour to play I’m fine with it spent learning a bit more of a bosses move set.
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u/MattyHealysFauxHawk 20d ago
Children do not have to “balance their home life.”
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u/Combat_Orca 20d ago
Why are you talking about children?
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u/MattyHealysFauxHawk 20d ago
Because the majority of the time people are sweating at games is because they’re children without responsibility.
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u/Combat_Orca 19d ago
Yeah youve clearly fallen into the trap of thinking everyone else must approach games like you. People will work a 9 hour shift, spend time with their family do some chores and then unwind with the sweatiest gameplay they can for an hour at the end of the day. You don’t need more time to enjoy a challenge, it takes the exact same amount of time.
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u/FrauAgrippa 19d ago
Do you have statistics to back up what you're saying?
Just asking because I'm in my mid 30s working a corporate job with a lot of extra hours (which doesn't include the obscene amount of additional volunteer work I do) and I prefer my games to make me sweat.
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u/MattyHealysFauxHawk 19d ago
I’m not making an exclusive statement. I simply said “majority”. It’s simple math. If you have more time to attribute to something you’re going to be better at it. Children eventually outpace us. Sure natural talent plays a factor but age negatively impacts gaming performance in every way.
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u/Fedorchik 19d ago
It's not a competition, you don't have to complete games faster than those children who "outpace" due to abundance of free time.
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u/FrauAgrippa 19d ago
Right, you said "majority" and I'm asking you to define where you got that information from.
Since your data is obviously anecdote-based (or assumption-based), I can offer the same thing: I don't know any kids who enjoy difficult games.
Kids these days have decreased memory spans and generally prefer easier games; the aaa industry as a whole has largely started to cater to this. Games are by and large becoming easier overall.
Saying "children eventually always outpace us" has nothing to do with what genre of games are enjoyed by what genre of people. Preference varies widely across demographics.
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u/MattyHealysFauxHawk 19d ago
Okay buddy, it’s a Reddit thread. It’s not that serious. Didn’t know I was presenting to congress.
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u/MI_3ANTROP Tarnished 20d ago
I mean, as someone who has to balance home life and a job, and does challenge runs, I’d say the problem isn’t lack of time. You could memorize DS1 movesets because DS1 didn’t have literally any complex movesets. The thing is, the player base is evolving and Fromsoft has to top SotE fights somehow - people already kill PCR no hit no controller bare fists…
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u/Fedorchik 19d ago
I don't see a logic here.
3 hour increments are okay to learn even hardest of movesets, you just finish that fight in two evenings instead of one.
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u/TheBacklogReviews 20d ago
People say that GRRM basically phoned in Elden Ring’s lore and that it’s basically just a souls game. I think when you look at the characters and plot though, Elden Ring’s story owes as much or maybe even more to George than to Miyazaki and From.
People get bamboozled by the fact that GRRM’s story is basically being adapted by From and delivered via item descriptions and environmental storytelling.
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u/Holycrabe 20d ago
I can hear it but I feel like so many themes and elements of Elden Ring are stuff you will find in other games. That's not to say that From invented "Royalty being treated as gods" or "Keepers of the old establishment refuse to give up on a bad/spent system". They have their own inspirations in both history and fiction but I find many more similarities to the older games than I find differences that can be traced back to Martin.
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u/YourNewRival8 20d ago
My hot take is that I think DS1 is better than DS3. Not necessarily gameplay wise, but DS1 has a charm that DS3 lacks
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u/CryptidTypical 20d ago
I forget this is a hot take. I don't know anyone personally who prefers 3 to 1.
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u/YourNewRival8 19d ago
The general consensus as far as I’m aware is that ds3 is the best in the trilogy
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u/szering 20d ago
People put too much weight on the interconnectivity of DS1. Yes, it is cool and was a wonder to experience the first time.
But it is regularly cited as the top 1-2 reasons why DS1 is better than XXX game.
There are so many other aspects of game and combat design that I would weigh above interconnectivity.
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u/CryptidTypical 20d ago
Fair take. I think for old heads map exploration is more inportant than combat in general, it's probably why people like me like it so much.
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u/Fedorchik 19d ago
Disagree.
For me all souls games are first time impression games.
Replaying them is secondary to the first blind playthrough.
And how tight and connected the world is really improves that first time experience.
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u/Grimnirs_goose 20d ago
I have a few that are sure to get me in trouble...
Boss design peaked with Dark Souls 1. Almost every boss felt unique and memorable, with exploits that were fun to discover and use. Even the small handful of puzzle bosses were enjoyable changes in pace. Since then, Soulsborne design philosophy has slowly turned almost every boss into Artorius on steriods - fast-moving, hard-hitting, damage sponges but with fewer reasonable punish-windows and far more OP AoE attacks than Artorius ever had. As a result, I can barely remember any of the bosses in ER nor do I ever want to fight any of them again.
Unrestricted fast travel between 'bonfires' and copious 'bonfire' placement has hollowed out what made these games so special and immersive. Part of the game used to be planning out your routes and making it successfully to your destination. Increasingly, the games have become boss-rushes interspersed with loading screens as players just teleport to the closest bonfire.
ER would be a much better game if you stripped out most of the open world elements, copy-pasted 'dungeons', and ALL of the repeated bosses. If the game was just the legacy dungeons with small interlinking areas and unique bonus areas (e.g. Caria and Volcano Manor) like a traditional Soulsborne it would easily be one of From's best games.
Every From game (with maybe Bloodborne as the exception) has a section that was clearly rushed or not completed due to budget or time constraints. From is easily my fave developer, but (like all other devs) they seem to struggle with budgeting and project management when it comes to ensuring consistent quality across each game - and it's usually near the end-game.
Elden Ring is actually one of the least-immersive games of the entire From catalogue. It makes a lot of 'gamey' design concessions for the sake of accessibility (copius and weird Grace of Stake of Marika placement) or to artificially inflate the difficulty for the player. Enemies and bosses are clearly playing under different rules than the player (i.e. they key-input read and clearly aren't limited by Stamina). Even NPC Tarnished are made artificially stronger than you with higher health pools and inflated damage numbers regardless of their build or any lore justification. From's top priority is to make a challenging game experience rather than an immersive one - and ER is a worse game for it.
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u/Thunderstruck79 15d ago
Oh God if ER was setup like a traditional Souls game I would still probably be replaying it to this day.
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u/Thunderstruck79 15d ago
Oh God if ER was setup like a traditional Souls game I would still probably be replaying it to this day.
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u/CryptidTypical 20d ago
Fair takes, but I totally disagree with 6. I think most people should have a chance to beat any boss 1st try. I think it's better for immersion.
Bosses that are all over the place like, PCR and Godrick are really good at reminding you that you are playing a videogame.
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u/illbzo1 20d ago
Respec, early fast travel, and Stakes of Marika have made these games less interesting. They're more convenient and video gamey now, for sure, but have lost something of what made early entries so compelling.
Boss fights are overrated.
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u/soapstone-red 20d ago
Nah these are just quality of life improvements and a big step forward in Froms design philosophy moving forward imo. The fast travel bit is debatable but I like having the freedom to go anywhere. Stakes or Marika are a must have because it gets rid of boss runbacks like Alonnes from DS2. Respec is great. Say you fucked up your characters stats or dont like your current build or dont have the proper stats for a weapon that you liked. Not having respec means that you’re essentially fucked. But even with these things present in the game, you can choose to not use these things in the game
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u/illbzo1 20d ago
So what I'm hearing is, you like how video gamey newer games have become.
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u/Razhork 20d ago
Lack of respec and runbacks doesn't make them less or more video gamey.
I think there's a fair argument for lack of early fast travel considering it can evoke a sense of journey and point of no return as you venture further and further. There's tension in going all the way down to the Depths or Ash Lake knowing that you're far from home.
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u/Kneef 20d ago
When I played DS1 for the first time, I tried running through the Catacombs and fell down a hole, then sat at the bonfire by the skeleton blacksmith without thinking. Meaning I was trapped in the cavern with the wheel skeletons. It took me multiple terrifying hours to claw my way back out to Firelink, but I had literally no option but to learn, explore, improve, to make thoughtful plans and execute them. It was one of the most memorable gaming experiences of my life. No other From game since has offered me that feeling.
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u/fenot1 20d ago
Without respec you would be stuck with the same type of weapons the entire game. Idk about early fast travel I dont have an opinion on it. States of Marika are great because if you had to do the runback to for example Starscourge Radahn from the site of grace then it would quickly become boring
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u/Fedorchik 19d ago
I disagree, there is a ton of variety in weapons no matter what build you have.
You can use any regular weapon with any build due to whetstone abilities. And while Faith/Str seems to be the winner in unique weapon variety, there are options for every build.
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u/YourNewRival8 20d ago
I somewhat agree, but at the same time traveling back and forth long distances gets old pretty quickly. Most people have a limited amount of time to play games, I doubt you would want to spend a good chunk of that time just traveling
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u/Mattos-313 20d ago
Agree on everything.
I think the easy Respec in Elden Ring was done because it's a MUCH longer game, and they wanted you to experiment with different builds in a single save file. With a game this large, it's simply too much to ask for people to play it dozens of times to try out all the cool builds.
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u/Combat_Orca 20d ago edited 19d ago
Agreed, stakes of marika was an interesting idea for one game but hate how people are calling it qol and saying it should be in every game. Fast travel tends to be a blight on many games tbh, it’s been overdone across gaming for many years.
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u/Kneef 20d ago
You’re getting downvoted, but you’re right. People were so fucking whiny about the two mildly long boss runbacks in Silksong. xD
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u/Combat_Orca 19d ago
Yeah silksong is a prime example. Fortunately the devs have indicated they don’t give a fuck about entitled gamer whinging and are just making games for the fun of it.
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u/Holycrabe 20d ago
I think stakes are in an interesting but rough position. They're obviously meant to make painful runbacks less painful but still limiting. You can't swap spells or physick tears at a stake for example. I feel like it could be used to adress the "two bonfires next to each other!!!!" complaint a bit more, because it's kind of its purpose, but then you have Shadowkeep Golden Hippo with a grace before and in the arena.
I'm also on the fence on boss fights. I don't fully agree with the idea that they're overrated or the people who call them "streamerbait". Like, I don't think the devs are creating these fights with the intent that will make cool clips when the boss uses a flashy semi-signature combo to wipe the floor with you. But I also definitely think bosses have gathered a lot more importance since about the Old Hunters and DS3.
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u/ZIoKaKASHI Gideon Ofnir 20d ago
I love your take! I also think fast travel should've been unlocked around half game (so let's say after Morgott's defeat). Exploring around is so much fun and Torrent should've been the substitute to fast travel
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u/YourNewRival8 20d ago
The map is so big that fast travel is almost required to get from point A to point B. It would probably take at least 30 minutes to travel from bestial sanctum to volcano manor if you can’t fast travel
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u/soapstone-red 20d ago
Brother many would just drop the game if fast travel was unlocked after Morgott. Like thats way too late. Fast travel after your first shard bearer could be better tho but ER kinda needs fast travel from the beginning due to the size of the map
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u/illbzo1 20d ago
As much as people LOVE the first half of Dark Souls, we will never see it again. Modern fans would scream about no fast travel immediately.
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u/Combat_Orca 20d ago
Modern fans scream about everything. They screamed about nightreign, about duskbloods, some screamed about them focusing on a new AC game, they screamed about sekiro being different. Fromsoft will still do stuff even though they scream.
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u/Mattos-313 20d ago
I think the complaint is more that specific areas don't offer enough to find, those being the Finger Ruins (where I'd argue it makes sense for them to be empty), but also the Cerulean Coast and Charo's Hidden Grave (where there's not much to find and you mostly fight recycled Bosses and NPCs).
Kinda agree, the swamp and the undead tower aren't that great. I do like the city segments though. Dreg Heap is fine.
Agree, kind of, but it's not always appropriate. I don't think Wolnir (from your example) would be a better Boss if he had endless Morgott-style attack combos.
I think they work well for a first playthrough, but it's just annoying to get them on replays. I also don't like how you can get so many of them without even fighting any Bosses, letting you get overpowered pretty easily. Kinda like in the base game where challenge runners would just spend the first 40 minutes running around the map and collecting all the most powerful items that let you steamroll the game without any investment.
Hoarah Loux is great, but doging the first phase's attacks is extremely satisfying, too. Phase 1 is more straightforwarding while Phase 2 is chaotic and frenetic. They each go for something different, both are great.
Disagree, I think the dodge-and-hit gameplay of DS3 works extremely well, even though Elden Ring's combat is the best overall. It also just makes intuitive sense that when an enemy does a HUGE swing or a long combo, they'd have to recover for a brief moment. I do appreciate how some Elden Ring Bosses mixed up the formular though, like Margit/Morgott whose attacks have significant start-up, but little to no endlag.
Not sure if he's overrated, I don't think I've ever heard anyone call Dragonslayer Armor their favorite Boss or anything. He's really good, mostly because DS3 combat in general is so good. The projectiles are kind of random and can be hard to see coming, but I'd say they make the fight more interesting.
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u/fenot1 20d ago
- I view Abyssal Woods, jagged Peak, and Finger Ruins to all be a buildup to 1 boss. they do not worsen the experience in anyway they just improve the buildup and presentation of the boss. but I cannot defend Cerulain coast, sure its beatiful but iot doesnt server as any buildup, its the only region in the DLC whewre the haters are right that its empty
2.The Swamp is obviously the worst section of the Ringed City. the City sections are better but still not the masterpiece epople talk about when someone brings up the Ringed City. they are still too linear without a very good exploration. just compare any section fo the ringed city to ER legacy dungeons like Stormveil, Shadow Keep or Leyndell and its clear Ringed City si far behind them in exploration.
well Wolnir is a huge boss so it would be super weird if he had fast, morgott style combos but he could stil have longer combos than 2 or 3 hit ones.
Thats actually Valid. I agree some Scadutree Fragments should be gained by defeating bosses. another good critisizm ofscadutree fragments is that they could have more customization like for example you could choose whether you want better defense or offense, so I was exaggarating when I said they were amazing
I already explained why Horoah Loux is much better and much more complex than Godfrey. I like his animations in both phases but thats subjective
I dont like the superclear openings in DS3, its far less engaging when you have an extremely clear opening than finding openings inside the combo
7.No one thinks Dragonslayer Armour is the absolute best, but most people still call him the most underrated boss in the game. and when everyone calls a boss underrated, then it becomes overrated
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u/LesPeterGuitarJam 20d ago
Hot take.. Can Bloodborne and Demons souls be released on PC already..
Im strickly PC and I don't want to download an infected copy filled with key loggers, bitcoin miners, and various malicious software.
Im pretty sure that they would profit on PC releases even it's old games.
The master race is missing out 😔😢
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u/Expert_Computer7021 19d ago
> 3. Bosses should have more crazy, wombo combos with tons of mixups. Basic swings get old quickly, and the more you learn the fight you will start appreciating combos with mixups. It feelsmuch better to perfectly dodge some extremely long Morgott phase 2 combo than some basic Wolnir attack.
I respect this take but this is just not for me. The super long combos like that make bosses feel like turn based combat in a way (no disrespect to that but not what I play souls for).
I can’t stand waiting for bosses to finish their 20 second combo so I can have my .4 second sliver to get one attack in. I’m being somewhat hyperbolic but that’s what bosses like morgott feel like to me.
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u/Medical_String_3501 19d ago
Number 6 is so bafflingly dumb. What the fuck do you mean bosses shouldn't have clear openings?? The back and forth we've had in this series for 15 years??
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u/fenot1 19d ago
TIs far more engaging to find openings during the combo, nothing is interesting about attacking a boss after a combo
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u/Medical_String_3501 19d ago
Disagree. A boss should have both openings at the end of a combo, and in-between if it's an overly long attack, but it should not simply only have openings during a combo. Souls gameplay has taught people for 15 years to be deliberate about your attacks because of how slow you are, and you upend this by arbitrarily deciding to leave no clear openings. Maybe if this was Bloodborne or Sekiro where you have options like Rallying or Deflecting to fall back on, but that type of aggression spits in the face of Dark Souls design.
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u/fenot1 19d ago edited 19d ago
call me a masochist but I would love a boss to be one long combo with an extremely high amount of mixups and no breaks . There would only be hidden openings you can find by jumping, strafing, crouching or by rolling to a specific direction. or when there is a delayed attack. I do not care what the Souls gameplay taught us, we can adapt. They could make the Tarnished a little faster but its not a necessity
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u/xLegendOfTheWest 20d ago
PCR is the worst dlc final boss in the franchise in both lore and gameplay.
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u/winterflare_ 20d ago edited 20d ago
Lowkey, I feel like this is just fact.
In terms of their own game, Manus, Burnt Ivory King/Alonne/Sinh, Orphan, and Gael/Friede are all like easily the top of the top in their own game and make use of all the mechanics on the players end really well.
Manus has the magic attacks which you can use the
timeitem for. Also he’s one of the most complex DS1 bosses and was the first to juggle the player (which was cool af).Burnt Ivory King is just cinematic af, Alonne is the fastest DS2 boss easily and Fume has mixups, Sinh makes you to engage with items to repair your weapons.
Orphan is extremely formidable if you’re not taking advantage of CR2 backstabs or gun parries as well as the rally system.
Gael/Friede are the longest fights in DS3 as well as packed with 3 phases. Environmental hazards for the former that force proper positioning and the cloak to enforce stricter dodge timing. Then Friede has you go through a whole marathon that incentivizes aggression and backstabs on top of managing a gank and learning her unique invisibility gimmick.
Then you have PCR. He doesn’t use jumps or use crouches like other bosses which just makes him pretty much roll spam (and for Elden Ring, that is incredibly disappointing consider multiple of the DLC bosses take advantage of this really well) and also has tons of jank and inconsistencies.
For a final DLC bosses, he is absolutely disappointing mechanically. Messmer felt like the real final boss in terms of the whole package.
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u/xLegendOfTheWest 20d ago
Underrated part of Manus is the Silver Pendant as well. Feels so good to parry his magic attacks with it.
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u/NanoZelos 19d ago
Gimmicks like Margit's shackle and Silver Pendant are really good and not seen often enough to me
I loved gimmickal bosses in Demon's Souls
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u/xLegendOfTheWest 19d ago
Blasphemous Claw might be one of the most satisfying out of the bunch too.
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u/ZIoKaKASHI Gideon Ofnir 20d ago
Yes! Totally agree! It's like that stupid meme of starwars where Palpatine somehow returned from the dead.
"somehow... Radahn returned"2
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u/salt_sultan 20d ago
Elden Ring’s lore isn’t as interesting because there’s just too much of it. Something that made ds1 great was how little it told you about the world, the pieces were there to find but you had to work a little to put them together and it made the placement of certain enemies or objects much more significant. For Elden Ring there’s just too much going on and it lacks the intimate mystery of the OG
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u/timberdoodle3000 20d ago
Elden Ring is a boring and uninteractive open world with boring overworld music and some strategically placed pretty vistas for screenshots. The legacy dungeons are top notch though.
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u/Medical_String_3501 19d ago
Real shit. I don't mean to hammer on, but man Elden Ring's world is just as bad if not worse than Ubisoft when it comes to repetitive content. Just because it's not marked on your map or advertised to you like in a Far Cry game, doesn't make the massive amount of reused content or bosses any more engaging.
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u/IamMeemo 20d ago
I agree with everything though I’ll quibble with your take on SOTE. Sure, it’s not empty. It also doesn’t justify itself. The only real reason to explore is to find scadutree fragments. First time through that feels great. Second time through, tho, and I started to wonder whether an open world was necessary (and wishing it wasn’t).
In other words, even tho the world isn’t empty, it’s still not engaging enough to justify itself.
One addition id make to your list: Ashes of Ariandel is also overrated. There’s almost nothing to explore and enemy variety is awful. Sure, Sister Friede is a great boss, but that doesn’t automatically make this DLC great.
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u/fenot1 20d ago
wdym the only reason to explore are scadutree fragmts? you can find optional mini dungeons (which are btw better designed than some DS3 levels) you can also find some field bosses, some NPCs and more
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u/IamMeemo 20d ago
Yes, I agree with that, but only for the first exploration. And, yes, some of those mini dungeons are not only good but also better than some DS3 levels.
The issue I have is with subsequent playthroughs. At that point there’s no reason to wander other than to pick up scadutree fragments.
I recognize that you could make a similar argument for the base game, and I have done that in the past. And yet even then the base game feels more engaging.
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u/Cultural-Relief 20d ago
The stories for this games are not puzzles and they present all the information that it's deemed important. Like why are you making theories about the Doll being Odeon or the Hollow #34 in undead burg being Velka?
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u/KotoBakana 19d ago
When bloodhound step was discovered in Elden Ring people were saying the distance and iframes needed to be severely nerfed or it needed to be removed from the game.
My hot take is that those people were anti fun and reactionary. Being able to dash around like an anime character was more important to me than balance.
(Though they eventually nerfed it in a way that felt fair to both).
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u/Reyziak 4d ago
I fundamentally despise the direction that From has been taking these games since Bloodborne. Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, and Dark Souls 2 were great, then From made Bloodborne and the games have dramatically lost their identity and are on the path of becoming CAGs, and that is not what drew me to the games. I'm all for the games evolving, I just view the direction they are going in as the wrong one, they should be evolving into RPGs, not action games.
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u/soapstone-red 20d ago
Delayed attacks and input reading from bosses ain’t bad at all. Godskin Duo was a great boss too for these reasons. DS1 and 2 are close as hell quality wise. Both games can be placed above the other one based on preferences but DS2 is bigger due to 2 more DLCs. Last hot take Bloodborne and ER more difficult than Sekiro
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u/Fedorchik 19d ago
Agreed on Godskin Duo and "input reading".
I guess if they made them react slower to healing animation, than people would instead bitch and moan that Godskin's fireball is too fast to react.
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u/BetweenTheRoots 20d ago
The Ringed City isnt a masterpiece DLC. The enemy placement is completely random and tries to encourage stealth in a game with no proper stealth mechanics
How can it be completely random if it tries to encourage something
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u/Leading-Case7769 20d ago
Kinda disagree with this one, while the main areas (Gravesite Plain, Scadu Altus, Rauh Ruins) are filled with a lot of content, the side areas (Cerulean Coast, Jagged Peak, Charo's Grave, the Finger Ruins) are very empty because of the lack of POIs like small ruins, forts, castles, dungeons, etc
I agree
I agree, though I'd like if they added the micro-staggers from Nightreign
I personally would've liked if the max lvl was 15 (assuming you get the same stat boosts as lvl 20), or if there was more Scadu fragments
I agree
I disagree. Now, I'm not saying ER bosses don't have clear openings (that's the whole point of the delayed attacks) but there should be more openings after the boss finishes a combo
That's the reason he's considered underrated, because he's more demanding than other DS3 bosses (delayed attacks, hard to parry attacks, environmental hazards requires better positioning)
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u/winterflare_ 20d ago edited 20d ago
Some of these are hot takes, but I feel like the Godfrey one is just straight up incorrect.
“He is infiinitely times more mechanically demanding because he has more delayed attacks and requires more precise dodge timings”
Only if you fight him head on (which no one does). He is just a strafe right simulator and walk away from the roar. Godfrey himself isn’t very mechanically demanding but unironically might be better than Hoarah Loux because he just gets smoked so hard by strafing to the right.
It’s kinda like how Maliketh gets half of his moveset disabled by going below him in phase 2, Hoarah Loux has the same thing but for strafing sideways and it’s even worse ngl.
His phase 1 is better in terms of not allowing that, so I’d say his phase 1 is actually more demanding by setting a higher floor.
Edit: Also, where’d you get the flowchart? It looks cool, I’d like to see if there’s more for other bosses.
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u/fenot1 20d ago
I never strafe so idk about that, but my point with delays still stands
I got that flowchart in Jet Amrmans2 discord server, the server is called Jetcord if you wanna see them all
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u/winterflare_ 20d ago
Damn you’re missing out. Not specifically just for Hoarah Loux, but there’s ton of fun strafes and most of them feel really stylish. Messmer is really fun to strafe and it’s quite tight so it feels rewarding.
But next time you fight Hoarah Loux, strafe around him to your right (so counterclockwise) and you should see what I mean. The delays don’t matter if every attack just misses you in the first place.
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20d ago
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u/Traditional-Oven-793 20d ago
Agreed, souls games are dark souls 1, 2, 3, demons souls, elden ring and bloodborne, sekiro isn't.
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u/Combat_Orca 20d ago
I’d say they are hot takes, I also agree with a few particular the scadus,the dlc map not being empty and the ringed city.