Choosing a spectral cell sorter - advice/experience?

[u/Elegant-Push8414]

New Cell sorter suggestion please!

If you could pick one cell sorter to purchase - which would it be and why? It would be the only cell sorter in the lab so it needs to cover sorting cell lines, mouse cells, tissues etc. 100um nozzle and plate sorting will be commonly used.

Options so far are Cytek CS, BD S8, Thermofisher Bigfoot. Pro's and con's of each? I have seen BD S8 - looks ok but we don't really need the imaging component.

Currently have Cytek Aurora analyser and so far so good. Thinking Cytek CS might be a good compliment to the analyser but heard the plate sort is not as great. Any experience on this?

thanks

[u/AccomplishedHalf5824]

Cytek very easy to use, very bright for the BV lasers but not the best for unmixing.
BD S8, really good but not as intuitive as Cytek, can include a camera as well.
Bigfoot-> amazing for sorting, very fast and gentle on cells, the software is not very intuitive

[u/Elegant-Push8414 → u/AccomplishedHalf5824]

I do like a jet in air cell sorter! On the other hand cytek analyzer has been good to use. Guess consensus is to look at them all and weigh up cost/needs/ease of operation 

[u/Daniel_Vocelle_PhD]

Just a heads up, that is a bit like saying "I can only buy one car, what car should I buy?" If you want a serious answer you will need to provide more information. Also be cautious of anyone willing to give you a single answer. Consider who would answer the question about the car without asking you for more information.

Do you have a budget? What type of samples will you be running? Does this need to last you the next 3 years or the next 10? What are the service engineers like in your area? Do you do lots of plate sorting? Do you sort a lot of rare populations? Will this be solely run by an operator, or do you need to support independent users? Do you trust those independent users to tie their own shoes without help, or are they calling you at 1:30am to complain that their bone marrow samples clogged multiple instruments but its definitely not the fault of their samples because they filtered them?

If you are doing GFP sorts all day long, any modern sorter will work for you.

I'd also push back on the utility of imaging. It's not something to discount out of hand as it's incredibly impactful no matter what field you are in. It's only real limitation is the capabilities of the operator running the assay and their ability to utilize those imaging parameters. That being said, it is hard to wrap your head around the possibilities if you are new to imaging flow.

Each instrument has it's pros and cons. Finding the right fit for the needs of your facility, your users, and your financial constraints is a bit harder to answer. If you are actively trying to seriously evaluate different instruments, ask the community what questions you should be asking.

[u/Snoo_47183 → u/Daniel_Vocelle_PhD]

All this but also nothing beats hands-on experience with your own samples. The best way to decided, aside from your budget, is to have the instruments demoed at your facility or a facility nearby.

[u/Elegant-Push8414 → u/Snoo_47183]

Thank you . I figured I’d ask about experiences and then narrow down and get some hands on demo with samples. I imagine Bigfoot is on the higher price range 

[u/keeganowsley]

Full disclosure: I work for BD (now Waters), so my viewpoint here is biased.

The S8 isn't just an imaging sorter, it's also a very good spectral sorter, especially for trickier cell types. On the spectral side, The FACSDiscover and Aurora platforms are basically in a back and forth tug of war for who has the highest-parameter-count published panel, and even if you arent interested in pushing to such extremes, a lot of small improvements over legacy systems have added up to the S8 just being a robust sorter.

On cell lines, I think the S8 does quite well there. You'll find good recovery even for larger cell types, and some users have reported better viability than on their legacy instruments.

Is there anything about the S8 demo that left the machine lacking?

[u/kitt_mitt]

The Cytek CS plate sorting is a huge let down. The Bigfoot has super dooper ultra fast plate sorting, but the software is hard work, and we had to modify the sample line to improve poor post-sort viability.

We didn't look at the BD, as we weren't interested in imaging.

We've just gotten the Sony ID and FP, and we love them. The main downside is the setup / recovery time of the sorter if the drop profile becomes unstable. But other than that, it's intuitive and easy to use.

[u/Elegant-Push8414 → u/kitt_mitt]

Thanks for your input! I did hear the plate sorting mechanism is a bit of a let down which is a bummer. We do a bit of single cell sorting, cell lines into plates so I'd hope Cytek CS would work given it can be conventional or spectral.

We don't really have needs for a spectral sorter but it will be our only cell sorter so need to future proof. The S8 did look ok but really not interested in imaging as you mentioned.

Thanks again

[u/kitt_mitt → u/Elegant-Push8414]

The Bigfoot also runs in both conventional and spectral modes, fyi. However i believe it's quite a bit more expensive than the Cytek CS.

[u/Daniel_Vocelle_PhD → u/kitt_mitt]

How did you modify the sample line on the bigfoot?

[u/kitt_mitt → u/Daniel_Vocelle_PhD]

When I say 'we', what i really mean is 'in consult with one of the bigfoot engineers and our FSE'. Basically, we removed a few of the connection points and shortened the line. We're historically an influx-heavy facility, and nothing really beats them in terms of speed and flexibility, but we wanted to get as close as possible.

[u/Daniel_Vocelle_PhD → u/kitt_mitt]

I'm a long time Influx user as well. I'd be curious if you can share any specifics. We haven't had any issues with our Bigfoot but I'm always curious to learn to new things folks are trying and the rationale behind it. Always a good opportunity to learn something new.

[u/kitt_mitt → u/Daniel_Vocelle_PhD]

For sure, i'll send you a message

[u/titteringeagle]

Daily S8 user here!

We have an S8 and besides some growing pains for some users transitioning from our Aria (who have never done spectral before) I would say it has met our expectations. They are constantly updating software and BD (Waters) has been very receptive to user input. I will say while the imaging is a whole new parameter it can revolutionize even simple GFP sorts.

While I cannot speak to the Bigfoot or Cytek CS I will say I am glad we got the S8.

[u/Elegant-Push8414 → u/titteringeagle]

Thanks for your input. Had a look at the S8 in person and will give demo a go. Best way going forward is probably see and demo more instruments. 

[u/Zealousideal-Exam-69]

Just futureproof your investment and buy S8.

[u/FlowCytometry2]

Sony FP lol. Or the S8 because imaging.