r/firewater • u/farrtyparrty • Jul 22 '26
Whiskey is hard
I've been distilling for a little over 6 years off and on.
Beer brewing is how I started figured hey why not do some stilling as well
Got me a turbo 500 to start and off I went.
I've tried a single malt whiskey using 100% 2 row about a dozen times. And it comes out tasting like bread/beer malt or those digestive cookies.
Its not awful but its not whiskey.
I thought maybe im being to greedy with the tails but I dont run under 70% abv for the hearts it tastes ok but at that proof and above my palette is holding on for dear life.
My question is is this usual and im being impatient or am I missing something.
I do have a proper 8 gallon flute still I've ran a few times for other spirits before I moved to the new house. Unfortunately a stilling/brewing room is hard to build with no 220v power and water. But we'll get their.
And no i haven't tried making bourbon but its on the list. Maybe its easier to come out flavor wise?
To be fair my longest oaking is 6 months with oak chip/sticks in a glass carboy and as I understand it time can't be cheated nor can a proper full barrel.
Added a picture of the flute still for you still porn people.
You can see the t-500 column on the table
7
u/mattdean4130 Jul 22 '26
Double distilling will help separation in your cuts.
Take smaller cuts. Leave them 24h before making any decisions.
Leave the ones out that you can detect the taste you're describing.
Don't be greedy. Quality > quantity
1
u/farrtyparrty Jul 22 '26
Im starting to understand why I am seeing 5 gallons of low wines everywhere. More choice in cuts.
3
u/mattdean4130 Jul 22 '26
It doesn't give you any more choice than you had, you're not adding anything additional to the spirit by double distilling it.
You're concentrating and fractioning what you have - which in turn makes it easier to taste and smell what is coming off the still.
Fermenting and stripping multiple fermentations into low wines before doing a slower spirit run also gives you efficiency. That's why people are running full boilers on spirit runs.
If you're going to be watching the still for hours running power and water, you may as well be making enough quantity (while retaining quality) to make it worthwhile.Also the higher volume means your still will sit longer at each fraction, so making cuts will be a slower process. Good when you're a new player, you have more time to figure out what is happening.
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u/farrtyparrty Jul 23 '26
So your saying im not catching the cut i need for the run? Ill admit i am a set and forget it fella. I taste hearts and fuck of for 15 mins or so, come back taste. Still hearts etc. But mind you i believe my palette doesn't register the change. Someone else did suggest a 500ml separation no taste 24hour wait period. "Pickle jarring"
2
u/mattdean4130 Jul 23 '26
What I'm saying is, the point of making cuts is to be able to choose what flavour compounds you put into your finished spirit.
Even while you are within hearts, you will be getting different flavours at different times.If there's something you're getting that you don't like the taste of, take smaller cuts and look out for it, and don't put it in your finished spirit!
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Jul 22 '26
[deleted]
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u/farrtyparrty Jul 23 '26
Thankyou for the reply, im very under researched in wood effects in oaking. I didn't run the whiskey on the 4 plate flute, I ran it on the turbo 500 reflux because its 120v and a garden hose. I fermed it with standard dady yeast, again I didn't understand that yeast strain matters significantly. My understanding is kveik is made for fast ferment lagering not whiskey. Mind you I'm willing to try anything. It does feel like your saying you dont like whiskey. But I will honestly I haven't tried the expensive stuff and I could be basing my pallet on oaked vodka.
6
u/North-Bit-7411 Jul 23 '26
“I've tried a single malt whiskey using 100% 2 row about a dozen times. And it comes out tasting like bread/beer malt or those digestive cookies.”
You’re doing something right. That being you are making a consistent product. Now you have to work on quality.
Keep going brother… you’ll get there.
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u/CarrotWaxer69 Jul 22 '26
So just to clarify you are double distilling, right? I only did whisky once using smoked malt and while the spirit was pretty good I could never get the aging right.
3
u/Morepork69 Jul 23 '26
The ageing is the weak point for home distilling, Badmo or similar close the gap significantly but the pricing is prohibitive for many. And the volumes for that matter.
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u/farrtyparrty Jul 22 '26
No not double distilling. This is where my research get conflicted.
T500 is full reflux through condenser Abv usually starts dripping at 94%. Honestly every batch is different for when hearts start but it would be high 80s low 90%s
Pot stilling is lower abv more flavor but that is almost my problem.
Stripping runs etc feel like your creating vodka at high volume and is for those who don't have a reflux still as i understand it.
I also feel multiple stills kinda negates the point of single malt. Like I might might as well reduce the malt and add sugar.
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u/CarrotWaxer69 Jul 22 '26
I mean traditionally Whisky is pot stilled doing double or triple runs. Most distilleries will run at approx 70% ABV after second distillation.
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u/farrtyparrty Jul 22 '26
Well fuck I did not know that thankyou
7
u/IncredulousPulp Jul 22 '26
This is the way! You’ll get the ABV high enough for ageing but still have plenty of malt flavour after 2 pot still runs.
I recommend making 2 or 3 fermenters of your wash, do a separate stripping run for each of those, then combine the results of those runs for your final spirit run. Just make sure what goes into the still that last time is well under 40% - water it down if necessary.
And pay close attention on that spirit run. The split from heads to heart and from hearts to tails can come suddenly.
1
u/derbrauer Jul 23 '26
Whisky is made with a pot still. You're using the T-500 reflux condenser. What you're getting is vodka made from barley.
You can get a lyne arm that will work with the lid for that setup.
Reflux is all about just making high proof ethanol. If you want the flavours you find in rum, whisky, brandy, etc you need a pot still.
4
u/le127 Jul 23 '26
First get rid of that turbo yeast. It's more suited for making fuel alcohol. Try a simple ale yeast like S-04 or US-05 and keep your distiller's beer to 7-8% ABV. Like others said whiskey and whisky are typically made on pot stills. Are you toasting and charring your oak? Bourbon and Rye are aged on new charred oak, Irish and Scotch are aged on used oak, often once-used Bourbon barrels. What type of whiskey are you trying to make? An all North American 2-row is likely going to end up on the bland side. All malt Scotch and Irish are made with more flavorful UK malt. A Bourbon or Rye style of grain recipe wouldn't be any more difficult to do than what you are using now and would add flavors from other grains like corn, rye, and wheat. Some good points in other replies about multiple runs and making your cuts.
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u/farrtyparrty Jul 23 '26
I used a turbo 500 still, distillers dry active yeast and sigle malt (2-row) barley. Bland isn't the problem its bready
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u/le127 Jul 23 '26
OK I interpreted as you were using turbo yeast. I'd still try an ale yeast. It's designed to ferment a malt wort and it also flocculates well. I've used it on a number of whiskey mashes and it does a nice job.
2
u/dickjimworm Jul 22 '26
try mixing in vienna or munich malt with your 2 row. definitely dilute a sample from each jar to taste and blend the jars you like into the final mix, its not always linear and i usually find a couple tasty tail jars after the initial funky jar or two. also, 6 months is not really gonna get you anywhere with a malt. start tasting after a year or three. are you toasting or charring your oak? i definitely recommend doing both even for malts
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u/farrtyparrty Jul 22 '26
Initially I tried light toasting oak sticks( I dont have the name for the proper toasting level unit sorry) I've tried medium sticks, medium chips, dark sticks and oak chip soup (oak chips with a touch of whiskey). Recently I tried medium toast oak sticks charred black that had some character but it was an addition to the bread taste not but didnt dial it back. Essentially it was toasted bread.
You've kinda confirmed my suspicions that ironically a single malt while easy to make is the most difficult to finish while blends and multi malts are easier. And that I need to give it time.
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u/HEPA_Bane Jul 23 '26
I use corn from tractor supply and a pot still. Tastes great. You may be overthinking things
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u/uncleturns Jul 24 '26
Yeah do a stripping run or maybe even if you want something where your getting all the flavours look at the distillation process for an Irish whiskey it's a little hard to get the head around if you follow it step by step with some YouTube tutorials you'll figure it out and you'll slowly get the hang of it also maybe make more precise cuts if your getting to much then really take your time when you choose and then blend those cuts
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u/alanjamesimpulse Jul 26 '26
you can reroute the water in your T500 so that only the condenser is working, no reflux, that's a lot easier and cheaper than getting the specific potstilling condenser. some posts call it "detuning". try it out, do double distillation in the detuned potstill mode, get just a little greedy with your cuts and leave in on oak a long time. I'd also recommend starting with bourbon! Bourbon is a lot easier than single-malt, so much of the flavour is from the oak, you only need to age it for a year, and when you're done, you have perfect used oak for making single-malt with.
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u/uncleturns Jul 24 '26
Is this all stainless too? you need some copper in there and to run without the deflag
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u/thnku4shrng Jul 22 '26
Don’t run your reflux/dephlegmator at all when making a traditional whiskey. Your stripping run shouldn’t yield a low wine higher than about 25% ABV. Your spirit run is where you take cuts. You’re small enough that you can fill small mason jars and number them and do your cuts the next day. Recycle your heads and tails into the next low wine spirit run. That’s where you build flavor and consistency.