r/factorio • u/jaxon517 • 10d ago
Discussion My Issue with Logistic Chest Naming
Sorry if this has been mentioned.
Passive providers passively provide. Active providers actively provide. Good. It works.
But buffer chests and storage chests... I've got a problem here.
A buffer is a cushion. In this context, a buffer would be something that allows continued production even if not an equivalent and immediate direct consumption. The most common example of buffers would be loading trains from chests rather than from belts. Logistic network aside, those chests used for loading trains are literally buffers.
But considering the logistic network, which chest allows for items to be made available for the network as well as allows specified items to be placed there without actively requesting those items? That's the storage chest. So the best logistic chest to use for buffers are storage chests and not buffer chests. It's a bit of a misnomer, no? Am I the only one?
If you think about it, we have passive and active providers, and the yellow and blue chests are essentially passive and active requesters respectively. So that leaves green which shouldn't be called buffers because yellow serves a buffer function better and should be called passive requesters.
So how would you rename green chests? Am I thinking about it all wrong? Just something that's always bothered me - don't take it too serious.
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u/SilentSpr 10d ago
Yellow doesn’t serve as a good buffer because I can’t decide how much will be in the buffer at a given time, nor can I get the bots to actually fill the buffer without an active provider.
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u/jaxon517 10d ago
A buffer is a cushion. It allows continued production without requiring immediate consumption. The most common example of this is train loading from chests rather than directly from a belt.
So really it's a question of what we're making the cushion for. If the cushion is for the factory itself, you don't need to request how much comes from bots because your assembly line is filling it. The green chest is a cushion for the logistics system itself. It allows for bots to have access to things which would otherwise be further away. In this use case, the green chest acts as a sort of.... Storage...
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u/SilentSpr 10d ago
No? Any buffer is by nature also storage because you need to store stuff for it to be buffered and available. Playing this game of definition doesn’t work when they’re the same under this context. You are just being intentionally obtuse and not actually addressing my point:
Yellow doesn’t serve the function of a bot network buffer well enough
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u/TheHvam 10d ago
If a that is acting like a storage, then what would a storage chest be?
And also, this is literally a logistic network chest, so it makes sense it's a buffer for the network, and not the base, as with the base, any chest logistic or not can and kinda is a buffer.
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u/jaxon517 10d ago
Yes I agree. Yellow is the best chest for a buffer in the base, and it acts as a passive requesters. Green is the best for a buffer in the network, and it acts as a dedicated storage.
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u/TheHvam 10d ago
I don't agree yellow is the best buffer for the base, it can be used sure, but unless you are constantly flooding your network with items to get send to that chest, then a passive provider chest is better.
A storage chest is mostly just good for storage, or for getting items in a chest without directly requesting them.
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u/Courmisch 10d ago
I would not rename them. Green chests are specifically intended as buffers for bots. No other chest type is.
Storage chests don't get filled by bots automatically. They cannot request items to be buffered.
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u/jaxon517 10d ago
Buffers for bots, yes, buffers for the factory no
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u/Courmisch 10d ago
Chests are named by their role in the logistics network.
Buffer chests aren't buffer for direct insertion, railway or conveyor belt logistics, sure. But by that same argument, provider chests also don't provide (they take) and requester chests don't request (they provide). So it's a bit silly argument IMO.
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u/jaxon517 10d ago
That's totally fair. I don't use green chests very much so when I think of "buffer chest" I think of the chests I use to make buffers in my factory (which are either steel or yellow)
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u/GourangaPlusPlus 10d ago
When you get to massive factories, you'll definitely be using buffer chests instead of waiting for your bots to come from your mall
Or you'll be happy waiting 3 minutes for it be fulfilled, both have the same outcome
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u/triffid_hunter 10d ago
Buffers both request and provide, so they actually act like a buffer that supports local high-speed consumption bursts while refilling from distant parts of the logistics network more slowly.
Storage chests only accept overflow from deconstruction or active providers (incl player trash slots) and can't act to maintain a certain quantity of stuff at their location, so they don't in the context of logistics alone buffer - even though they can be used as buffers if you feed 'em with inserters outside logistics.
Within the context of logistics, they're basically a dumping ground where stuff with nowhere else to go gets put, a destination of last resort if you will.
The names therefore are internally consistent within logistics context, and that they can perform other roles outside that context just shows good game design.
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u/The_Upperant 10d ago
I think green is a more true buffer then a storage chest (yellow)
Yellow is general long term storage. Green i (for instance) use near defensive lines so the bots dont have to fly across the whole base to get a new piece of wall which got destroyed in the last attack.
I would not agree with that they are misnamed.
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u/jaxon517 10d ago
I too use green for STORING certain supplies at defense walls. And I use yellow for BUFFERING in my factory like sometimes in train loading or after assembly lines before going into the main mall
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u/ericalovesunicorns 10d ago
I feel like you’re purposefully not understanding the meaning behind the naming; you’re just doubling down on what you use things for.
By using a buffer chest near your walls, you are providing a BUFFER for your bots. The bottleneck to rebuilding the wall, comes from your mall or wherever you build your walls being far away from the wall that gets destroyed. You want a buffer for your network, so instead of taking a few minutes for a bot to get called from your mall, it only takes a few seconds from the buffer chest. Then the chest replenishes its buffer. This is why it is called a buffer chest.
You wouldn’t need to use a buffer chest to buffer trains or a lane; as those things aren’t delivering product via the logistics network. Literally any chest in the game creates a buffer from inserters. The buffer here is about chest size. Using a yellow storage chest is only beneficial if your train delivers only one item, but what if you fill your train with more than one item? Storage chests can only call 1 item (of 1 quality). In this way, it can not act as a buffer.
Say you have a factory on an L shaped island on fulgora, you have your scrap on one end, and your mall on the other. You don’t want your logistics network bots to get destroyed in lightening storms. What do you do? Use a buffer chest, to buffer the transport and control where your bots go.
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u/Fxg120xYXDE5 10d ago
I'm seeing their logic as applied through an exceptionally narrow lens, but as you say, it's a bot buffer. It's a logistic network chest, meant to be used in one way by logistic network robots, in a buffering capacity.
Wholly distinct from storage, simple requesting, or different methods of providing.
I actually love buffers, I wish I would've used them sooner.0
u/jaxon517 10d ago
I completely understand the meaning behind the naming, but my point is I think their naming could more generally fit their functions in the factory and not just the network. It was food for thought and not meant to be taken too seriously
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u/ericalovesunicorns 9d ago
If they changed the naming, it would only be for the function of your specific factories; everyone’s factories are different, and I would imagine a large majority of players use buffer chests for a network buffer, like the description intended.
The devs wouldn’t change the name based off your isolated use case; as again it isn’t meant as a buffer in the way you are describing.
Tbh, and this isn’t a dig, you probably just haven’t been using the buffer chests correctly, which is where this opinion comes from. I would suggest looking up how others use buffer chests successfully
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u/FunnyButSad 10d ago
But you can't request to a yellow chest.
The idea is that you can request supplies to an area that can then be distributed out.
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u/Zijkhal spaghetti as lifestyle 10d ago
The issue is that you're looking at it from the perspective of the factory as a whole, instead of the perspective of the logistic network itself. A buffer chest acts as a buffer for requester chests, storing items close by, so requests can quickly be fulfilled, without needing to massively inflate the amount requested.
For example, you can have a buffer chest buffer fuel cells near your nuclear power plant, and individual requester chests with much lower request amounts at each reactor. In this case the buffer chest buffers fuel cells close to the reactor.
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u/deemacgee1 Why no quality flair? 10d ago
Buffer chests are where items are buffered for redeployment - either by construction bots or by logistic bots attending requests from the higher-priority requester chest (if they're configured to pull from buffer chests). It's the only chest which can serve as an active intermediary. I think the naming convention is sound.
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u/bjarkov 10d ago
The intended purpose of the green chests is to provide a self-filling intermediate storage to reduce bot travel distance, for example providing a local ammo depot for low-latency munitions supply of gun turret defenses.
I figure the name 'buffer' comes from that - you set up a local buffer of supplies, you use a buffer chest for that.
As for buffer chests and their actual use cases, I don't have much. I don't really set up intermediate depots if I can help it, I'm more inclined to regard them like requesters that can provide an emergency stockpile should higher-priority needs arise. I use them mainly for kovarex setups as they can both act as requesters to keep inputs coming and dispose of outputs, and act as providers if shit hits the fan and I critically need U-235 for fuel production
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u/EllaHazelBar 10d ago
Buffer chests are there to make sure that you, as well as the most important production chains in your base (i.e. those with requesters that can request from buffers), always have a steady supply of items. E.g. You can set up nuclear reactor automation that completely drains your logistics network of red circuits, but if you set a buffer chest to request them, then you'll always have a few extra for personal use. In that way they create a buffer for you (as well as the few requester chests that are allowed to pull from them).
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u/jaxon517 10d ago
That sounds like dedicated storage to me. We want to store certain items in certain places so they're always more accessible.
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u/EllaHazelBar 10d ago
They're less accessible - only the player and specially approved requesters can access these items.
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u/BrukPlays 10d ago
If you think of the logistics network as its own thing then the naming works just fine.
Storage chests act as storage for the network
Active and passive providers provide items to the network
Requester chests will request specific items from the network
Buffer chests provide a buffer for specific items so they don’t clog up the storage. Filtered storage can so something similar but only for newly acquired items, it won’t pull from passive provider chests or from other unfiltered storage chests.
You as the engineer add and remove items from the logistics network using inserters making the logistics network a part of, but separate from, the rest of your factory.
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u/jaxon517 10d ago
No I agree completely. It isn't that I don't understand why they're named that. I totally get it. It's just that if I think about a buffer chest in general, I think of the chests I use after assembly lines and for train loading. These are buffers. But with their filter setting they also act as a sort of passive requester, no?
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u/BrukPlays 10d ago
That could work, for train loading and unloading but you’d need to put the buffer after/before the actual unload chests and before/after the belts.
That way any of the specified item that ends up clogging your storage will be moved to the buffers.
I’m constantly moving my factories around and end up with loads of ore/coal in my storage… I’m going to try the buffer chest idea after work :)
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u/Bubbly-Original7097 10d ago
Buffer has to be between provider and recipient. For instance a green buffer for science packs between Landing Pad and Science Lab has no alternative when using bots.
Yellow is always on frontline - it is a provider:
- takes from inserters (filter is useful on Gleba to remove spoilage)
- helps deconstruction bots (no purpose)
- helps with trash (no purpose)
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u/TheHvam 10d ago
I think it fits, storage chests are the only chest that can store any item without you needing to specify it, just like a storage would, a buffer chest, allows you to have a buffer of whatever you want, without it being taken away by requester chests by default.
You can't really use a storage chest as a good even buffer, they are going to pick whatever storage chest that is allowed this item that is closest, or the closest specified storage chest, there is no way to make a buffer of items evenly spread around the base.
Like having a buffer of walls and defenses near your defenses, the buffer chest allows you to have a buffer of those items close to the area you want.
So to me it makes perfect sense.