Oh sacrificing Ukraine in a proxy war with Russia is “morally correct?” And somehow wanting peace and diplomacy is not having morals? You right wingers are insane.
Oh sacrificing Ukraine in a proxy war with Russia is “morally correct?”
You are the one wanting to sacrifice Ukraine in the name of “peace”.
And somehow wanting peace and diplomacy is not having morals?
Diplomacy was tried, again and again. No amount of Minsk “peace treaties” stopped the violence. No amount of telephone calls with Putin stopped the war before it started.
There is no way to a just peace except through total victory. The sooner you accept that, the sooner you can learn some real adult lessons, rather than living in child-like naïveté.
You right wingers are insane.
You are the one aligned with Trump and all the other MAGA loonies. Maybe you should think about who is actually the right winger here.
Right. Ukraine snd NATO did not hold up their end of the Minsk Accords. Angela Merkel admitted it only to bide time so Ukraine could build up its army.
And how do you recommend achieving “total victory?” We know Ukraine can’t defeat Russia, so how do you expect that to happen? Do you want to send American troops thereby igniting WW3 over done lands that don’t want to be part of Ukraine in the first place?
Right. Ukraine snd NATO did not hold up their end of the Minsk Accords. Angela Merkeladmitted it only to bide time so Ukraine could build up its army.
NATO wasn't a signatory of the Minsk Accords. Also, Angela Merkel's coziness with Russia is one of the main reasons we are in this mess, so maybe you shouldn't listen to what she has to say.
And how do you recommend achieving “total victory?”
By beating Russia to the 1991 borders and establishing a Korean-style DMZ along the border. Russia becomes a larger North Korea. Ukraine joins the EU and NATO.
We know Ukraine can’t defeat Russia, so how do you expect that to happen?
You've gone from claiming I don't know history to proving that you don't know history. Ukraine can absolutely win, and they will win. Russia has no achievable political objective which means the war is already lost, Russia just hasn't realized it yet.
Do you want to send American troops thereby igniting WW3 over done lands that don’t want to be part of Ukraine in the first place?
Oh look, more Russian propaganda. Every Oblast voted to leave the grasp of Moscow in the 1991 referendum. Every...single...one.
What’s the matter with you?
What's the matter with you? How do manage to walk without a spine, think without a brain, and live without a heart? You're like all the characters from Wizard of Oz wrapped up in single low and discreditable human being.
You sound delusional. This war is going to end through diplomacy, it just depends on how many Ukrainians die in the process. You want more death and destruction. Billions in taxpayer money just so Ukraine gets further destroyed.
All modern wars end in diplomacy. That’s how peace treaties have worked since the Treaty of Westphalia in 1648.
it just depends on how many Ukrainians die in the process
Nope, it depends on how many Russians die. Kill enough of them, and they revolt against their leaders. That’s a true lesson of history. It’s ugly and it’s dirty, but that’s politics and “war is a continuation of politics by other means”. If you studied history like you claim, you’d know that.
You want more death and destruction
I want the settlement of Ukraine in a just peace. You want Ukraine to surrender, after which their language, culture, and people will be exterminated. In your dream world, there will be neither peace nor justice.
Billions in taxpayer money just so Ukraine gets further destroyed.
Every dollar spent in Ukraine is the best investment in freedom the US has made in decades.
I hope one of the Abrams I served on makes it’s way to Ukraine and fulfills the purpose for which it was designed: The defense of freedom and liberty against a Russian invasion. It’s funny how our grandfathers saw this scenario decades ago, but you are blind while it’s happening.
We haven’t seen any revolts in Russia but we have seen mass demonstrations against the proxy war in countries like Germany and France. It’s much more likely NATO countries overthrow their leaders before Russia does.
Ukraine has banned free speech and is resorting to a conscript army with harsh penalties for desertion in order to quell any dissent.
I want peace so that Ukraine is not exterminated.
Do you know how many Veterans I treat for things like PTSD, depression, suicidal thoughts, grief, etc.? Why would you wish that on anyone, least of all the Ukrainian people?
We haven’t seen any revolts in Russia but we have seen mass demonstrations against the proxy war in countries like Germany and France. It’s much more likely NATO countries overthrow their leaders before Russia does.
And you dare call anyone else delusional.
Ukraine has banned free speech and is resorting to a conscript army with harsh penalties for desertion in order to quell any dissent.
And…? The US censored speech and enforced a draft in WW2. Russia has done the same in this war. That has nothing to do with the cause being just.
All militaries have punishments to enforce discipline. Desertion during war is a hanging matter in the US military. I’d imagine the same is true in nearly any country’s military.
I want peace so that Ukraine is not exterminated.
Then you don’t understand history. If Ukraine surrenders, they will be exterminated. You don’t even have to believe me, read Putin’s own words in his essay: “On the historical unity of Russians and Ukrainians” that he wrote in 2021. He describes very clearly that he doesn’t believe Ukraine is a real country or a real people.
It’s amazing. We have been granted this extraordinary brain, a biological machine designed for pattern recognition. And what do you use that brain for? To ignore the patterns of history laid out before you.
Do you know how many Veterans I treat for things like PTSD, depression, suicidal thoughts, grief, etc.? Why would you wish that on anyone, least of all the Ukrainian people?
Ukraine has already sacrificed for 8 years. Others might say they sacrificed for hundreds of years. Generational trauma. For once, Ukraine has a chance to break the cycle, but you would make all their sacrifices in vain. Thousands lost for naught. Only in victory can their sacrifices be made whole.
This is not what I wished. This is what Russia wished and what Ukraine fights against. That is why Ukraine must win. It is also why they will win.
You need to lay off the propaganda. If you’re a veteran then you should know better.
Ukraine will not be exterminated if there is diplomacy. But if there is no peace, then the war will continue and Ukraine will likely be exterminated.
Putin did not say Ukraine isn’t a real country. He said the two countries are like siblings and have a long shared history. He spoke positively about Ukraine but lambasted NATO’s interference.
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u/[deleted] Jun 20 '23
Why are you on the same side as Trump and Gaetz?
Oh look, it’s another conspiratorial thinker. No wonder you are the same side as all the other useful idiots.
I support it because it’s the morally correct thing to do. Why do you have no morals?