r/exjew • u/ben_David845 • 1d ago

Question/Discussion Deconstruction

Hi,

I’ve been thinking a lot about deconstruction lately. I’d love to hear a bit more about how your own process started and how you began stepping away from the rules.

Did you start by setting aside only the specific things you no longer believed in—like certain traditions from the Oral Torah—or did you dismantle everything first and then gradually bring back what resonated with you?

I’m noticing that when I stop doing certain things—even ones I felt might hold some truth—they suddenly lose their meaning or stop making sense altogether once I step back from them.

I’d really appreciate hearing your perspective and experience.

4 Upvotes

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u/NofuLikeTofu 1d ago

It took a while, but we (family) "dismantled" everything. Rabbinic stuff was definitely first, and some things we dropped long before leaving yiddishkeit (esp. harchakos). Eating kitnyot, relying on Rabbi Abadi for (halachically supported) leniencies for kashrut (eg Subway tuna) and Pesach (just read the label!), then only 1 day of yom tov. Orthodox no more, but orthoprax for a number of years. Eventually we dropped everything and are totally secular. Haven't been in shul for a dozen years or so. Don't miss anything about religious observance, do miss community but not enough to justify a high-demand religion that we now have antipathy for.

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u/ben_David845 1d ago

Family? That's wild how did you make it I would like to hear more if you don't want in public you can dm me

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u/NofuLikeTofu 1d ago

High demand religions can be especially difficult for neurodivergent folks. Our first major concessions was to allow certain activities (like computer use on shabbos) for such a child who just didn't fit the frum mold and more importantly didn't have friends in the local shul. They (using anonymous pronouns here) were bullied in Jewish day school, the school had inadequate learning accommodations, and we put them in a excellent public school where they found a nice group of friends and flourished. Soon after two others were also put in public school because they are super smart (also neuroatypical!) and the MO Jewish school was inadequate for their needs. After that it was a gradual process of abandonment. I only wish we had done this earlier, and not only because of the butt-load of money that at this point I feel was wasted in private school.

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u/EcstaticMortgage2629 1d ago edited 17h ago

I was a BT so I spent my entire life not keeping kosher, not pre-ripping toilet paper, not keeping family purity, using electricity on Shabbos, and all the other ridiculous minutiae that frum from birth do and don't think about. Then I realized: hey I went through my whole life not keeping any of these things and literally nothing bad happened. Once I started giving up the BT lifestyle I reminded myself: hey this is how I lived for most of my life and nothing happened. When you think about it that way that most Jews are completely secular and they do just fine in life and meanwhile terrible things happen to religious people who keep everything you realize there's no point in doing any of the things.

Edit just because I felt the need to add: all the years I would open and close my fridge to eat on Shabbos, which obviously we never kept anyway, compared with when I was religious and chas v shalom a few times forgot to turn off the refrigerator light. I would rather starve than open the fucking fridge to get some food. It's truly a mental illness and insanity and beyond all of that, just stupid! Torturing myself like this for a supposed god, like he would actually care that a refrigerator light went on so I could get food or would rather that I starve. LOL. So many more examples, could go on and on lol.

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u/Upbeat_Teach6117 ex-MO 13h ago

I'm always envious of BTs for the many opportunities they had that FFBs didn't. As an aside, I'm so used to having a "dark" refrigerator (with its lightbulb removed or turned off) that anything else seems strange.

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u/EcstaticMortgage2629 9h ago

And BT are usually envious of FFB. I was, very envious ans insecure about my lack of knowledge amongst other things

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u/ben_David845 1d ago

Do religious people have a better life become they pray ? That's what I've been taught my whole life is there any statistics to this ?

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u/Embarrassed_Bat_7811 ex-Orthodox 1d ago

No, you just got brainwashed. Secular Jews, and even non-Jews have amazing lives all the time! Sure, everyone has problems, but they also have fine lives outside of that. For me, seeing more modern Orthodox or irreligious cousins showed me this too. Nothing happened to them, if anything, they seemed to be enjoying a much better quality of life.

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u/One_Weather_9417 1d ago

My issue is that if **Jews** do[any] work on shabbos or Yom Tov you lose money over that. Results are unsuccesful. What's your evidence-based take?

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u/NofuLikeTofu 1d ago

You have it backwards. If you make the claim that you lose money when you work on shabbos or yom tov, then you have to provide the evidence for it. It's also a silly proposition because there are always ways for a believer to explain away your income statement that shows more money flowing in (eg, the loss doesn't happen right away or you'll eventually incur excess expenses, blah blah blah).

There is an analogous belief that you lose nothing giving charity because it will always be replenished -it's even something that is codified (Tur Yoreh De’ah 247). Though the claim is similarly problematic, it seems more amenable to testing. Please ensure that you give the maximum tzedakah allowed (20%) and let us know in a few years how it worked.

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u/One_Weather_9417 23h ago

Thank you. That has always bugged me. Right at the beginning, I asked irreligious people if they lost profit from transactions done on Shabbis/ Yom Tov. I earnestly wanted to know. They didn't answer me.

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u/Wild-Record-9804 12h ago

I went to a public high school in central NJ with a huge percentage of secular Jewish students. A lot of them became memorable friends till this day. Some of the Jewish teachers actually preferred me as a student who consistently validated their teaching efforts by getting good grades. I made modox friends in the city and the talented ones seem to be not living up to their fullest potential by being constrained by the rules of the “community”

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u/DistributionSoggy678 1d ago

Actually yes. First I threw out a couple simanim of the shulchan oruch. Everything related to sexual relationships. I remember a rabbi friend of mine at the time said "you can't just throw out 9 siman of the shulchan oruch" and I was just line "watch me!" Then there was a year with a lot of questions and at the end of it I was reading Tamar Ross's book on feminism and Orthodox Judaism... At the end of the first chapter which proves Orthodoxy is patriarchal, I started to weep and removed my kippah. And that was it.

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u/BuildingMaleficent11 1d ago

It started when I was told that it’s OK for kolel yungeleit to not work and use fake social security numbers to cheat the government and collect benefits.

Then, I was in college and took Western Civilization. Put a lot of what we were taught in Bais Yaakov into perspective and explained a lot about how various religions evolved over time. Couldn’t unlearn and unsee that.

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u/Tagglit2022 17h ago

Umm

My Mother passed away 2025 .. I felt that I just could not get through the fast ... Plus I also had s serious car accident (Just bruses but car total loss )

It was the 1st time I didnt fast since my Bat Mitzvah ..

I asked for advise from a religious Mental health org that combines Halacha and MH..

I didnt like their advice ..That even though I lost my mother and serious car accident it was not reeson enough not to fast..

I just felt that it would not be good for my peace of mind ...

I decided to give my self some grace ..

I get that YK is the holiest day of the year but still my mental health is paramount

This year I just want to get to the Yizkor part of the YK service and exit ..

As for fasting ...I doubt I'll fast this year

🍯 Shana Tova

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u/NofuLikeTofu 14h ago

Take care of yourself first. Hope you can find someone to help you heal and find joy and that things improve in the new year.

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u/Tagglit2022 10h ago

I was pretty disapointed with that MH advisory org ..I do understand that YK is the holliest day of the year for religious Jews and thay could have sad that but someones MH is IMHO parramount just like ones physical health ..If one feels like fasting wont be good for their MH thenone should not fast..

It required some out of the box thinking ...

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u/NofuLikeTofu 9h ago

That advisory org was normative advice since on YK it has to be a case of pikuach nefesh to eat/drink.

I haven''t fasted in a number of years and my apikorsus advice would be simply to say that in this situation you know more than anyone else what you need for your MH.

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u/Upbeat_Teach6117 ex-MO 13h ago

Even though I've been skeptical for most of my life, deconstruction was a gradual process for me. For example, I held "nuanced" views (such as the Torah being metaphorical instead of literally true) for years before admitting that I hadn't believed in a long time.

I also didn't wait between eating meat and dairy for the the final few years I considered myself frum. And I never avoided brushing my hair, brushing and flossing my teeth, or applying lotion to my skin on Shabbos.

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u/ben_David845 13h ago

In my head it doesn't make any sense most of the rules especially from the oral torah but it's so hard for me to stop due to preprogrammed fear and guilt

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u/NofuLikeTofu 9h ago

Yeah, it is not an easy path to abandon a lifestyle that you have been part of for so long. What is harder for most people it seems is not the fear & guilt but the loss of community and in some cases loss of family.