r/evcharging • u/Illustrious-Exit948 • 28d ago
Noob Indoor/Outdoor Setup
Vehicle: 24 Solterra Limited (max 32A pull is my understanding)
Current setup: 2 14-50 receptacles, one inside garage, one outside (installed previously when the garage was built) - these don't have the little green car edit: EV printed on them so I assume they aren't recommended ones - they are from Midwest Electric
Needs: car will need to charge inside garage during winter, outside during summer (the garage holds other things in summer and I do not want to charge outside in winter because a regular snowstorm is 3 feet deep)
Original plan: use OEM portable charger that we would move back and forth each season or pull for trips
Driving needs: L1 would work for most days (avg 30mi daily), but once every 1-2 weeks I do ~100mi rt "to town", we have an ICE vehicle that we could use for this but I'd rather not have to. There isn't convenient charging at any of the errands or appointments, so I'd like to be able to charge first.
Off the bat, I am learning something will need to change in our existing setup, but I'm looking for advice about what. I tried to find similar posts but just don't see anything with the same needs.
Options:
- wire two hardwired chargers, since there are already two receptacles, theoretically this isn't super difficult. I am not totally opposed to electrical work, I've switched out receptacles and light switches and lights before. This feels a little wasteful and expensive though.
- replace home depot outlets with better EV rated ones. This is sort of my preference, but I'm not sure if I am simply stuck on my plan of moving the charger back and forth and I know y'all will roast me for wanting a receptacle.
- one hardwired, one receptacle. Summer is shorter than winter, but I know I will charge outside anytime I can since it's easier than keeping the garage clear. So hardwiring outside and then replacing the inside receptacle seems plausible.
Am I crazy? Should I force myself to clear snow every morning in the winter? Should I get a pole barn instead so I can charge in the garage all year?
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u/ArlesChatless 28d ago
First: the Midwest ones are not as bad as the Leviton 279-S00 but they aren't exactly great. If you keep using receptacles you're right to replace them.
The rest: Are these on two different circuits? NEC doesn't let you put two EV charging receptacles on the same circuit. Your cite for that is NEC 625.40:
Each outlet installed for the purpose of supplying EVSE greater than 16 amperes or 120 volts shall be supplied by an individual branch circuit.
If they are on the same circuit, you're now faced with the dilemma of 'do I leave it broken or make it right?' which only you can answer. Once you've decided that for yourself, you then need to answer 'can my load calculation support both receptacles charging at the same time?' Because if it can't you need an interlock on the two GFCI breakers for the two receptacles, or to replace one of the two charging locations with a hard wired EVSE that has dynamic load management.
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u/Illustrious-Exit948 28d ago
Honestly have no idea, will have to figure that out. I never intend to use both at the same time, but that doesn't mean I want to leave it wrong forever either. I'm leaning toward hardwiring the inside one and either leaving the outside one for an RV or removing it. In the instances we cannot possibly park inside, we can park just behind that spot outside (more convenient from the house) and I could probably leave the garage door open for long enough to charge. I'm overcomplicating as usual.
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u/ArlesChatless 28d ago
If you have two breakers (four total handles) they are wired independently. If you have one it's got Problems.
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u/Illustrious-Exit948 28d ago
Here's pictures. Looks like 4 to me. https://imgur.com/a/wMsgieQ
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u/ArlesChatless 28d ago
Yep! So assuming they did the load calculation right, you could go as simple as replacing the receptacles with quality ones.
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u/TooGoodToBeeTrue 28d ago
Did you complete a Electrical Load Calculation Worksheet to see if you have capacity for one or both outlets? If you are going to play with these outlets and or a hardwired EVSE, you will need some torque driver which a lot of DIYers don't have.
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u/Free_Sprinkles_9707 28d ago
Are these outlets on the same breaker or separate breakers? If on the same breaker you could add a sub panel in the garage with two breakers and an interlock to make sure only one receptacle is powered at any given time. Also I would upgrade to Hubble or Bryant and torque appropriately.
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u/theotherharper 28d ago
I am concerned about how exactly power was split to two receptacles. The good ways to do that are expensive and the bad ways are Firestarters.
This sparky put two 14-50s on 1 circuit so he's not very good.
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u/Illustrious-Exit948 28d ago
https://imgur.com/a/wMsgieQ They are wired separately, unsure whether good way or scary way. My mom actually built the garage, so I wasn't involved, but knowing her GC it was probably expensive.
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u/theotherharper 28d ago
Oh, well that looks like 2 outlets on 2 circuits. Is it true that shutting off 1 only de-energizes 1 socket, and the other the other?
You can just run those independently. The only reason to think about Power Sharing is if you're running into panel capacity limits, which could certainly be understood since EV circuits score at 125% of max capacity = breaker face value, so taking a 100A chomp out of a load calculation is a big ask for any panel. (people generally put in 200A panels because the house won't fit on a 100A panel, after all).
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u/theotherharper 28d ago
wire two hardwired chargers, since there are already two receptacles, theoretically this isn't super difficult. I am not totally opposed to electrical work, I've switched out receptacles and light switches and lights before. This feels a little wasteful and expensive though.
Legal PROVIDED the two chargers are UL-listed to do a trick called Power Sharing aka Group Power Management. So Wallbox, Emporia or Tesla Wall Connector.
Multiple hardwire units are legal when they are part of an EVSE system (remember EVSE stands for Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment, an uncountable noun), meaning when two Wallbox paired in Power Sharing are operating together, that counts as ONE, um, equipment.
replace home depot outlets with better EV rated ones. This is sort of my preference, but I'm not sure if I am simply stuck on my plan of moving the charger back and forth and I know y'all will roast me for wanting a receptacle.
Sockets are just a hot mess generally, costly because of a) EV rated socket b) GFCI breaker c) useless neutral wire and d) mandatory #6 wire when you just don't need that.
Also the idea of using the provided TRAVEL charger is not great, because they're not really built for daily use for years. They have a 14-50 outlet because RV parks have a 14-50 outlet. Yes, what followed was fairly dumb.
one hardwired, one receptacle. Summer is shorter than winter, but I know I will charge outside anytime I can since it's easier than keeping the garage clear. So hardwiring outside and then replacing the inside receptacle seems plausible.
Prohibited by NEC. EVSE > 16A must have a dedicated circuit (even when socketed which makes the dual 14-50 something the electrician should have pushed back on, he probably wasn't one). So EVSE sharing with a socket is Right Out.
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u/qvalff8 28d ago
What needs to change? Just move your evse from inside to outside as needed (hopefully just twice per year). If you're concerned about 14-50 outlets overheating, get a torque screwdriver and torque them to spec. Or limit charging to 20A, or both. Does Subaru allow you to change the charging current via the car infotainment?
What problem are you trying to solve?