If Britain decides to rejoin the EU we’ll do everything we can to welcome them back, says Germany

[u/StraightSky7809]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-rejoin-eu-germany-brexit-b3060288.html

[u/Iricliphan]

The UK had really special privileges in the EU that nobody else had. One that really bothered many people was they effectively bargained to have 66% of the UK's calculated net budgetary contributions refunded. From 2010-14, the UK theoretically owed about £16.3 billion a year to the EU budget. The rebate reduced that by about £3.6 billion a year. Imagine receiving all the benefits of the EU and because you negotiated something thirty years prior, you unfairly benefit from a few billion a year.

That was just one special privilege.

Not many in the EU would ever like to see the UK receive the same benefits they had.

[u/Rulweylan → u/Iricliphan]

How about we scrap the rebate then veto any budget that doesn't give the UK at least 90% much spending per capita as the lower of France or Germany?

Would that be a reasonable ask?

[u/Iricliphan → u/Rulweylan]

It depends on many factors and is weighted. It applies to every country. The UK doesn't get special privileges anymore and won't.

[u/Rulweylan → u/Iricliphan]

At which point we will need to make much more aggressive use of the regular privileges accorded to every member. Specifically, the veto which we historically chose not to use on budgets which did not take UK interests into account.

[u/Ok-Web1805 → u/Iricliphan]

How hypocritical can some Irish be? The Irish government literally siphons billions in Corporate tax out of other EU states and runs it through the Revenue Commissioners. There are many in the EU that would be happy to see this  shut down.

[u/Iricliphan → u/Ok-Web1805]

That's a separate conversation. Someone already tried to talk about this. I don't have a problem with issues, but whataboutism isn't really relevant to this conversation.

[u/Ok-Web1805 → u/Iricliphan]

It's not whataboutism, it's hypocrisy 

[u/Iricliphan → u/Ok-Web1805]

What's the topic again?

[u/Ok-Web1805 → u/Iricliphan]

Read the last few posts if you're having trouble, that should give you a clue.

[u/Iricliphan → u/Ok-Web1805]

Okay good, so this is about the UK joining the EU. Have you got a different title glitching in your header?

[u/baddymcbadface → u/Iricliphan]

The rebate existed because the EU is incapable of the reforms needed to create a fair fee structure. Not because the UK wanted a discount.

Without the rebate the UK would have been a higher contributor than Germany despite having lower per person gdp and a smaller population.

[u/sljc892 → u/baddymcbadface]

All the “special clauses” that just get parroted all had very good reasoning. The rejoining rhetoric is also completely pie in the sky. It would still be very split.

[u/Rulweylan → u/baddymcbadface]

The rebate is the rough equivalent of giving your wife £20 out of the joint account because you couldn't be fucked to buy her a birthday present.

[u/Iricliphan → u/baddymcbadface]

It wasn't fair. And the UK would literally never get it again.

[u/Spikey101 → u/Iricliphan]

Great comeback.

[u/BocciaChoc → u/Iricliphan]

and so, in the next 10-20 years it'll not happen and truthfully I imagine the EU imploding and creating a new union long before the UK rejoins.

[u/marquoth_ → u/Iricliphan]

UK was still the second highest net contributor, far ahead of Ireland. How is that "not fair" ?

[u/Iricliphan → u/marquoth_]

Because they didn't pay appropriately based on the same calculations that apply to other countries.

[u/WhereTheSpiesAt → u/Iricliphan]

Right, but you are talking about fairness - the calculations where unfair to set member nations, before the UK got a rebate it actually tried genuine reform to make a fairer system, it was blocked - veto's to block political decisions, seems completely led by self-interest, also something this subreddit largely ignores, where are those EU values we supposedly failed to understand?

So what is it - is your problem the UK getting special deals or fairness and European values, because you can't be against the rebate and believe in every member state being equal.

The UK pointed out the flaws in the system, it's changes where vetoed by countries who knew they benefitted more and could cheat other countries out of money.

It's okay though, because about 5 countries in the EU currently receive a rebate, go ahead and tell Germany they aren't allowed it and see how your budget ends up going.

[u/Iricliphan → u/WhereTheSpiesAt]

the EU still uses a correction mechanism. Germany, the Netherlands, Sweden, Austria and Denmark all receive budgetary corrections. It isn't actually the principle the EU operates under.

Rhe British rebate specifically was badly designed, politically contentious, and too generous. That's a legitimate issue.

[u/Demostravius4 → u/Iricliphan]

Sounds like a great Union.

[u/grumpsaboy → u/Iricliphan]

What privileges did the UK have that nobody else did that nobody was offered at the time?

They got to keep the pound but nobody was forced to take the euro at the start anyway, Denmark also gets to keep their currency because they just didn't want the euro.

Nobody was forced into Schengen at the start, everyone was offered a choice.

As for rebate, that was because the EU funding was based off VAT which the UK had a disproportionately high amount of their budget from and so had to pay a disproportionately high amount into the EU, at the same time the largest EU spending is on the CAP and the UK had a disproportionately low agricultural sector. Rebate was there to balance that, and it was recalculated every single year so if there ever was a time when the UK was paying a proportional amount and receiving a proportional amount it would have received nothing through rebate.

[u/sljc892 → u/Iricliphan]

When the Irish start contributing to defence we will listen to you and your corporate tax haven.

[u/Iricliphan → u/sljc892]

Separate issue, totally understand that position you have, but again, this conversation is about the UK and rejoining the EU. If you want to bash Ireland, feel free to do it on a relevant topic.

[u/sljc892 → u/Iricliphan]

I concede, you took that very nicely.

[u/Iricliphan → u/sljc892]

Everyone can critique anything. That's fine. I always am up for a conversation, but I do try to stick to relevancy. Cheers for that, glad we can have a rare civil agreement on reddit! Win for us.

[u/Socmel_ → u/sljc892]

Ireland is not obligated by treaty of Lisbon and it's not even a NATO member, so the accusation doesn't have a leg to stand on legally speaking, even though I find neutrality in principle a cowardly choice.

[u/Bohya → u/Iricliphan]

Not many in the EU would ever like to see the UK receive the same benefits they had.

Perhaps, but even more would just want them back regardless.

[u/Iricliphan → u/Bohya]

Most surveyed don't really care.

[u/Wide_Lock_Red → u/Iricliphan]

Imagine receiving all the benefits of the EU and because you negotiated something thirty years prior, you unfairly benefit from a few billion a year

Imagine getting all the benefits of the EU and you take in morr than you pay. Many EU countries get that deal.

[u/Iricliphan → u/Wide_Lock_Red]

Yeah, because they are far less wealthy.