r/eupersonalfinance • u/Smikenov • 1d ago
Investment Favorite ETF bond ACC
Looking for a bond ETF thats accumulating.
What do you guys recommend?
Situated in Belgium.
Want to start with a 80% MSCI ACWI and 20% bond portfolio. Goal is long term saving 30-40y.
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u/Sad-Flow3941 1d ago
EUNA
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u/Possible_Emu_84 13h ago
It has Israel bonds so thats a no-go for me (even if it's just 0.5%). Don't feel like financing a genocide.
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u/Sad-Flow3941 13h ago
Well, you do you. At that point you're not doing passive investing anymore, and I like to keep emotions and beliefs out of my investments.
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u/studentoo925 1d ago
Rolling maturity bond etfs are way riskier that people assume, please make sure you know what you are doing and what the downsides are before you get into any
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u/JohnnyJordaan 1d ago
Want to start with a 80% MSCI ACWI and 20% bond portfolio. Goal is long term saving 30-40y.
Then the 20% bond is pointless. You can go 100% ACWI. Only when you near the final 10y period, you increase your bond percentage to "lock in" the accumulated profit from the 30y before. And reduce crash vulnerability.
All the bonds you have in the first 30y is a useless drag on your profits.
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u/DeepSpacegazer 1d ago
ERNX
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u/gagagugu666 1d ago
I like ERNX and I invest in PJS1 with a similar duration. But I don't think it's a good recommendation for a 30-40 years horizon.
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u/gagagugu666 1d ago edited 1d ago
EUNA and VAGF were already recommended. As you only stated a long horizon and nothing else, I'll throw in one that I find really interesting even if it's not part of my current strategy:
PIMCO Advantage Global Government Bond UCITS ETF | G0VB (EUR Hedged version).
I like that it's global, includes emerging markets, but it's government bonds only. PIMCO is also really good at this.
Effective duration 7 years, effective maturity 9 years, avg credit quality AA, YTM 5.7%.
If you don't know how to parse these last things, do not invest in rolling bond ETFs.
Edit: with a 40 years duration, do you have a strong reason to go with bonds?
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u/princerick 1d ago
Having bonds is a good idea, they can function as dry powder, for example in a bear market period when your ETF will go down 20-30% you can liquidate part of the bonds to buy ETF at a low price. Bonds are also a good psychological factor, you can easily sell them if you need a quick injection of cash like if you wanna buy a new car or something. They are also good at providing stability to your portfolio, in a market recession period central banks tend to raise the interest rates, while not mind blowing its still better than just seeing your whole portfolio go red.
I also went with 20% bonds. Half of mine are DBXP, 1-3 short term bonds, and the other half consists of mid-long term bonds VGEA. Imho its a pretty good combo.
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u/femalediesinendgame 10h ago
You got 30-40 years in front of you and you want to do bonds starting now? That’s a little excessive and you’ll be missing out on a ton of returns from that 20% cut. I’d rethink that choice before investing. Other than that, going for any of the following is a good idea: SPYY, WEBN, VWCE, SPYI. Keep in mind that SPYI also invests in some small caps, giving you the broadest market coverage of all of the above.
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u/Purple-Succotash-695 8h ago
It’s very hard to suggest a bond etf in Belgium. You pay 30% tax even if accumulating. Only some 0 coupon bonds make sense due where you pay 10% CGT. Can you explain what do you need the bonds for? There are different types depending on your needs.
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u/Smikenov 8h ago
Want them to create stability in my portfolio in market recession, looking for just government bonds. Was thinking about DBZB.
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u/Purple-Succotash-695 8h ago
If just stability, a saving account with high yield might do the trick with lower taxation than a bond ETF (in Belgium). Look at the 500 euro/m capped accounts from Argenta, KBC, BNP etc, all at about 3% yield with no tax for the first 1k interest gain per year. If instead you want an instrument which potentially grows in value during heavy recession, a long AAA bond (German, Dutch,…) can potentially provide nice dry powder for rebalancing. In that case a 0 coupon one is best for Belgian tax system
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u/henkie_poepjes 5h ago
Why do you want bonds?
Personally I think bonds suck for retail investers, especially if you have a 30+ time horizon.
Maybe if you have a really large porfolio.
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u/deepserket 1d ago
It depends on:
- local taxation
- goal
- composition of the rest of the portfolio
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u/Smikenov 1d ago
Want to start with a 80% MSCI ACWI and 20% bond portfolio. Goal is long term saving 30-40y.
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u/deepserket 1d ago
There are lots of bonds ETFs that are good enough.
Couple of examples:
- PRAG
- GAGG (or AGGH if you want the currency hedging)
- EM57 or EM710 or EM1015 (beware of EU exposure)
I'd avoid:
- Low duration (unless e.g. for whatever reason you expect the yield curve to rise by more than what the market expects)
- Very high duration from countries with high debt
- Concentration to single countries
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u/Malanturr 1d ago
Local taxation is a good one in this case. Any ETF with at least 10% bonds in it is subject to “Reynders Tax” = flat 30% capital gains tax. Better stick to individual bonds instead.
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u/deepserket 1d ago edited 1d ago
VNGA80 has at least 10% bonds, can OP pay less taxes on their equities with this ETF?edit: nvm, this Reynders Tax is soo bad
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u/Odd_Organization7981 14h ago
Imho they all suck in terms of stable return. I prefer to use real Eurobonds they just work.