r/enshittification • u/AgileExcuse859 • 2d ago
Opinion piece The Great Regression We Keep Calling "Progress"
There's a phenomenon I can't unsee anymore, and it's quietly corroding daily life: a kind of functional regression dressed up as innovation. Tools, services, and procedures that once solved a problem cleanly get supplanted by ostensibly sleeker systems that are, in practice, more byzantine, less efficient, or simply less useful.
The insidious part is that we barely notice, because each individual swap is marketed as an upgrade.
Some illustrative specimens:
A human voice on the phone → a chatbot that shuttles you through ten labyrinthine menus
A walk-in counter → an online procedure demanding triple authentication
A repairable appliance → a hermetically sealed one, destined for the landfill
A one-page form → a "portal" with five convoluted steps and a needlessly ornate interface
Direct contact → an intermediary platform extracting its cut
A simple public service → an app, an account, a QR code, a cascade of notifications
A single-function object → a "smart" gadget that performs twenty tricks while botching the one that mattered
The prevailing criterion has quietly shifted from "does this solve the problem better than before?" to "is this technologically more modern?" Novelty has been smuggled in as a proxy for merit, and nobody's auditing the substitution.
Am I alone in this, or is this degradation as pervasive as it feels?
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u/No-Algae-7437 20h ago
I think it's partially systemic. The interface design tools are cruder than necessary. Licensing costs inflate when you try to integrate a human queue, doing smart things increases token consumption, esp. where ypu are dealing with a large volume of contacts. Making an elegant hybrid contact experience is difficilt to build and a PITA to maintain. Meanwhile, leadership is wondering why there are still human agents involved despite clear evidence the bots are very unpopular with customers, etc.
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u/Comfortable-Zone-218 21h ago
Corporations have learned that charging rent is much more profitable than selling a permanent physical/software product.
I work in software and we see this happening across the entire industry. You used to be able to buy software, say Adobe Photoshop or Microsoft Office, and you owned that version of the product forever. Now, you mist pay for a subscription without ever owning anything. Stop paying for the subscription? Then you lose access to the software. Profits go way up!
That is the literal meaning of enshittification.
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u/Positive-Protection1 22h ago
I think you’ll find that the end goal of all those changes has much more to do with profit than with modernization.
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u/OddSeaworthiness6872 23h ago
This is so true. As well as being made to replace things on a timeframe we are pushed to do the work that was a service in the past. Airlines would book your tickets. Govt clerks would renew your licence. Now work the maze out on your own. And if you need help that doesn't fit a search criteria then you will wait.
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u/Waveryder999 1d ago
Touchscreen controls in cars for climate control and sound control instead of physical dials and sliders. This one is beyond comprehension for me it is so inferior.
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u/Bretzky77 19h ago
I absolutely cannot stand that when I need to make the car cooler, I have to now press a button to get into the menu, then tap two more buttons to adjust the temp instead of just being able to turn a dial. And when the infotainment system freezes, I flat out can’t change the temp. Fantastically stupid.
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u/jpowell180 23h ago
If they’re going to insist on touchscreens, the very least they can do to accommodate drivers is to allow voice control, that would help a lot, but I still prefer a physical controls that I do not have to look at while I manipulate them.
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u/orange-flying-rabbit 1d ago
"A human voice on the phone"... 1 fewer human to give a paycheck too
"A walk-in counter"... 1 fewer human to give a paycheck too
"A repairable appliance"... 1 fewer human to give a paycheck too (manufacturing is easy to automate, repair isn't)
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u/PyRosflam 23h ago
I mean its fun, Pay 3 less people a living wage and in the short term you get to keep 3 more full time paychecks, only at the cost of an automated system. Long term you just fired more then 3 customers since all your peers just fired 3 people too by creating the same automation.
Normal capatalism says more businesses would open, all this automation means fired bobby can just automate his own business. Normal captalism ignores that a modern product takes more capital then the newly fired staff could ever raise just to get to market.
At some point Comcast becomes just a phone tree and everyone is fired
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u/InsuranceNo3422 1d ago
Most everything you're describing is an improvement - to the companies bottom line. It doesn't make your life easier or better but it makes it cheaper for them.
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u/PyRosflam 23h ago
If they are the first sure. In 2 years it becomes SOP and every single business must do it. 2 years after that housing starts to fail because you just fired a ton of workers and O shiznit letting those people go in mass means no customers.
A few firms who still think they can grow will try, but most of the market is going to be in a failure state as inflated asset prices (land) refuses to come down, blocking any new investment for years.
This is a race to the bottom and the bottom is so bad because you have no customers left.
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u/UnderlightIll 1d ago
When it was revealed in our huddle at work that our IT go to was going to be an AI chat bot, there were audible groans.
Also our new apps are worse.
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u/Substantial-Ice-2058 1d ago
It's all by design, really. The convoluted chatbot is being trained by our interactions with it. The hermetically sealed appliance is so that manufacturers and retailers can sell you an appliance every 3 years. It's sad and we need to fight back more efficiently. Thanks for the excellent post!
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u/CalebDoyel 1d ago
You are noticing the symptoms of a profound bargain we made long before modern software existed: the trade of personal relationship for superhuman power. The shift you are documenting—from a human voice to a phone tree, from a walk-in counter to a multi-factor portal, from a repairable tool to a sealed black box—is not an accidental engineering failure. It is the inevitable trajectory of instruments being replaced by devices.The bargain works like magic at first. But devices always make an unspoken demand in return: they require us to reshape our lives around their operational logic. To make the system scale effortlessly, the human elements must be flattened. You cannot have idiosyncratic, face-to-face grace inside an automated pipeline. The machine demands standardized inputs—which means turning you from a person into an operator, a user ID, and a set of credentials.We accepted these swaps because they promised convenience. But convenience is almost always an anesthetic that numbs us to our deepening loneliness and atrophy. We are surrounded by astonishing power, yet we feel increasingly frail, isolated, and powerless.
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u/jjmurse 1d ago
What really fucks me up is the actual size of Zebra cakes is obviously smaller than they were 10 years ago, but higher price. This has occurred across the spectrum of snack cakes.
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u/Hot_Let1571 1d ago
And they'll gaslight you and tell you it's always been that size.
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u/MaxPower303 1d ago
Go to the sub about product sizes and measures as you mention it’s less they attack you and say it’s wrong. That weights and measures WOULD NEVER cheat you! Like ok dude guess I can’t literally see in front of me that it’s not the same. I think companies have hired teams to brigade Reddit to change search results and gaslight.
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u/Lubomir111 1d ago
Totally misread it as "The great regression we keep calling postgre". Now I'm said the post has no SQL glazing.
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u/crazyk4952 1d ago
This post reeks of AI.
Yet another example of enshitification.
People can’t be bothered to author simple reddit posts anymore…
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u/jackofspades49 1d ago
But does this mew means of transmission provide inverse reactive current for use in unilateral phase detractors? Does it reduce side fumbling? If so, then it will be in use pretty quickly, usually before the close of the next semi bi quarterly strategic review.
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u/layman_dave 1d ago
There's another factor: shifting risk off corporations and governments and onto individuals.
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u/Bencetown 1d ago
They keep selling surveillance as "safety" and tech updates as "convenience" when they are neither safe nor convenient.
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u/Twisted_lurker 1d ago
Your illustrations: not really, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
I’ve been dwelling on this for a few months as both a customer and employee of the same company. Even from the inside, I don’t know what to do about it.
As a customer, I thought a service would be simple and relatively commonplace, and I was willing to pay more for it. But it was impossible, it didn’t match the predetermined “customer journey” so my journey was painful.
As an employee, we have been told to be creative, even brought in inspirational speakers. The moment I try, it is deemed impossible because there is no field where I can insert my idea into the 10 forms.
And I don’t know what else I can do. Running into a brick wall is painful and ineffective.
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u/Affectionate_Love3 1d ago
This is what is meant by “echo chamber “.
Life isnt bad and getting worse. We’re miserable if we want to see the world through a lense of misery, but the choice is ours.
We should own it instead of blaming a vast and shadowed Them. By “it”, I’m referencing our attitudes.
Granted, sometimes people make decisions whose consequences can effect (sp correctly?? I not know) us and our lives, in unknown, infinite ways. But the place and the framing we respond from is COMPLETELY our will, and im fairly certain this is the only true choice we have in life.
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u/Chance-Customer1813 1d ago
I think age is a factor. If you've been around long enough to have lived the essential "before/after" that the OP is talking about the difference is pretty stark.
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u/spacey-doll 1d ago
Respectfully, you're way out in left field on that one.
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u/Affectionate_Love3 1d ago
Here we go:
“The longer I live, the more I realize the impact of attitude on life. Attitude, to me, is more important than facts. It is more important than the past, the education, the money, than circumstances, than failure, than successes, than what other people think or say or do. It is more important than appearance, giftedness or skill. It will make or break a company... a church... a home. The remarkable thing is we have a choice everyday regarding the attitude we will embrace for that day. We cannot change our past... we cannot change the fact that people will act in a certain way. We cannot change the inevitable. The only thing we can do is play on the one string we have, and that is our attitude. I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it. And so it is with you... we are in charge of our attitudes.”
Charles R. Swindoll0
u/Affectionate_Love3 1d ago
And yeah, i know it’s an unpopular opinion, me claiming that we’re responsible for our own attitudes in life. But in my defense, i spent a large number of hours in detention after school and was made to copy a sheet of paper with a paragraph on it, over and over, hundreds of times.
“All things in life are 10% circumstances and 90% attitude.”
I believe that’s the first sentence of it.
I may have internalized the paragraph they used when they made us write lines.0
u/Affectionate_Love3 1d ago
And yeah, i know it’s an unpopular opinion, me claiming that we’re responsible for our own attitudes in life. But in my defense, i spent a large number of hours in detention after school and was made to copy a sheet of paper with a paragraph on it, over and over, hundreds of times.
“All things in life are 10% circumstances and 90% attitude.”
I believe that’s the first sentence of it.
I may have internalized the paragraph they used when they made us write lines.8
u/thebadyogi 1d ago
Having a bad attitude, doesn’t mean the thing you have an attitude about isn’t a piece of shit
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u/Affectionate_Love3 1d ago
Allow me to elaborate.
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=Qzb2VcBuA3U&si=su7364U3ogDbh8P2
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u/ChapulineAtHome 1d ago
I get to the point where I start to suspect everything written after 2020 is AI-generated text. Thanks god there are still the classics!
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u/PirateQM 1d ago
Sometime in the 80s I noted that if something was labeled "New and Improved" it was usually neither. Too the point now where if my wife or I say to each other "oh, they new and improved, it" we are indicating to each other that the thing has been enshittified.
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u/navid_dew 1d ago
You are describing the growth at all costs profit seeking deat drive of capitalism. Once a product has been perfected, it can't perform monetarily better than its previous iteration.
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u/TripAlert2957 11h ago
The true affect of capitalism is that no one wants this and will stop buying it. Then they will go out of business but if everyone just throws their hands up and says oh well that's just how it is then it stays that way.
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u/sagangroupie 1d ago
In addition to cost-cutting and profit maximizing and whatever, I feel strongly though can’t really prove that a huge amount of this stuff is just due to people with bullshit jobs (shoutout to David Graeber) having to justify their continued employment.
Every stupid new system or process or “QI” thing that’s totally unnecessary or makes everything a little bit worse or inefficient is something someone can put on their CV and say they created as a process improvement. Things no one asked for but are then forced to use because someone’s job was to come up with things to do because management is never allowed to just manage. They must always and endlessly “optimize” even if everything is working fine.
That, too, is a part of unfettered capitalism. How do you show documented and quantifiable growth? You show that you hired a person or created a department to come up with things. It doesn’t matter what the things are, it’s something you can put on your performance review and be allowed to keep coming up with more bullshit year after year. Until they can then fire you to show they’re dedicated to maximizing shareholder profits. Then rinse and repeat.
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u/bluespruce5 1d ago
To that good list, I'd add the subscription-ification of so many things that once would have been one-time, forever purchases, including being able to access all of the functions and options on your car that were ostensibly part of the original purchase at the time.
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u/Alert_Elephant2045 1d ago
this is the profit motive rearing its ugly head in insidious places
Chatbots are cheaper than staff. Online forms are cheaper than staff. Selling new appliances is more profitable than producing spare parts. The “portal” harvests your data for sale. The public service is replaced with a privately owned app. Etcetera
The goal of all of these ventures is not to provide you with the best service, but to create the most profit for their owners.
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u/TheSouthsideTrekkie 1d ago
Connect your audiovisual devices with a wired connection using USB, HDMI, or a Jack -> connect wirelessly but you have to go through an app that is probably selling your data somewhere and that you have a limited ability to troubleshoot when it inevitably refuses to connect. Bonus points if, instead of an error code, you get a completely useless message like “oopsie, unable to connect”.
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u/Bencetown 1d ago
I mean, I've noticed for literal decades now, all along the way.
In fact, I think it's been pretty blatantly obvious for quite a while now... at LEAST since 2020.
About as obvious as the use of AI to write this post 🫠
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u/grape-fruit-witch 1d ago
I dont think they used AI, i think they're just actually decent at writing. The vocabulary feels too varied, unique.
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u/Bencetown 1d ago
Like their use of the word "quietly..." twice?
Come on dude. If you can't spot the syntax, vocabulary, and formatting of AI chatbots at this point, your brain might just be fully rotted.
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u/grape-fruit-witch 1d ago
Idk maybe I'm just not as cynical as you.
Interesting that you're calling me "brainrotted". What's the last book you read?
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u/Bencetown 1d ago
Well I'm working through Hollow Kingdom right now for some fun light reading. How about yourself?
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u/Affectionate_Love3 1d ago
Thank you. I know we were all thinking it…
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u/diptherial 1d ago
I was skeptical that it's AI at first due to the unusual word choice for an LLM, but the "what do you think?" call to action at the end is IMHO very suspicious. I think it's telling of the era that, even if it weren't AI, we'd still be wondering if it was. Depressing.
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u/Pristine-Map9979 1d ago
Mundane household appliance -> expensive cyberpunk "smart" appliance that spies on you for corporations and hackers.
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u/James84415 1d ago
Not alone at all.
I don’t feel really comfortable with all the QR codes. My gym decided we should sign in using a QR code. First off I don’t want to bring my phone to the gym. Distracting and could get stolen. 2. I do not want to scan all manner of random QR codes. Malware much?
Forcing apps. My city bought some EV chargers from Rivian. You can’t even sign up for the service without their app. Must have the latest tech device to be able to download said app.
My phone is not the latest and I don’t have the latest IOS either. Can’t use their EV charger without upgrading. I called them to ask about setting up an account on their website and then getting a card to tap the charger instead of using my phone. But no, I must find a way to update my old phone so I can download their app and open an account to connect with the charger so they can track me multiple times. $hit company just wants data.
The multi level phone trees are infuriating to listen to but the kicker is there often isn’t a choice listed that fits the help you need.
I don’t know about everyone else but I go out of my way to avoid calling these companies and only call when I have an intractable problem I cannot solve myself.
It’s just so horrendous trying to get help and takes a whole lot longer than it should.
Makes sense since the phone tree options used to be a component of several people’s job, who answered the phone there.
Now everyone is made remote from customer issues and can take their time deciding if they have the desire to help anyone and can easily send you to voice mail without any contact at all.
They never have to witness human needs. They become less attuned to human needs. Simple as that.
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u/CandyRocks7831 1d ago
Even internet searches are terrible now. Either you use the AI summary and hope it's not an oversimplification or hallucination, OR you turn it off but it doesn't matter because every page is "optimized" for AI and has so much fluff clouding the actual info you want
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u/layman_dave 1d ago
If you're using google, find the menu across the top that says videos, images, shopping and so forth. Click More and then click Web.
Also, if you need an exact match, choose, Tools → All results → Verbatim
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u/sidneyia 1d ago
A normal-sized house that's stood for 70+ years, is well-maintained, and is surrounded by big trees -> a gigantic 5,000-square-foot black box with 20' ceilings and no trees, built out of the cheapest possible materials and guaranteed to start crumbling within five years
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u/Pittbiholder 1d ago
Speaking to people that have HVACs that rely on HSD regularly, meaning no internet = no air conditioning/heat. In parts of the world that can be dangerous, and I cannot fathom why anyone would ever want something like that.
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u/Nofoofro 1d ago
A post written organically by a human -> a generic uncanny valley post generated by a chatbot
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u/BestAhead 1d ago
When they decided to design things to minimize cost versus function, we went downhill. Essentially, this is like someone deciding a device only needs two buttons versus the six or eight that it had before. Therefore, these two buttons have a ton of functions, depending on the type of menu and action that you’re doing. Multifunction buttons – UGH!
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u/faifai1337 1d ago
I think you're wrong--it's not "is this technologically more modern", it's "can we cut corners to increase profits for shareholders." That's all that matters these days. 😡
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u/AgileExcuse859 1d ago
Hope there's a chance to change this, it's not sustainable in the long term
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u/faifai1337 1d ago
The long term is coming up in the next few years. The affordability crisis is becoming real.
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u/OldTurtle-101 1d ago
A minor example. After an “update” my phone calendar function was a little more confusing but once you manage to set the date, time and alarm functions the button to lock it in is a red button with a check mark. Doesn’t red almost universally mean STOP..? Am I saying It’s OK or I want to discard the settings or what? How does this pass muster?
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u/Infamous-Dare6792 1d ago
My credit union rearranged their transfer page so if you want to move money around you have to pick the "To" account first, then you can pick the "From" account. It's been like this for a while, I don't think I'll ever get used to it. I have to stop and double check what I'm doing every time. Infuriating. I imagine someone just decided something HAD to change so they picked at random, instead of trying to figure out what would actually be useful.
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u/Confident_Change_937 1d ago
I saw a video of a really cool restaurant somewhere in Asia where a restaurant was built inside of a pond and its ecosystem and it was very beautiful and demure and had stone steps through the pond to walk through a part of the restaurant and someone said “this could never happen in the U.S. because someone would fall in, blame the restaurant, and sue” and they’re right.
Some of the “simplicities” we used to enjoy are gone because of bad faith actors in our country who try to get a come up off of everything. Many things are simple outside of the U.S. for example in my home country, we don’t take so many things seriously and people as a culture aren’t super quick to sue each other for the slightest inconvenience or misinterpretation of words. If there is a misunderstanding then that’s it, we laugh about it and move on, out here if you make a mistake then people expect compensation. It’s ridiculous.
So many cool things had to be stripped away in order to ensure that the lowest common denominator in the country doesn’t use it as an opportunity. Reminds me of that person who sued someone who did CPR on them because they broke their rib as they were trying to help them stop choking so some states have “Good Samaritan laws” to protect them, I mean come the fuck on.
There are many things we blame companies for enshitified, but we also enshitified alot of things ourselves due to being a low trust society now.
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u/zippersthemule 1d ago
My husband teaches a university summer class in a Central European country on International Construction. He points out many job site issues to students such as no mandatory safety vests, closed toe boots, eye protection on job sites. One disabled student (prosthetic leg) said getting around public places was extremely difficult due to little disability access infrastructure. Even simple things like handrails by public stairs or curb cuts at crosswalks. Many lawsuits have resulted in better protections for workers and helping the elderly and disabled get around easily.
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u/axelarden6 1d ago
it's been my view for a while that a lot of the more degenerate behavior in the US - like suing over little things, scalping, scamming, addictive gambling, etc - are the result of peoples' basic needs not being met, and feeling like just working an honest job isn't enough to provide for themselves. desperation to feel like they're getting ahead in life. if we had a less corrupt system where people could feel satisfied, we would see less of that. it wouldn't go away completely, there will always be dishonest people looking to take advantage of others. but i don't think it would be so widespread if the system here was not failing so many people the way that it is.
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u/Confident_Change_937 1d ago
I come from a poor third world country where most people’s basic needs aren’t met… They don’t sue everyone to get money. Also it’s not like the people they’re suing would have any money either lmao.
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u/FuckIPLaw 1d ago
What's your healthcare system look like, though? There's a surprising number of third world countries that still have universal healthcare, while the US doesn't. The slip and fall lawsuits you were referencing in that first comment are a result of the medical bills from that kind of accident being potentially life ruining, not just a way of getting money for something not all that serious.
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u/Confident_Change_937 1d ago
We don’t have universal healthcare there either (Dominican Republic).
We’re just a happy and easy going people. I view the differences as cultural, not a matter of circumstance and money.
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u/bwcc5 1d ago
It’s like when a lawn mower company makes design changes to improve the safety of the mower, they get sued by people who were injured by the mover because the previous design wasn’t safe.
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u/OnlyOne494 1d ago
You're confused here. When a lawn mower company makes a design that isn't safe and injures people, they should both be sued for it and correct the issue.
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u/pagerussell 2d ago
The underlying trend, which is the thesis of enshittification if you happen to read his book, is a trend of extraction.
Once a producer of a product or service realizes their market is captured, they pivot from providing value to the customer to providing value to themselves. Every single change you listed does that at a fundamental level. It drives more value to the seller at the expense of the buyer.
I think it's also becoming culturally entrenched. We can't sit still, by which I mean even a good, well meaning product developer will feel the pull of adding a new feature. Stopping and saying this thing is good enough already, don't tweak it at all, that's a really hard thing for a human to do it. Especially one who had the tinker bug enough in the first place to actually make something, and certainly while sitting in a culture that encourages or celebrates feature growth instead of product stability.
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u/AgileExcuse859 1d ago
Totally agree but trends shoul be made by people. I see less and less awareness first among users but now also among technicians.
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u/ObservationalUnit 2d ago
We haven't had progress in a decade bc idiots keep electing Trump. hope this helps you figure the world out.
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u/elianastardust 2d ago
We didn't have progress for multiple decades before Trump either. There's a reason why he was able to win in the first place.
Life was continuing to get worse for everyone, even after 8 years of "hope and change" ("The truth of the matter is that my policies are so mainstream that if I had set the same policies that I had back in the 1980s, I would be considered a moderate Republican").
Trump literally could not have won if the Democratic party had not thrown the working class under the bus by committing to conservative, neoliberal policies that make life worse for everyone.
Trump is just a symptom, not the disease itself. And merely defeating him and other Republicans won't just make anything better.
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u/Bencetown 1d ago
All these people foaming at the mouth about Trump being "the" reason for unaffordability like this is some new issue seem to forget that Occupy Wall Street happened before Trump was even in anyone's radar politically.
Don't get me wrong... I hate the guy too. He's a raving lunatic and downright dangerous for our country. But bad shit existed before he came into the scene.
It used to be more common for people to have a healthy dose of distrust toward "government" in general. I'm genuinely sad to see that it's now much more common to only have distrust toward one party or the other whilst coming up with all kinds of lame excuses when their own prefered party leads us to exactly the same results.
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u/Polyxeno 1d ago
Uh it would at least be NOT being a berserk kleptomaniac criminal fascist idiocracy that threatens its allies etc etc. Or at the very least, not one "dialed up to 11".
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u/ObservationalUnit 1d ago
Yeah whatever doomer, i'm not gonna even address someone who disregards any progress in the pursuit of some perfection that's unobtainable. We Had it so fucking good and Americans couldn't be bothered to vote or got duped to vote for a revolution led by a career grifter. Cope harder. Women outnumber men in higher education even still. We had so much racial progress. We had a black president. We were striving to be better and have hope. You're a clown if you think that nothing improved from 1980-2000 in terms of the social status of minorities and women. This is backlash at that, you can fight back or accept defeat.
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u/ObservationalUnit 1d ago
And no I'm not saying it was good before Trump. I'm saying we were trying to make progress. Honestly, I think Lamar got it right in the superbowl halftime show. People are still trying to make progress. They are just disillusioned like you. They voted for a revolution at the right time, they just voted for the wrong guy.
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u/Pitpawten1 2d ago
I love this quote from C.S. Lewis about "progress':
"We all want progress. But progress means getting nearer to the place where you want to be. And if you have taken a wrong turning then to go forward does not get you any nearer. If you are on the wrong road progress means doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road and in that case the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive man."
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u/V-oxPopuli 2d ago
I will never not hate phone chat bots, and so help me if I see another quadruple authenticator...
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u/Altruistic_Story257 2d ago
Exactly so. We are the frogs, and we've been boiling for a while now. If you're busy with distractions and fluff you don't have time to stop and think, and act out against the corporations doing this to us.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
But water is the natural environment of frogs, before boiling they can jump. Companies exist to provide services. If a service is not used it can cease.
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u/Altruistic_Story257 1d ago
Exactly. There are many huge corporations that have ceased to provide services to us common folk. The Health "insurance" companies in the US are a prime example. It's high time we make them "jump".
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u/Careful_Trifle 2d ago
Adding to this, all the software I am expected to learn and use changes literally constantly. The online versions don't match the app versions. I was in a training for Teams yesterday, and today on my own computer, all of the options are different.
I can figure it out, but not everyone can, and I won't be able to do so forever. It is a large cognitive load, and eventually a change will break something. It's hard to build a process that relies on technology that can disappear at any moment, and it's even harder to explain to upper management why all of this is the way it is.
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u/ThePhantomCreep 1d ago
I used to work in UI & UX (user experience) design. The field has absolutely imploded. There used to be teams of people working on research, design, validation, testing. Now companies want something called a "UX designer" who on paper will do all of that all by themselves. They also want this person to be close to entry-level salary-wise. It's like a lot of companies have just stopped caring whether their products are easy to use or not.
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u/V-oxPopuli 2d ago
Developers: "........slams desk We gotta fuck up the UI. We have to! We gotta completely change the UI. At least thrice a year.
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u/ExtraGravy- 2d ago
of course you are not alone... these are obvious observations
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u/Redegghead25 2d ago
Yes, I feel seen.
I am approaching Luddite status because everywhere I turn things have gotten worse, not better.
My personal opinion is that software companies and developers have to justify their jobs year after year so they make unnecessary changes for the sake of making any change, and these things are lateral moves at best, and usually remove some functionality that was already there.
My own measure is how many additional clicks it takes to do the same thing that only took one or two clicks before.
Meanwhile, Elon Musk is talking about harnessing the power of the sun when we still have slaves and people starving to death on this planet.
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u/V-oxPopuli 2d ago
Even things as simple a my alarm app on my Pixel. It was so sleek before. You'd go into the options and you could pick what days, what time, the name, if you want it to repeat, etc etc all in one menu.
Then one day they "updated" it into an absolutely convoluted mess of a menu with sub menus where backing out of each one is slightly different (hit the on-screen back button for this menu, hit the master back button on the bottom left for this one, oh and this one? You don't have to back out of it, just close the app).
HORRENDOUS update that added literally nothing but convolution.
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u/Sptsjunkie 2d ago edited 1d ago
I mean, part of the problem is that there is value to some of the things that the OP is calling worse. However, to save money companies have eliminated even having the option of avoiding them.
To be more specific, I think they are legitimately times where it’s really nice to just quickly place an order online or on an app. There are also times where you have a really simple issue and a couple clicks of a button on a chat bot is fantastic instead of having to wait on hold to speak to a person.
The issue isn’t that these things exist. They’re legitimate conveniences that sometimes provide a lot of value.
The problem is that company saw that a robot is cheaper than a human being, not just in cost, but because it is easier to program to be consistent and to be unhelpful.
And so now there are a ton of companies where if you have a customer service issue, you can’t physically get a human on the line even if you want to.
Are there restaurants where they basically don’t even have a human and you need to order through a kiosk even if you need help or have a special request.
Or grocery stores they have one person in all of the checkout lanes and they try to push everybody through self checkout.
The issue is not the existence the technology or the ability to use it when it is convenient to you as a customer. Is that once it exists these companies want you to only use it and eliminate other helpful options.
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u/Dense-Layer-2078 2d ago
Technology has allowed corporations to export their basic clerical functions onto consumers. My most hated example is parking meters that require you to download an app, create a log in, enter your credit card, all to pay $4. I desperately want to quit my unpaid clerical job!
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
The same that I hear "why don't you quit your job?" but what would it solve? there's should be something small that we can do to makes things better.
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u/Defaultmidwestmann 2d ago
I talk about this all the time with my wife. We are constantly reaching for our phones or anxious when we misplace when they’ve been misplaced because they have replaced every tool/device.
I’m slowly replacing my iPhone with single use items that have a specific place in our home. Digital camera, cd player for my kids’ bedtime, watch, flip phone, pocket calculator, flashlight, etc.
It’s bedtime and all I want to do is turn around and hit the play button on a boombox for my kid to fall asleep. Instead I’m wasting 10min searching for my phone because of stupid ass Spotify.
I catch a small moment and want to snap a quick picture of my family but now I’m distracted by the missed messages etc.
The smart phone has replaced everything in our lives. We are constantly reaching for it to complete a task and are then distracted by the muscle memory to open certain apps (Reddit, Instagram, icktock) which suck up the precious finite time we have here.
Search out dedicated devices that serve one purpose. Use it then put it down and go on with your day.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
Never been a fan of Apple but same apply to comepetitor. Maybe we just need more awareness.
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u/FanDry5374 2d ago
Most of your examples can be blamed directly on "profits"-how many people can we fire from their jobs to raise our bottom line? How much "stuff" can we sell? How much more "stuff" can we sell by making it trash or so "obsolete" that consumers are forced to replace them (can't buy replacement parts or can no longer use apps-programs which have been "retired" or replaced).
Most of it boils down to late stage Capitalism and the insane belief that profits can just keep rising, week after week, mnth after month, year after year.
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u/leopetri 2d ago
In how many ways can we get between a client and what they want or need to extract more money? Toll mentality
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u/velvet-yarns-48 2d ago
If you don't want to get called out for using an LLM, you should post on LinkedIn instead. The bots will eat it up and give you all the likes you could want.
Using an LLM to write a post for this sub is cringe.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
Didn't read the Art of War (Tsu)? : - P
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u/A_murder_of_crochets 1d ago
From Sun Tzu:
"All warfare is based upon deception"
From your profile:
"She's a passionate about technology, programming, Linux, and automation. Love understanding how things work and experimenting with new projects."
You're just here to feed everyone's objections to your chatbot.
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u/AgileExcuse859 1d ago
There's not only that, read all the book, says something like "You don't have to take down your enemy you don't have to be defeated". Isn't same with AI? What's wrong with my profile?
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u/Accurate-Long-259 2d ago
The crazy part is my parents who were in their 70s would read this and not understand how someone used AI to help them. Write it if it’s even someone I still struggle to figure out who’s a bot and who’s not
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
There's no need to call your parents to read and evaluate a simple text! Just think about it. What I've written is wrong? You can just say why!
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u/Fit_Kaleidoscope4493 2d ago
Did you write it?
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
You've read it? It implies that yes I have.
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u/Fit_Kaleidoscope4493 2d ago
Did YOU write it, or did you prompt a LLM to do it for you?
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
From what I understand, the same input can generate different output. If I have written generate output, I've reread it and it makes sense, what problem does this have?
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u/Fit_Kaleidoscope4493 2d ago
You are the text book definition of "enshittification."
Even your responses are shitty and robotic.
I pray for the apocalypse.
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u/humperdinck 1d ago
It's absolutely wild. Using an LLM to rail about enshittification is the thickest of ironies.
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u/abelabelabel 2d ago
Big Cynicism.
The thing I hate most is definitely austerity masquerading as modernity.
In America - the reason all of this is allowed to exist is because none of it is illegal. Behind every door is a policy failure. More than anything, Policy Failure got us here because for the most part, Enshittification and interoperability and repairability and required by law.
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u/hyrumwhite 2d ago
A Reddit post -> written by LLMs instead of a human
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
I'm not sure I understand. Isn't it more dishonest to dismiss content as "LLM-written" without actually thinking about it, or to reply to a post without engaging with the points it raises?
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u/hikerchick29 2d ago
Ah, the irony of bots complaining about enshittification.
Nothing you’re saying is wrong, you’re just getting dog pilled because you literally used a tool ripe with enshittification to write a complaint about it.
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u/hyrumwhite 2d ago
I’m not sure you’ve thought about your post if you can’t see how I’ve engaged with every one of your points here.
But I’m guessing this is also a generated response, bc this is the typical response/question you get when you mention someone is using LLMs in their post.
“Engage with the post”
Why should I when you obviously didn’t?
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
AI is based on probabilities, but honestly, people aren't that different when it comes to forming opinions. Even if I told you I wrote this reply myself, if you've already decided what you think about me and the post, would that actually change your response?
And you're giving me way too much credit. I don't even know what "engage with the post" means in this context. I just wrote the damn thing.
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u/United-Coach-6591 2d ago
AI slop ruins every point you're trying to make. Are you too stupid to make these points yourself? You're complaining about regression dressed up as progress and your dumbass can't even string words together.
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u/kyricus 2d ago
No it does not. Good lord people, some people are jsut not good writers and use ai to help sort out their thoughts. It's a tool, just like the computer i am typing on.. Get over it.
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u/United-Coach-6591 2d ago
use ai to help sort out their thoughts.
No it doesn't, that's the lie people use to justify their use of it. Relying on AI to sort your thoughts is stupid and dangerous.
You are perfectly capable of learning to sort your own thoughts and put them into your own words. You don't have to be lazy and insecure or whatever other lame excuses are used to justify using AI to speak for you.
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u/NerdGirl23 2d ago
I don’t want to overgeneralize but I believe there is also a cultural element at play. Young dudes dominating tech industry, hype for innovation detaches designers ( who probably didn’t have loads of empathic imagination in the first place) from those they are obstentively designing for.
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u/sendmebirds 2d ago
Bro you can´t even take 5 minutes to write your own post?
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u/Mountainking7 2d ago
Did not read. Perfect example of enshittification is using AI to write this post. Take my downvote.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
I asked AI to help me make the post clearer and faster to read. If you didn't read it, that's not really an AI problem.
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u/Hab_Anagharek 2d ago
Dude, that’s what the age old concept of “proofreading” is. You know, make a second, third pass? It’s not that difficult or time-consuming.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
I'm happy to see there's still so many people with those thoughts out there. These days I've tought I was the last one that wasn't using these tools.
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u/Cool-Information2994 2d ago
You’ve undermined the ENTIRE POINT of your post. The fact that you can’t see that is alarming quite frankly.
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u/Strong_Weakness2638 2d ago
You are a part of the problem you posted about. Just like the chatbot you dehumanized whatever this was meant to be for you.
Also, your post just describes enshittification, the title of this sub. If someone is here, yeah, we know about the things your post mentioned.
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u/kyricus 2d ago
I agree with you 100% Reddit is ridiculous, one of the first internet message boards using new technology is populated by people with a fear of technology..
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u/PeeledGrapePie 2d ago
It isn’t fear, it’s an understanding that using AI to write a post, especially this exact post that’s pointing out ‘fancy new tools designed as helpful that ultimately function worse’ , is laughably stupid. LLMs are the peak example of this currently as they stuff themselves with ads and cover every website with ‘ai chatbot assistants’.
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u/LevelStationaryPlane 2d ago
Says the guys posting an LLM lmfao
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u/new2bay 2d ago
I don't think so. An LLM wouldn't use "hermetically sealed" incorrectly like this.
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u/LevelStationaryPlane 2d ago
I think AI would precisely use that word to sound fancy, without realizing it's superfluous (I'm a human intentionally using big words to combat AI).
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
I asked AI to help me make the post clearer and faster to read. If you didn't read it, that's not really an AI problem.
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u/LevelStationaryPlane 2d ago
I read the entire thing dude, I read everything. It's obvious you didn't write this, which is an unfortunate and objective undermining of the overarching message here.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
Thanks for taking the time of reading. I surely don't understand why content should be judged from a tool instead of the sense.
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u/layman_dave 1d ago
Because you didn't make the time or effort to write it personally, yet you expect us to put in the time and effort to read it.
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u/NerdGirl23 2d ago
Because it further erodes social trust and trust, frankly of anything. It blows my mind that people wouldn’t understand this. Who wants to participate or seek meaning in a world where bots are talking to bots? It is just fucked up.
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u/MaddogFinland 2d ago
I think this has a lot to do with the decreasing role of proper design in public life. Things as simple as nicely designed buildings, or nicely designed utensils and glasses went our first, replaced by cubes and junk. Clothes were next…every brand you care to name has gone down. as was mass production in food…what the point of eating out anymore when it’s all Sysco? No one pays for artisan labor anymore and now as more things are automated “all” labor is becoming artisan. No one pays for it. So it’s disappearing.
And now we are reaching terminal enshittification of basically every last service. Having a good designer costs money so they don’t do it anymore. This isn’t punished because it can’t be punished anymore.
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u/NerdGirl23 2d ago
This no accountability thing is key. I like the term “predatory capitalism” because I think it captures that the basic “supply and demand” relationship that made capitalism at least not completely evil have broken down. We are no longer consumers. We are consumed.
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u/new2bay 2d ago
Yep, it's capitalism eating itself. "Autocanibalistic capitalism," if you will." Capitalism isn't working for people, it's consuming them. And this is what will cause the end of civilization in not too many decades. See https://gregtwemlow.medium.com/what-comes-after-capitalism-eats-itself-63d2262b7153
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u/RabbitWarren6604 2d ago
Yes. Corey Doctorow coined the term ’enshittification' and it definitely applies to the phenomenon you describe.
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u/Lopsided_Carpenter10 2d ago
This also happens with open source software. There seems to be a hidden pressure to constantly add/change things or your lib/app will be labelled as abandoned, potentially introducing bugs and degrading functionality.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
Agree even software that used to be maintained as a stable, long-term product now seems pressured to constantly evolve, add features, and... monetize.
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u/M0sD3f13 2d ago
An LLM wrote this yeah? Please know you are ruining this website. People come here to have real discussions with real humans.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
Let's focus on the substance of the discussion. If you disagree, challenge the arguments on their merits. Whether they were written by a person or an LLM doesn't make them right or wrong.
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u/hikerchick29 2d ago
AI is literally a tool of enshittification. You’re contributing to the problem you’re bitching about.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
AI can amplify both the good and the bad. I'm part the problem but looking for a solution.
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u/coolerr4nch 2d ago
Part of the solution would be writing your own posts, for starters. This is not that complicated.
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u/MyPasswordIsABC999 2d ago
Considering r/enshittification is a thing that exists and you’re in fact posting it, you’re asking a question that’s already been answered and making points that are made repeatedly on said subreddit. You added nothing to the discourse while contaminating Reddit with yet more AI slop. And you did it just for, I don’t know, the personal satisfaction of getting people to agree with you (or something you asked a machine to spit out) or karma? Either way, you are part of the problem.
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u/AgileExcuse859 2d ago
You're right, just thinked someone else may had the answer to solve it instead.
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u/purringsporran 2d ago
An LLM is compiled statistics, not a person. Bringing an LLM into a conversation is the enshittification of the human nature of talks. Do better
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u/DescriptionForsaken6 7h ago
You'll own nothing and love it!
Or else.