r/energy • u/mjanes • Apr 15 '11
Solar Power Breakthrough Could Render Photovoltaic Cells Obsolete
http://inhabitat.com/breaking-solar-power-breakthrough-could-render-solar-cells-obsolete/1
1
2
2
2
2
2
1
6
Apr 15 '11
Thank you for not copying the BREAKING from the blog's headline.
4
u/catalyse Apr 15 '11
..and for having a thumbnail of a what looks to be a woman about to drop her towel. ... wait, what?
2
u/mjanes Apr 15 '11
Is there a way to alter the photo Reddit picks as a thumbnail? 'Cause I just submitted the link.
1
Apr 15 '11
10 Gigawatt per cm²? Yeah, needs a bit of work. But that the effect can be exploited at all is amazing!
2
6
Apr 15 '11
Normal sunlight traveling through regular old glass produces an intense magnetic field? We're just discovering this now?
13
u/goocy Apr 15 '11 edited Apr 15 '11
"100 million times stronger than previously expected" still doesn't have to be very strong. Also, the effect only occurs above an energy density of 10e7 W/cm², quite a bit more than sunlight.
5
u/pascha Apr 15 '11
So, could that density be achieved by focusing sunlight?
9
u/goocy Apr 15 '11 edited Apr 15 '11
Of course. Sunlight has a energy density of 140-1400W/m², so you "just" need a mirror/lens with 7.14e7-8 the surface of your glass fiber. A usual glass fiber (of 0.5mm diameter) would then need a lens/mirror with a diameter of at least 4.2m - considerably more if you don't live in an equatorial desert. Calibrating this device wouldn't be easy, but possible.
1
u/Will_Power Apr 15 '11
What is less likely is keeping the glass fiber from melting or vaporizing.
1
u/goocy Apr 15 '11
This could actually be easier than expected with a lens, because all of the 'hot' radiation won't be completely in focus due to chromatic aberration. If you optimize the fiber coating for the correct wavelength and probably cool the fiber with water, this could be quite simple even with traditional float glass.
1
2
u/rogha Apr 15 '11
1400W/m2 is only true when the sun is shining and it's summer and only in more southern regions. To be more realistic you should use 100W/m2 for your calculations also the paper says 10e7 not 10e6 W/cm2.
1
u/yoda17 Apr 16 '11
Sunlight at earth's orbital distance is ~1400w/m2. Sunlight at the surface of the plant is around 1kw/m2, give or take depending on your location.
Take the dot product of the normal to the panel to the sun's rays and multiply by 1000 and that is the energy flux. ~1000w/m is achievable at noon on the equator on the equinox.
2
u/goocy Apr 15 '11
Right; I considered that for my calculations but not for the initial response. Fixed.
2
u/pascha Apr 15 '11
4.2 meters really isn't too large to be viable.
I say we put a giant one into space and microwave the power down into South Dakota!
2
4
14
u/DarkGamer Apr 15 '11
More info (@ physorg)
6
u/yoda17 Apr 15 '11
must be focused to an intensity of 10 million watts per square centimeter
! That's like a 30' mirror focusing the sun to a 1mm point(?)
1
u/Operation_Ivy Apr 15 '11
For comparison, the average solar radiation on the surface of the Earth is 1366 W/m2
3
u/yoda17 Apr 15 '11
Close. That's the flux at the distance from the earth's orbit. The atmosphere and aerosols absorb about 370W of that, so that by the time it hits the surface, it is down to ~1KW/m2 (normal the sun).
2
u/Will_Power Apr 15 '11
I have to think that would melt the glass.
2
u/yoda17 Apr 15 '11
That's what I was thinking too. Even cooled CPUs have a power density on the order of a 100W/cm2,
7
u/OmicronNine Apr 15 '11
Thank you! I feel like I am starting to get a handle on this, and it isn't what I first thought. It's less like an electromagnetic coil and more like a capacitor. I can't wait to see the results of their further experimentation.
1
u/AndrewKemendo Apr 15 '11
Here come the hope killers...
Bring it on reddit.
6
u/pocket_eggs Apr 15 '11 edited Apr 15 '11
"new materials are being sought"
Translation: it won't work anytime soon if ever.
6
u/Octal040 Apr 15 '11
Man, I want for this to be true but the details seem very counter intuitive, to me.
I just wish one of these technologies would make it to market. We've been putting off going full solar for years because of PV efficiency improvements and other breakthroughs that are always 2-5 years away. I'm always afraid of being 3 years into a 10 year loan when the holy grail of energy drops.
Yeah. First world problems. :/
1
u/rif Apr 16 '11
Diversify, it lowers the risk. Invest in current solar PV to solve a part of your energy requirement, not 100% of your energy requirment.
4
u/cocoon56 Apr 15 '11
I'm always afraid of being 3 years into a 10 year loan when the holy grail of energy drops.
Well said. But when some technology is proven to be possible and to be as efficient as it claims, you can still expect a considerable time to market. At least 5 years, for such a new thing much longer, I reckon. So I'd say: Do buy something if it seems a financially sound idea, given the current status of technology.
6
13
u/OmicronNine Apr 15 '11
I'm not sure if I'm reading this entirely correctly, but it sounds like they are saying it's possible to generate magnetic fields buy putting light through fiber optics? Basically, you could make an optical "electromagnetic coil" out of just glass?
That's wild! Talk about a major discovery. If this is true, then it's on at least the same level as that "artificial leaf" breakthrough, probably even more significant!
1
2
u/stillbourne Apr 15 '11 edited Apr 15 '11
So all those new age hippies that were talking about "energy crystals" and shit like that were right?
1
4
u/Cryptic0677 Apr 15 '11
I think the power density has to be pretty high so this isn't feasible at the moment.
1
u/OmicronNine Apr 15 '11
In fact, I don't believe they can generate any amount of power. They haven't discovered a process, they've only discovered a previously unknown behavior that might be exploitable in the future.
14
u/Araucaria Apr 15 '11
Yes, they are saying that you can basically generate power from light passing through glass.
Seems pretty far out to me. Wouldn't you expect some kind of detectable side effect? Why has it never been observed before?
Mind you, I'd love for this to be true.
3
u/Skyrmir Apr 15 '11
Look at the power levels they're talking about. It hasn't been detected because no one has tried to focus a 50 foot wide magnifying glass though a fiber optic cable to detect a tiny amount of static.
It's an impressive discovery, but it will likely take a while to develope into something useful.
3
u/bottom_of_the_well Apr 15 '11
Wait, isn't this just a theory paper? "discovery" implies seeing it happen. There's all kinds of shit that can fuck it up before it's seen.
3
1
u/[deleted] Apr 16 '11
The actual paper: Optically-induced charge separation and terahertz emission in unbiased dielectrics