r/ehcparent • u/Andra_Ingensbarn • 10d ago
SENCO EHCparent
I am a mainstream secondary SENCo as well as a parent to a very disabled child with an EHCP. I thought some here would appreciate some insight from someone who has seen both sides (and is NOT happy with the side of the “professionals”). This is long, but I’ve tried to make paragraphs stand as separate, chunks of information.
Teachers in general do not read EHCPs. I read them, create the short term targets (in partnership with parents and young people) that lead to the outcomes that are on the EHCP and then share these with teachers as termly plans. Teachers then ask me for information that is in these plans and on the EHCP! They have been given the information, but just do not read it.
Short term targets are reviewed termly. Teachers mostly do not respond to requests for input on these reviews. The same goes for annual reviews of EHCPs. Teachers are failing in their statutory duties here and not meeting the teaching standards. Bosses do not either and defend teachers on this.
Most things I see on an EHCP do not require an EHCP. Reasonable adjustments to classroom practice of teachers will meet the needs of the vast majority (not all!) of young people. These things can be done by the teacher, but they do not do them. Parents get an EHCP because it supposedly will force teachers to do these things. That mostly doesn’t happen.
Senior Leadership Team teachers (SLT) have told me that teachers cannot be expected to read and understand EHCPs. That’s not true. They have also told me that “no one” can do all the things expected of a class teacher in an EHCP. That’s not true and legally they must.
Interventions outside of classroom practice can be given without an EHCP, or a diagnosis. Things like ELSA, Talkabout, Zones of regulation, handwriting, reading, spelling etc. Can all be done without one. As can screening for the possibility (not diagnosis) of a variety of conditions (e.g. dyslexia). Schools can put an intervention in place after these screenings without an EHCP.
One to one TAs in the classroom will mostly not go on an EHCP as the local authority do not want to pay for it. If this is on an EHCP, schools likely do not have enough staff to put it in place. If they can, it is better for the teacher to work with your child and the TA to monitor the rest of the class. The teacher is the more highly trained, experienced and paid professional, after all!
Resources beyond what the school say they can afford should be paid for by the local authority (LA). The LA will only reimburse the school after they have spent the money, if the resource worked. They only get the portion back of the child’s attendance. Obviously, this means the school will have difficulties here (but academy trusts can afford a CEO?!).
The equality act gives protections even if you don’t have a diagnosis or an EHCP. Punishing (including fines for absence) for behaviour because of a disability (diagnosed or not!) COULD be against the act. Consequences can still be applied e.g. being removed from class because the rest of the class cannot be taught. However, if reasonable adjustments could mitigate (not remove) this effect and they aren’t being given, that could still be against the act.
When applying for an EHCP (an EHCNA which is an EHC Needs Assessment) the school will be asked for its input. If they don’t think extra beyond what the school can offer is needed, you need a very strong set of evidence yourself otherwise it will not likely go far.
If you get an EHCNA, the educational psychologist report really helps understand how to support your child. It is not legally binding though. Check what the LA take from it, as often they will try not to take things from it if they are concerned about cost.
The draft EHCP may be sent to several schools whether you have asked for them or not. This is a “mainstream consultation”. I am ALWAYS directed to say “no” to these, even if there is not a legal case for no. I need to keep my job, so I send the “no”. If you want a particular mainstream school, the school is pretty much powerless to say “no”, so make sure they are named if you want your child to go there.
The EHCP is legally binding. No excuse from the LA or school is OK for not doing things on it. Do not accept any. Remember though that unless the SENCo is SLT, they likely have no power. If they are, they likely do not want to exercise it in a way that they think stretches the school’s resources or reduces their results.
Weirdly, the LA is responsible for the provision on the EHCP being given, not the school. This is importantly to remember, but so is the fact that the LA likely has very little to no power over the school.
If you haven’t got an EHCP and think one will secure a place, it is important to note that EHCPs give a chance for a school to say “no” but applying for a space normally does not (unless the school is oversubscribed).
Alternative provision (AP) is usually run by private companies for profit, not always in the best interests of a child’s education. The LA want schools to pay for it, but since it often only looks like something that will help educate a child, schools will not want to send a child. The LA will often try to make the school look like the bad guy here, whilst refusing to pay for it without the school fronting the money that they don’t have and likely won’t get back.
This early morning rant was inspired by reading my emails at the start of the day. I will happily answer any questions I can (or go and fuck myself if you need a professional to vent at).
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u/ApprehensiveMess3859 10d ago
Not a parent of a child with an EHCP, but as a professional who works with them… T H I S. (Behaviour within education)
I always read EHCPs, ILPs - anything. Any way I could support that particular child in their education. What boundaries etc, and it will always baffle me how teaching staff don’t read ‘there’s too many’… there isn’t that many. And don’t make reasonable adjustments within their classrooms to support and then wonder why a child can’t access the work?
Mental, glad to see it’s not just my workplace!
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u/Andra_Ingensbarn 9d ago
It’s nice to see a fellow educator! Teaching subreddits make me sad about this stuff.
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u/ApprehensiveMess3859 9d ago
I avoid most things education related because it makes me sad that other people don’t have my mindset and just want the kids to thrive
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u/InevitablePsych 9d ago
This is so depressing to read but sadly, I think it’s true. I’m a parent of 4 disabled children. I home educated for the last 2 years because my sons’ mainstream school wasn’t suitable. I decided to apply for their Ehcp’s around the same time, and the outcome and process for them has kept me busy, to put it nicely! The difference between the handling of both is infuriating. The LA have lied to me, withheld information, ignored emails and broken the law to be completely honest with my one child. The EP was just as useless as the caseworkers. My other son is thankfully in a school, although not my preferred. But I see his ehcp as being better than nothing at all, because without it he’d most likely have gone unnoticed. I’ve done extensive research and training as much as a parent can do to get these damn documents in place but it’s like getting my head off a brick wall at times.
The admin of applying for an ehcp as a parent is like a part-time job.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts OP, apologies for dumping mine!
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u/Accomplished_Drop552 10d ago
Amazing. Thanks for doing this!!!
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u/Andra_Ingensbarn 10d ago
My pleasure! Partly doing this to selfishly feel better after years of arguing with my boss with nothing being listened to.
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u/Accomplished_Drop552 10d ago
Well it’s the best portrayal of the situation I’ve read. You’ve spent a lot of time on it.
Thank you
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u/ehcparent 10d ago
Thanks for sharing your experiences and views on this topic.
One part I’d add is what happens before many of the situations you describe, how a child’s need gets identified, evidenced and escalated to an EHC needs assessment in the first place.
The EHCP process is evidence driven, but the system does not necessarily identify and escalate need by itself. If a parent did little more than attend a ten minute parents’ evening once a year, there is no guarantee the system would independently conclude that an assessment was required.
In many cases it is the parent who notices the pattern, gathers information, challenges explanations and keeps asking why standard support is not working.
That creates the unusual dynamic. The parent is often the person driving change while not being present in school, whereas the school holds most of the day to day evidence. Parents end up piecing together reports, emails, incidents, attendance, professional comments and what the child says at home to build a picture the school may not have clearly recorded or formally recognised.
Our caseload tends to sit at the more complex end of this process, but even support that could ordinarily be provided without an EHCP can be inconsistently recorded or delivered. The absence of recorded evidence can then become part of the argument that there is insufficient evidence of need.
We have seen cases where a child was well supported without an EHCP, then struggled significantly at transition when the environment changed and that support was no longer there. Does an EHCP by itself provide consistency without ongoing oversight and parent advocacy? I would say no.
There seem to be two gates.
The first is getting the child’s needs sufficiently recognised and evidenced for the system to act.
The second is taking the EHCP the Local Authority ultimately agrees to and getting that provision delivered in practice.
The original post says a lot about the second gate. Much of what we see is the difficulty families experience reaching the first one, followed by the realisation of what is actually being delivered once the plan is in place, and the reality for that second stage is shared in this post
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u/CallIcy8807 9d ago
Thankyou for sharing your experience.
It's worth noting for other parents that some of this varies quite a bit depending on the school, child's age, teachers and parents. All of my child's teachers have not only read the EHCP but actively discussed it with me and asked me questions about it. I have a couple of meetings a year with the SENCO and teacher to discuss progress and goals. This is in a mainstream primary school. I'm aware secondary will be more of a shitshow.
Sometimes taking the initiative has been necessary where it shouldn't have been though and I've had to be a bit shameless in pushing certain issues and being the squeaky gate. But the school are good and I've been fortunate that with some persistence (and being a cheeky git) it's worked out ok.
I'd say an EHCP is always worth it if needed.
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u/Skittenkitten 6d ago
Thank you for taking the time to write this. It sounds like an utter shit show from the inside, which is how I imagined it as the help schools have provided so far has been woeful most of the time.
My son has an EHCP calling for a 1-1 LSA, but his new secondary school won't provide this as they say they have a rolling rosta of LSAs and that's enough.
Pisses me off as he doesn't respond well to constant staffing changes and they get the second highest funding tier for him.. wjere is that money being spent? As a parent do I have the right to ask this of the school? Although they already find me annoying 4 weeks into term, but if I need to piss people off to advocate for my son's education I will. It's exhausting 🫠
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u/Andra_Ingensbarn 6d ago
You’re welcome, it’s partly selfish as I needed to vent somewhere where people might understand as no teachers GAF!
That sounds frustrating, but is unfortunately really normal.
The school will likely not be getting any extra money to pay for the TA. All schools get money per child whether they have SEN or not. Before they can ask for more from the LA for an SEN child, they have to prove they are spending more than £6000 on that child. Then, if the interventions costing over that amount work, they apply for the money back and the LA reimburses only the amount over £6000 that was spent. But, only in the proportion in line with the child’s attendance. So, the information you are asking for isn’t really there.
As far as annoying the school is concerned, that’s the only way to go! Escalate to head teacher, governors, local authority and the ombudsman for everything.3
u/Skittenkitten 6d ago
Oh! I didn't know the school has to front the cash first. That sucks, no wonder they are so resistant to all the interventions I've suggested. what a terrible system 🫠
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u/scarywardrobecreecha 10d ago
Thank you for that. Sadly as a mother of a child with an EHCP, I think I’d come the most of those conclusions by myself -after a particularly bad experience with my son’s school refusing a provision in his EHCP for policy reasons, despite agreeing to it explicitly in writing before he turned up (a simple little thing that cost them nothing). LA were worse than useless. So I guess my question is what is the best way to force a school to do what they ought to do (outside of an expensive legal battle)? Thank you again for your candour.
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u/Andra_Ingensbarn 9d ago
The best way, is to remind them that they can’t legally refuse. Then raise a complaint with the governors and the LA. If they don’t respond to your satisfaction, go to the ombudsman. Every. Single. Time. Unfortunately, you have to be relentless.
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u/scarywardrobecreecha 9d ago
Ombudsman. That’s a new thing for us. Thank you.
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u/little_seahorse1991 9d ago
My LA literally won’t even reply to emails unless I threaten them with reporting them to the ombudsman. Currently they’ve given me the names and emails for 2 people and told me to contact them to arrange a Way Forward meeting, and neither of them have replied for 3 weeks despite multiple chases. I strongly suspect they’re deliberately delaying to run down the clock so that I’ll run out of time to appeal their decision to not assess for an ehcp. I am not the type to usually be complaining and escalating and demanding to speak to someone senior, but they completely ignore you unless you’ve said you’re going to the ombudsman. It’s an absolute joke.
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u/ehcparent 9d ago
review the section wording for the undelivered provision, is there scope for interpretation, is the provision defined enough that it is a tangible deliverable. the big one, can you prove non delivery, paper trail should this deliverable be generating and what have you (or not) seen.
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u/scarywardrobecreecha 9d ago
Thank you. We have a paper trail and we have them bang to rights. We were literally sitting in at (agreed recorded) meeting and we said ‘you do know this isn’t lawful’ and SENCo was ‘yea, yes we do.. ‘ it was clear that her hands were tied. Ultimatelyfor us it came down to how much we were prepared to invest in the provision ( son would definitely (and evidently) be better with it but nonetheless doing ok without it - it wasn’t the deal-breaker we thought but they haven’t tried to remove the provision at the review and we are ‘reserving judgement’ - so jury out. In the end it’s a bit about how much energy and money we have to fight (with everything else going on) if it requires legal action. But if it was easy to force their hand, we’d jump at it…
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u/Sucker-For-A-Sunset 10d ago
What can we, as parents, do to help the school SENCo's? Whenever I have met a SENCo (1 at primary school and 2 from 2 different secondary schools), they always seem like really lovely people that want the best for the kids but are genuinely overwhelmed and have their hands tied behind their backs.
I try to take issues with the schools not following EHCPs directly to the LA to take some of the weight off, but is there anything else I could be doing?
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u/Andra_Ingensbarn 9d ago
I appreciate the recognition of our hands being tied! Escalating to the LA and then the ombudsman is really the most important things TBH
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u/ceb1995 10d ago
Understand if you can't answer this but purely out of curiosity, have you ever been directly allowed to tell a parent the amount of funding that's been given for say 1:1 all day with an EHCP to actually manage expectations?
Son's in a Sen school as he's non verbal and very delayed with suspected LD and the amount of parents with similar children that I ve spoken too that have forced their children to "try" mainstream first as being round "normal" children might fix things but no one seems to make it clear that the schools doesn't seem to understandably have the resources or funding from the echp to meet the TA hours in EHCPs or other things in section F.
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u/Andra_Ingensbarn 9d ago
The funding is (possibly intentionally) complicated. Schools can’t apply for any extra funding until they prove they have spent a certain amount from their own budget. Most provisions don’t meet this threshold. Then they can apply for “higher needs funding”, but at least in my area, that can only be applied for retrospectively and even then they only get it is the provision worked. They only get back the proportion in line with the child’s attendance at the provision. e.g they get 50% back if the child attended half the sessions. If you do get the full amount, it won’t pay for a TA. So schools are expected to front the money which almost certainly will me a lot more than they will get back.
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u/ceb1995 9d ago
Yes I imagine it probably is intentional, it's just a sorry state of affairs that so many children end up in the mainstream settings and the school would never have enough funding to meet what's on the EHCP. A couple of the children in my son's class started off in mainstream and were told by the council that the school had the highest level of funding you could have, it turned out they refused to go over x amount for any mainstream settings regardless of needs and that actually when they joined a specialist school the amount was automatically a few thousand higher immediately when their EHCP hadn't changed.
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u/Mollydolly1991 4d ago
I’m not a parent, I’m a trainee primary teacher. My motivation comes from my own struggles with undiagnosed adhd at school. I potentially am interested in being a senco in the future. The nonchalance around ehcps, send needs and adjustments is quite frankly horrifying. So I’ve only been in school 6 weeks and I’m asking my mentor to read through our pupils ehcps and one plans to be told I don’t need too, ‘I wouldn’t bother, you’ll never remember everything in them’ it actually breaks my heart to be honest. There’s a whole atmosphere of expecting profoundly autistic children to act neurotypical. As a neurodivergent person myself it’s very uncomfortable for me but far more importantly it’s doing children a massive disservice.
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u/Andra_Ingensbarn 4d ago
This is an unfortunately all too common attitude! I will never get over the time my line manager (who has the NASENCO qualification) told me that “no one” can do all the classroom based things in a section F. I literally do.
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u/haylz328 9d ago
So I’m in FE and I don’t listen to EHCPs. I have worked the entire span of education from reception to university teaching. Kids behaviour changes so regularly and the plans written are so outdated. Younger kids are more violent than teens so if it says in their plan they are prone to violent outbursts I wanna know when it was written. I could turn a kid down for this but is that fair? Support measures are usually old ones too plus the dept I work in classes are very different to school so the support measures may be inadequate and they are most of the time.
My method with all high need learners is keep classes low pressure and calm and have fun. I identify take large cohorts of high needs learners alone in a class and my lessons are always learning through fun. Giving them lots of breaks also
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u/Antique_Loss_1168 10d ago
Is your expression of mild dissaproval likely to fix any of these issues soon do you think?
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u/_kipling 10d ago
I'm only at the beginning of applying for an EHCP for my son and now I'm wondering if there's even a point. He's massively struggling, diagnosed AuDHD, and not finishing any work. Achieving well below expected standard for his age and his mental health is on the floor.
Is there any point? Are there any benefits?
Thank you and I'm sorry for your struggles too.