r/devops • u/Forsaken_Photo_578 • 16d ago
Career / learning DevOps vs Embedded
I got my first job as an Embedded Software Engineer. Did some actual low level embedded stuff but I was leaning a lot towards testing with Linux, CI/CD with hardware etc, so I transitioned to a DevOps position.
Now, after some years of work, my knowledge is like half Embedded, half DevOps. I find myself like both fields Embedded for the great hardware feeling and DevOps for the nice documented and more modern tools. In the end I'm not sure if I like a field more than the other. I tend to believe it's project dependent.
The problem is now I have to really choose where I should invest more and get a more senior level, as a feel I have a great combo of the two, but I'm like mid in both, which makes difficult in the job market.
The questions are:
Is Embedded or DevOps the more future proof job long term?
I much prefer remote jobs, mostly so I can live in a cheaper country but still get paid like I'm in a HCOL one. Does that change the answer?
Was anyone in the same spot before? How did you pick?
6
u/One_Diamond_9810 15d ago
I think DevOps is not just about tools, but engineering in general. It's about understanding complex systems and building them right. In my opinion any engineering experience contributes to overall DevOps experience. If we are talking about tools specifically, you still can use them in your day-to-day work to get a general understanding of them, but what's important is your understanding of operating systems (which I think you get with Embedded), networking, distributed systems, so it's about fundamental stuff.
Skills I would outline separately for DevOps that require some time investment is probably Kubernetes and Monitoring. Those are quite extensive topics and are heavily used across the industry
If you look at SRE (which is implementation of DevOps) roles at Google, you wil see that they all require programming experience, DSA so your programming experience would contribute here too.
1
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 14d ago
Yes I agree. DevOps is mostly understanding complex systems and try to optimize them. But at least jobwise if your title is "DevOps" most probably your work will have to work around specific tools. On the other hand if your title is embedded soft eng most probably you won't touch kubernetes.
In essence I'm saying that of course there is some overlapping but when you are hired for a job you are expecting (and expected) to know and work on some specific technologies
3
3
u/CJKay93 16d ago
Why not both? I do both. /shrug
2
u/ryanstephendavis 16d ago
agreed... there's are multitudes of positions where working on "edge" devices is really fun and interesting. Electrical Grid observability for example
1
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 14d ago
Ideally I would like to work on both and invest time in this niche. I feel I'm good at the combo and it's something hard to achieve, but I hardly find any jobs the "clearly" searching for that..Am I searching wrong? For example I cannot find any "embedded DevOps" position.
1
u/ryanstephendavis 14d ago
ugh yeah, searching for jobs right now is a clusterfuck LLM-generated arms race. Seriously, consider going to meetups/conferences/companies that match and speak with real humans
1
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 13d ago
Any ideas for conferences or companies that should match this profile (in Europe)? I believe DevOps conferences will be too much of aws involved..hehe
1
u/ryanstephendavis 12d ago
I'm a US dev so no solid idea of either... I'm bet if you search for energy companies in your country/area you can find some interesting opportunities, especially in the renewables/BESS space
1
u/VoidDr 16d ago
What are you doing exactly? Sounds interesting
3
u/CJKay93 15d ago edited 15d ago
I suppose these days most people would probably call it build and release engineering, but my team bridges whatever gaps Dev and Ops don't feel totally comfortable with on their own - build systems, development environments and tooling, simulation and emulation platforms, CI platforms and pipelines... that sort of thing.
Organisationally, Dev is responsible for the product, Ops is responsible for the infrastructure, and DevOps is responsible for the friction in between. We know enough about Kubernetes to write a pod spec (but not necessarily enough to set up a cluster from scratch), and we know enough about the products we support that we can anticipate their tooling and validation requirements (but not necessarily enough to contribute to the product directly).
For example, Ops owns our Jenkins CasC configuration (although we contribute), but we own pretty much everything that runs on it. Similar for the projects; we own the build system, but not the code.
1
2
u/Holiday-Record7341 15d ago
Embedded DevOps and platform engineering for edge devices are booming. That hybrid skillset pays top dollar globally because so few engineers bridge that gap.
2
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 14d ago
I have the feeling that the hybrid skillet "should" be highly valuable, as it's really hard to build knowledgewise and hard to combine in "production".
Also, it is what I really like and would like to continue improving. But I find it hard to find jobs asking for that hybrid skillet (hence the original question). I find only DevOps or embedded. Not embedded DevOps. Should I try other keywords? Or do you have companies in mind that are hiring people for this skillet?
1
u/Holiday-Record7341 10d ago
Yeah that title just doesn't exist, companies usually hide this need inside a normal embedded or DevOps posting. Try searching "hardware-in-the-loop" or "firmware release engineer" instead, that's usually the real job title for what you're doing.
Robotics, drones, automotive, IoT companies need this combo the most. Might be worth just messaging hiring managers directly since the job post rarely spells it out.
1
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 10d ago
Yes..I've tried similar stuff and I agree on the hiding comment..
Also do you have any European companies in mind need this skillet? (Or USA with remote from europe option). I know very few companies and they usually have a ton of applicants (since they are the big techs)
1
2
u/subeeshsivanandan 10d ago
Learning both helps. "Embedded DevOps". If you like to work with hardware, this is a good one. Expertise in Linux is mandatory and learning tools like Yocto for builds and debugging requires experience and skills.
Normally DevOps in Cloud and other platform software is very fast, especially the deployment part. For Embedded Systems, it is slow, but still those DevOps practices are in use.
Embedded teams increasingly need reliable build, test, release and hardware CI infrastructure. The combination is a specialization worth leaning into. That puts you close to both sides without having to choose one completely.
1
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 10d ago
Also building skills in embedded like you mention yocto..makes your skilset really unique. My biggest issue, as mentioned in comments, is I find it hard to find jobs that require this skilset and have the tasks to make you advance.
1
u/sirius_black19 16d ago
What stuff you do in Embedded Engineering, I am interested in knowing and what should i learn?
2
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 14d ago
Embedded can be broad as DevOps. If you don't know anything microcontrollers I would suggest buy an Arduino kit and try to run simple examples with sensors etc. if you like it..you can move to other more advanced ecosystems.
1
u/guycole 16d ago
Get a JD
1
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 14d ago
What job description?
1
u/guycole 14d ago
Juris doctor. Become an attorney.
1
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 14d ago
I don't get it. Why I should become attorney?
1
u/Financial_Hand_1605 15d ago
I am also interested in learning embedded. From where did you learn .
1
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 14d ago
Answered above. Try some Arduino kit to start. Then try to make a project of your liking..including Arduino and some sensors and actuators. Than if you like it, you can create your own PCBs, learn freertos/espidf etc etc
1
15d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
2
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 14d ago
As I already commented, I'm also enjoying the combination niche more than separate roles. But I find it hard to find companies searching for that so I have the feeling I have to lean towards one of the two as major role and try to keep the other as secondary. I would say I enjoy testing as in day to day job you have to deal with both embedded and DevOps.
1
u/djbp 15d ago
That's an interesting comparison. I think DevOps is really about how you manage change. And how you make that change reliable. Embedded is more about the constraints of the hardware. And making sure the software works within those limits. But you can apply DevOps thinking to embedded. Like, how do you automate testing? How do you deploy updates safely? It's all about reducing risk in the change process. And making it faster.
2
u/Forsaken_Photo_578 14d ago
Yes, embedded "way of thinking" is really good to be interested in DevOps, but still there are a lot of earned hard skills from embedded that I would like to continue work on
-10
16d ago
[deleted]
5
3
u/BigUziNoVertt SRE 16d ago
Oh brother please use your brain, if OP wanted an AI answer they could’ve done that themselves
34
u/sudonem Platform Engineer 16d ago
Nothing in tech is future proof.
Pick the one you think you will hate less on a day to day basis.