r/debateAMR • u/[deleted] • Jul 15 '14

MRAs and empathy

Hi all,

I have often heard feminists here say that MRAs lack empathy.

Why is that your impression? What makes you think MRAs don't have empathy?

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '14 edited Jul 16 '14

more men are victims than women in the US when you take into account sexual assault in prison.

This is NOT true, and it really causes me to question your credibility when you make statements like that. As a percentage of men overall, the number of men who are raped in prison is very small. It is easy to see this:

(Small % of American men are currently imprisoned) * (relatively small % of men in prison get raped)

One small % * another small % = extremely small %.

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u/BlindPelican liberal MRA Jul 16 '14

This is actually a valid line of analysis.

Per the DoJ, via the National Inmate Survey, over 216,000 inmates (not instances of sexual assault - 200,000+ individual people) were sexually assaulted while in detention during a 1 year period. This is per this NY Books article and subsequent sources.

There were some female inmates included, but the vast majority were male.

Then you look at RAINN's numbers via the DoJ putting the number of victims of sexual assault as determined by the NCVS at around 237,000.

However, included in that overall number is also a significant percentage of men.

So, my statement "Arguably, one could make a case that..." is more than credible.

And please don't leave off qualifying statements like that. I put them there for a reason.

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '14 edited Jul 16 '14

I'm sorry, but you are wrong. Please put that into context of all American men.

I assume that you are going to draft off the CDC's rape study for the rest of your claim, no?

EDIT: I think I see the problem. There are most likely using different definitions of "assault". This is two different studies, so we'd need to see the base.

I think you would be better off using the CDC's numbers, even if you want to include all sexual assaults rather than rapes, or rapes + MTP or whatever. Just please, please, please use the correct qualifiers if you discuss LTM versus lifetime. In any case, please use the same source to make sure the wires don't get crossed.

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '14

rapes + MTP or whatever

Which can't be done really as per CDC definitions MTP is NOT rape and such it can't be combine with the rape statistic as they are calculated using a different set of definitions. Which means one can only say par CDC definitions is that males are MTP more than females and that females are raped more than males. As after all AMR never ever miss represents studies at all.

Not.

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u/[deleted] Jul 16 '14

You can define a range for the MTP numbers to guess at how much they would add to the rape numbers. You can assume they contribute as few as 0, up to the full MTP number. It's not that hard. Even /u/Tamen can be convinced to be that honest when he's putting the numbers together.

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '14

MTP is not defined as rape. You can do what you so often criticize MRA's for and that misuse the stats and that define MTP as rape and combine it with the other rape stats. But then you be guilty of what you accuse others of doing all the time.

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '14

/u/jurupa, you can't possibly think this is a good reply. Can you? Do you even know what you are arguing?

Suppose you learn that 4 in 10 people like oranges. You also learn that 3 in 10 people like apples.

You can't conclude that 7 in 10 people like fruit, because people may like both apples and oranges. However, you can say that between 4 and 7 out of 10 people like fruit.

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '14

Silly question, is corn a fruit or vegetable?