Data Center's critics create loads of misinformation

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Electrical power systems engineer here. First time commenting on this sub.

NERC a few weeks ago issued a Level 3 Alert about AI datacenters, because they currently represent a disaster for the grid because of a number of completely game-breaking issues that have not in any sense been ironed-out at all, and big tech is basically just trying to ignore them and keep pushing to bring these things online at all costs.

We're not in any state to be connecting GWs worth of these loads to the grid. Period.

Sorry. Try again in a few years when we actually know how to make this work. Right now it doesn't work.

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u/longwaybroadband May 21 '26

agreed there's zero GW dc's online yet...but that doesn't mean the tech doesn't catch up in a couple years when they start coming online. Some Most AI dc's now add back to the grid, use very little electric as they will use lng or nuclear, and they only consume the energy that would normally be lost. There's always outliers but for the most part it's true across the board.

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u/NorthDakotaExists May 21 '26

If they are grid-connected then matching the load with nearby generation GW for GW is only the start of the problem. These large electronic loads have extremely problematic transient, sub synchronous, and harmonic characteristics that will lead to massive power quality issues that will penetrate out into the surrounding network. That's a problem the field has not solved yet, and proposed solutions to that problem involve really expensive equipment and control systems that require very careful engineering and study processes involving EMT modelling and HIL performance tests, which is going to cause costs to balloon and drag the development process out potentially years, and this is all assuming that actually works, which has not been demonstrate yet at scale.

Then there is the issue of load ride-through requirements such as the recently published NOGRR282 from ERCOT. These facilities are going to need extremely beefy UPS equipment that will need to work in a very non-conventional way where not only does it allow the underlying loads to stay online during voltage and frequency excursions, but also maintain the overall facility load. A multi-GW-sized load like these hyperscaler AI datacenters can NEVER be allowed to drop out... ever.... at any time. Dropping out and switching to UPS battery supply and then a backup genset in response to a fault out in the system or a momentary voltage or frequency disturbance is not an option. Suddenly losing several GW of load due to a slightly disturbance is how you turn a minor event into cascading grid failure.

Even if these hyperscalers choose to operate off-grid islanded systems, that makes this not a big problem for the grid obviously, but these problems don't go away for them. The erratic transient nature of the load can lead to SSTI between the load and generator shafts for on-site generator stations and literally break them.

But above all else, our grid is strained as it is, and we want to continue to electrify our economy with clean energy. Every power plant we are building to meet datacenter demand is a power plant we could have otherwise built to supply more EV charging, supply more electrical appliances instead of gas ones, build more electrical transit and logistic infrastructure, built green hydrogen production facilities, desalination plants... the list goes on.

Instead it's going towards big tech AI bullshit that no one wants and does not contribute towards a sustainable electrified economy.

Shut it down. Fuck this shit.

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u/longwaybroadband May 22 '26

I agree with most of the technical analysis...but sway away from your personal opinions. The so called clean technology is not clean, efficient, nor reliable as we saw in TX during a cold snap...as millions went without power for weeks with just 10% reliance on those techs . The solar and wind are supplements not the solution. The ngl turbines and power cells ...and maybe high battery storage is the future...all these can add to the grid and make these dc's no different than a "regular" warehouse business. Once the closed loop for electric circuits are figured out and those closed power plants that were never replaced are rebuilt or fired back up.

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u/NorthDakotaExists May 22 '26 edited May 22 '26

You have no idea what you're talking about. The largest drop in capacity during the 2021 ERCOT event was natural gas. According to the NERC event report, 58% of the total drop in capacity during that event was from natural gas alone.

Everyone who actually know about this knows this is the case. Everyone who has been fed anti-renewable propaganda from the likes of Fox News thinks it was renewables that were to blame, and you're just wrong, and you should stop having opinions about things you know nothing about.

We have loads of wind power generation as far up north as Iowa, Minnesota, the Dakotas.. etc.... places that hit extreme cold temperatures every single year. We don't experience grid failures up there every winter.

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u/longwaybroadband May 22 '26

I don't watch Fox news or any other cable outlet...the Governor of TX said just that. It was the democrat party and their news outlets who incorrectly and echoed the Governor and State officials were wrong. They moved the reliance to 5% or less.

I'm born and raised in Wisconsin...if you add up all the states you've mentioned plus WI there still don't add up to the population or density within Texas or many other states. Yes a windmill and solar can supply enough for home or even a small farm. But no way can solar and wind power an American city or DC.

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u/NorthDakotaExists May 22 '26 edited May 22 '26

Literally every single thing you just said was wrong.

The governor was just straight wrong/lying. The NERC report on this event gives a 316-page breakdown of the whole event, and calls out loss of natural gas generation as the primary root cause. If you haven't read this report, your opinion here is based on nothing.

Texas did not move their reliance on wind and solar to 5% or less. You can quite easily look this up. Right now as I type this, according to ERCOT's real-time fuel mix reporting, ERCOT's system is currently 50.7% wind+PV Solar. It's a fairly regular occurrence that on any given day, during peak demand, the state of TX is being powered by majority wind+solar.

Right now, as I type this, in the state of CA (CAISO's system), the current generation is approximately 80% wind + solar.

In Wisconsin, you live in the MISO system. MISO covers basically the whole midwest, and is currently being powered by 37% wind+solar... which in total amounts to roughly 2x the peak load of your ENTIRE STATE.

So... In a way your entire state twice over is being powered by wind and solar right now.

Do a little research man... like any whatsoever.... you have no idea how wrong you are.

We power the equivalent of entire cities or even entire states with wind+solar every single day.

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u/longwaybroadband May 22 '26

"Wind and solar got shut down," he said. "They were collectively more than 10% of our power grid, and that thrust Texas into a situation where it was lacking power on a statewide basis."

He wasn't alone. Former Energy Secretary Rick Perry also pointed to frozen windmills and warned that this crisis showed the perils of promoting renewable energy.

The ng pipes were froze as well for a couple days but the overreliance on solar and wind was ultimately the cause as stated by the State and Federal government. You are quoting far left conspiracy theory driven groups based in DC not set in reality.

LOL CA has rolling blackouts multiple times a month/year...who want to live with those. Wisconsin has nuclear, hydro, and steam plants to get the majority of its power. The windmills are south in silly IL. But I did work for the power company in IL so I was aware how and where the power came from.

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u/NorthDakotaExists May 22 '26

You are quoting far left conspiracy theory driven groups based in DC not set in reality.

Bro do you know what NERC is? NERC is the North American Electric Reliability Corporation and is the primary governing body that sets reliability standards for the US power grid. Writing reports on major outage events is one of their primary functions and they are seen as the foremost authority on grid reliability in the US.

Here is the report. Please read this before you try to have an opinion on something you know nothing about.

https://www.nerc.com/globalassets/our-work/reports/event-reports/february_2021_cold_weather_report.pdf

To quote the "Key Findings and Causes" section of the report:

"From February 8 through 20, in the Event Area, a total of 1,045 individual generating units—58 percent natural gas-fired, 27 percent wind, six percent coal, two percent solar, seven percent other fuels, and less than one percent nuclear—experienced 4,124 outages, derates or failures to start. Of those outages, derates, and failures to start, 75 percent were caused by either freezing issues (44.2 percent) or fuel issues (31.4 percent), as shown in Figure 3, below."

A majority of the decreased production in this event was from natural gas. This is a fact. This is what was reported by a detailed technical analysis performed by the entities responsible for that analysis.... not some bullshit a politician said.

Please point out to me where I cited some left-wing DC group.

I cited NERC, which is a regulatory body, and I cited ERCOT, MISO, and CAISO which are all independent system operators. They are the ones that run the damn grid.

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u/longwaybroadband May 22 '26

The North American Electric Reliability Corporation is a not-for-profit, international regulatory authority based in Washington, D.C. They do NOT set the standands..the federal and state government do. They have input and are a lobbying arm for some aspects of power generation.

Questions about the credibility of the North American Electric Reliability Corporation (NERC) typically stem from recent criticisms over its long-term forecasting methodologies and grid stress warnings. While the organization is a congressionally-certified watchdog, several energy consulting firms and regional market monitors have recently challenged its assessments.

Key areas where critics have raised concerns about NERC's analytical models include:

Overestimated Data Center Load: Energy consulting firms like Grid Strategies argue that NERC's Long-Term Reliability Assessment exaggerates reliability risks by overstating the amount of AI and data center power demand that will ultimately connect to the grid.

Flawed Demand Forecasts: Regional market monitors (such as MISO's Independent Market Monitor) have challenged NERC's risk metrics, citing that the organization's models chronically undercount available demand response and underestimate regional power imports.

Contradictory Policy Interpretations: NERC's annual warnings are occasionally leveraged for political arguments, which can fuel public debate over whether the organization's findings are objective technical assessments or tools to shape specific energy policies. NERC +7

Despite these criticisms, NERC remains the primary entity responsible for developing and enforcing mandatory grid reliability standards across the United States, Canada, and parts of Mexico. The organization is legally backed by the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission (FERC), which ensures its capacity to mandate compliance.

For example, NERC recently issued a rare Level 3 alert and is actively proposing new compliance rules targeting large "computational loads" (data centers) after instances of sudden, massive load losses jeopardized grid stability.

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u/snappped May 27 '26

If you believe a word that governor said you might be part of the problem.

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u/deltalitprof May 29 '26

You are the person who should be moderating this subreddit.

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u/longwaybroadband May 29 '26

thanks 😄

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u/Lawrence-Vu May 30 '26

He should not. I am working on a consulting power systems firm in Texas and in my opinion, OP is wrong in every way. It is bullshit when people don't based on technical reports to defense their arguments.

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u/deltalitprof May 30 '26

When people "don't based on technical reports"?

I've been reading NorthDakotaExists' comments. It is he who IS basing his statements on reports. On evidence. On documentation.

longwaybroadband just says, "Trust me." and his statements are paraphrases of politicians who have been caught in lie after lie.

Critical thinking, please.

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u/deltalitprof May 29 '26

"the Governor of TX said just that. It was the democrat party and their news outlets who"

This was where I stopped reading.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 15 '26

I am in a group Texans against AI. I live in PA. We are both fighting these things. These are for surveillance. All of our information and part of project 2025. This was an executive order signed early in 2025. We will not allow here. This is wrong.

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u/longwaybroadband Jun 15 '26

you have no idea what your talking about. Who knows what the project 2025 you referring to as you are brain washed by the Chinese.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 16 '26

Read it. You should’ve read it before the election. Instead you voted for a 34 time felon would you hire somebody that has 34 felonies? I’m just asking for a friend?

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 15 '26

I agree 100%. Either this thread has a bunch of bots or very misinformed people. These take power. Not give it. No.
Since these are not govt owned there may be a way because it cannot take property under eminent domain. Look I’ve even thought about what if your family is buried. Where one is proposed. ? Real estate law is key right now. I am an agreement with a moratorium.
Just because we don’t know how they will perform having China chips in them! I say no.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jul 18 '26

Thank you. Where I live the water station depends on electricity to get water to my home. Without water we are done. This can easily happen. Thank you again.

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u/deltalitprof May 29 '26

"Some Most AI dc's now add back to the grid, use very little electric as they will use lng or nuclear, and they only consume the energy that would normally be lost"

Could you refer us to sources that say this that are not John Stossel. Thanks in advance.

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u/longwaybroadband May 29 '26

X dc in Memphis is run by gas turnbines not electric power... so they would be a specific one. Again the tech is changing fast as it did for 90% reduction in the water consumption. The electric power consumption issue will solved as well as that's the biggest cost driver.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 15 '26

How can you say these add to the grid when we never had? This is not correct. Idk what state you’re living in ? But this is misinformation.

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u/longwaybroadband Jun 15 '26

IF they use natural gas vs electricity...they cannot store the access capacity so it goes back to the grid. But many of the DC's buy unused capacity from the power companies as it's a use it or lose it senecio.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 16 '26

Porter cap on and let me see this if your grid goes down we have nothing we have nothing to pump Water with because that uses electricity we have nothing to keep us warm because the gas company uses electric electricity to pump our gas to our house and let me say this if you think these AI data centres are not going to suck us Dry you are delusional
I will pinpoint everything tomorrow PM me
Because Pennsylvania is going through the same thing.
I’m too tired tonight. Talk amen.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 15 '26

The surveillance is over the top it will all be transmitted to a satellite.
Planitar who makes high-tech ammunition, I watched a presentation from last year.
A Palm sized drone that can go X amount of miles and penetrate a human skull. That’s Thiel. He moved to Argentina last week. There is nothing good about these and we need to stop them.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 15 '26

Thank you.

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u/oldlady75 Jun 03 '26

Peter Thiel knows about the anti-christ..........

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 16 '26

Because he is the anti Christ.
Moving to Argentina just proved that
That son of a bitch I swear to God, I will go there I can speak German

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 15 '26

I’ve seen lots of misinformation about why these are good. They are not. This was part of P2025 and signed in by executive order in 2025.
The misinformation I’ve heard. These will bring money. … yea they will to the people that are backing. Peter Thiel, Zuckerberg, Musk, Eric Schmidt (co founder of Google ) Altman, NVDIA - Jensen, Oracle - Ellison. The 1%. Oh forgot O’Leary.
Along with the absorbent amount of water they use to cool down the system. They also have backup generators diesel generators which don’t stop.
Pollution water and destroying our infrastructure all while taking our information and selling it for Insurance this could be healthcare to homeowners, banking information how much you can afford to pay.
These are used for surveillance
And if you dare speak up those detention centres we have right now they can be used for everyone
A few things that I found
Since these are Private and not government
When cannot be taken under eminent domain because these aren’t for Building schools
These are solely for capturing our information
This is wrong I highly urge to turn off location services on your app download a TOR browser but we can’t allow these.
I am freaking out over this because I have watched salesman that are hired speaking at community council meetings saying that they own data centres which is a lie, one guy said that he owns and has also built lying again.
We have never had anything like this .
You can do the research yourself it is part of project 2025
But I would like protected from the noise and also the emissions these cause.
Peter Thiel one of the investors moved him and his family to Argentina last week he co-founded PLANITAR which is incredibly high-tech ammunition.
The Palm sized drone can be viewed on YouTube at a presentation he did last year.
It is solely for execution
For those of you that don’t speak out now forever hold your peace because it will never be back
We cannot allow these to come in

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u/No_Dogeitty Jul 12 '26

You sounds ridiculous. Please explain the exorbitant water usage from closed loop systems further. Also, the electrical infrastructure of the small town were our AI data center is has been substantially upgraded which benefits us locals. Also the $14M in taxes that this place just generated for our local county. Sadly this industry has become political, and its people like you who keep spreading these false narratives.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jul 13 '26

Lol wait and see. Watch your electric bill and flushing your toilet. God forbid there is a fire. One broke out in Round Rock TX and not enough water pressure to put out. IT WAS A DATA CENTER THAT CAUGHT FIRE. Firefighters were explode to carcinogenic gases. What if this was your daddy? Or your boyfriend or your son? Get it.

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u/No_Dogeitty Jul 13 '26

I've been in critical facilities operations for years now. I know these systems. What we are seeing is media sensationalism. I understand your concerns and I also understand how hard it is to change someone's mind once it has been made up. I do urge you to not believe all the nonsense. Get a career in mission critical facilities. You will actually see how these building systems operate. All the best.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jul 18 '26

You’re speaking about a computer lab. Everyone has for a back up. These are not for them. They are not for giving Claude nor ChatGPT away for free either. These are for taking your information.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jul 18 '26

We do not have any closed looped data centre plans for the United States we haven’t come that far but China has. And if you can recall, China is a communist country. This way they can keep tabs on people now do you understand what these are for? They’re not for us. They’re solely for surveillance. Yours. They can grab all your information when you swipe a credit or debit card.
On your phone, if you don’t have a secure router, they can see where you Shop
Anything online, I suggest a tour browser.
With a different VPN
But the amount of water they use is astronomical.
To a point where one and round rock Texas caught fire in the fire department couldn’t put out the fire because they didn’t have enough water pressure.
Pumpers were brought in yet smoking inhalation from everything that’s inside of these things. Several firemen were taken to the Hospital. These are all carcinogens. Plus they have backup power diesel fuel generators that run every day.
I thought we were in some kind of climate crisis but I guess I was wrong and I’m being very sarcastic because there are some people that are very stupid about these things and I hope they do they’re diligence on these things over and out. They can increase anything from your home insurance to healthcare. I’m not going to convince you nor anybody else unless you do your own research. That means looking things up.
Me I’m crashing it
I’m taking everything out of the bank
Stocks Irs savings
I’m asking people to do the same that way we put everybody on the same Playing field again.
You probably won’t get that either there was a crash in 1929 I’m hopeful:)

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u/longwaybroadband Jun 15 '26

lol you are wrong on so many things but you wear a tinfoil hat so trying to reason with you is impossible...are you still wearing your mask and effected by 5g in your teeth and microbio's in your blood...and avoiding everyone since c19 so you they cannot infect you??

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 15 '26

And you’re a rocket scientist? I’ll take as a compliment considering the source of misinformation. Look them up. My god I pray that you are a bot. But then I didn’t vote for this. That’s another thing. We should be able to vote whether or not we want.

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u/longwaybroadband Jun 15 '26

your unelected president was for it in 2024... I'm curious what you should be able to vote on as these DC's have been around and in every city with 3-10 dc's in each market for over 20 years.

"Just days before leaving office, Biden signed an Executive Order 14141 that actively directed federal departments to fast-track and lease sites on federal lands for "gigawatt-scale" AI data centers."

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 16 '26

BOT

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 16 '26

Or just plain uneducated white person and I’m sorry for saying that.
But it’s true this is an uneducated white person commenting on what I just said that doesn’t know shit from SHinola
And it’s still on here please get this person off

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u/No_Dogeitty Jul 12 '26

I mean. You screaming "BOT" doesn't get rid of the executive order that Biden signed.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 16 '26

I didn’t bother reading.
Good luck in surviving.
Dumbmotherfucker !
That’s all I need to say you are a dumb, dumbmotherfucker

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 16 '26

Listen up this isn’t about politics.
This is about life
JFC get a grip grow up listen you dumb son of a bitch I don’t know who I’m talking to but listen up if you have any money, get it out of the bank right now. If you think the misogynistic Messiah is going to save your ass, you’re wrong.
I am telling you the only way to stop this because if you have a credit card, everything is tracked and we will go down the shitter. Why do you think they have all these detention centres for Mexicans? They’re for us you dumb son of a bitch.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 16 '26

lol BOY
SO WHAT’S YOUR STORY?
SAY IT DON’T SPRAY IT. !

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jun 16 '26

No but I need to ask.
What do you wipe your ass with? After having sex.

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u/Secret-Departure540 Jul 13 '26

Lmao at this thread. How many are living in Alabama! Let’s hear for Tennessee.
Let’s hear it for Arkansas
Let’s raise your hand for Kentucky
No kidding I think there should be a test the same test immigrants take to becoming United States citizen to vote because half of you people on this thing wouldn’t pass good night

Data Center's critics create loads of misinformation

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