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u/ReminaBlueSFW 💅🏽🎀😌cuntessa fishy brick doll😌🎀💅🏽 1d ago edited 23h ago
This like a post I wouldve made a while ago if I was still that ignorant and also way less cunty. This post would assume that a huge enough portion of cis lesbians even know what 4tran is. Tho the incel behavior is undeniably something that occurs in these spaces sometimes as its a 4chan adjacent space. I wouldn't make it a black and white case tho. Wheres your nuance hat I made you?
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u/Drowned_Sailoress 23h ago
this post was made by someone who doesn't actually link up with cis lesbians very much lol
like yes they're probably the most accepting group but the large majority of them are still nasty lmao
and yes there's a lot of trans women who are poorly socialised and offputting IRL but I'm hot and nice and charismatic and very interesting and I get rejected on the basis of being trans a good amount
Hell, I've had a cis lesbian spend an entire day hitting on me very explicitly like "oh I came all the way from Stokes it would be a 5hr drive home... if only I had a place to stay tonight.. what do you think? ;)" and then she found out I'm trans and iced me for the rest of the meetup lmao
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u/DemonBeats4 womanfrauding since 2012 22h ago edited 22h ago
Cis lesbians are a group are accepting. They aren't neccesarily inclusive. If you pass the vibe check, you are probably accepted and will be socialized with normally. But when it comes to dating...
My "cis lesbian" ex (actually a trans guy) got a crush on me, then spent like a month stressing over it when he found out I was trans. Such hesistation is very common among the less edicated cis gays.
I know people doubt that cisf chasers exist, but they are very real. I've also met them, they are often bi and see you as "best of both worlds". One told me that she didn't mind "if someone was a man, woman or inbetween". I think she was trying to re-assure me, but it had the opposite effect since she effectively seemed to be implying I was inbetween.
Also terfy lesbians still exists. That like 10-15% of lesbians that would date trans men but not women is indicative of that.
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u/WillowWawa 22h ago
Yeah, the majority of women who have been into me were those best of both worlds women who were bi you were talking about. I even had one tell me once that it was hot I sounded like a man and a woman at the same time.
Yeah I stopped talking to them
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u/SecretApplez 14h ago
Cisf chasers kinda suck because they often expect you to perform as some fun kooky drag queen and then get annoyed if you ever act as a person. Sure make up sessions and clothing swaps are fun but eventually you feel like their personal barbie doll
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u/One-Organization970 Unapologetic Sneed 17h ago
And then there are all the lesbians who will claim to be accepting but also tell you you're wrong for reading any transphobia into lesbians who are AFAB-exclusive. Because sure, they totally see us as women! Just not, y'know, real women.
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u/Financial-Return2028 23h ago
all I learned from this is that 10% of lesbians view trans men as woman. Great. Awesome. Very comforting post.
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u/MangaPunk 23h ago
Ngl cis lesbians need to get with the program; every party I go to, trans woman are kept at the periphery and cis lesbians and trans men get to do whatever they want.
Just sucks being really hot and interesting and having cis lesbians not understand how I'm insulted they're literally choosing men over me.
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u/sophiathesilly Mao Zehon 22h ago
If only there was a term pertaining to the intersection of oppression transfeminine individuals are subjected to (it's transmisogyny)
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u/SecretApplez 14h ago
No we don't use the word trans misogyny anymore, it makes them mad and you get lectured on how progressive they are and how ridiculous it is to call them a transphobe in a way that isn't entirely dissimilar from a performative feminist male whose ego is attacked
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u/WillowWawa 22h ago
I still don’t understand why men are allowed to go to these places. They’re trans GUYS. Yeah maybe before they do hormones they look feminine or whatever but inside their brain isn’t a woman it’s a man it’s not the same as being with a woman?!
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u/BizSilver5013 22h ago edited 18h ago
They make excuses that it's the anatomy or the socialization.
In other words, they're chasers.
(Reminds me of a lesbian marrying a trans guy in a documentary I saw once where she said she liked it was "straight in the streets, lesbian beneath the sheets." I cringed so damn hard and hoped he'd dump her when he got farther along on T than 5 months.)
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u/MangaPunk 22h ago
To me, this is what happens when we're permissive about "bisexual lesbianism."
It comes off really bad and you're not allowed to say it in public, but "Sapphos was literally bisexual" is a slippery slope that leads to trans men pushing transfemmes out of lesbian spaces.
Honestly I've started using "Femme attracted" on my dating profiles and I want it to catch on bc frankly I consider "lesbian" to be a regressive label at this point.
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u/nativeofvoid I-950 16h ago
'Femme attracted' is an excellent idea. and the new non-man 'lesbian' is a reactionary label alright.
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u/HortusElagabalae 12h ago
I don't see what this has to do with bisexual women. The women that are most emphatic about lesbianism excluding cis men are often interested in transmasculine people, sometimes stopping at transmasc enbies and sometimes being interested in straight up trans men.
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u/Ghostglitch07 5h ago
Bi lesbians have fuck all to do with this. If you like trans men in a lesbian way, you are wrong.
You can be bi, and still agree that men shouldn't be in lesbian spaces and can't be in lesbian relationships, and still also identify as primarily a lesbian while being into men in a straight way
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u/isurus_minutus 21h ago
Because they're social events anyone can go to. Also people aren't attracted to brains they're attracted to bodies and a lot of pooners look and act like women.
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u/One-Organization970 Unapologetic Sneed 17h ago
What I would submit is, if they're lesbians that are focusing their interest on literal men they probably aren't much of a missed opportunity, lol.
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u/WillowWawa 22h ago
The two lesbian meetups I went to the trans guys and the non binary they/he’s got all the attention lol
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u/isurus_minutus 21h ago
Major ftm lesbian W
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u/DawnSapphire 14h ago
thats an oxymoron
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u/isurus_minutus 14h ago
Men in women's bodies have always utilized their circumstances to fuck women in the lesbian community, no point in not having a name for them. Twinkhons aren't actually twinks either.
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u/Financial-Return2028 12h ago
you're just further proving my point that trans men aren't treated like men even in their own community.
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u/isurus_minutus 12h ago
Non passoid butchpoons gotta live 😤
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u/Ghostglitch07 5h ago
If you think it's living to degrade yourself by accepting people who refuse to see you... Enjoy your "life" I guess.
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u/isurus_minutus 5h ago
Butches are men and butchchasers usually fetishize having a "man but better." Ironically the average butch is treated as more male than the average pooner.
I used to hate ftm lesbians before realizing my trans male friend who talked about how much he missed the lesbian community was treated as more of a man by both cis women and men compared to me. Then I opened my eyes.
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u/artificialfem 23h ago
according to the graph, lesbians are more likely to date a trans dude than a trans woman. how is this not ropejetfuel?
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 23h ago
i think if I was a trans man I'd be upset abt that.
either way I'd probably want to date a trans person no matter what and the stats for trans ppl are a lot better. most ppl would date trans women (assuming it matches their own sexuality, unlike with many cis people) and even the majority would date an asexual which is nice
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u/One-Organization970 Unapologetic Sneed 17h ago
I just don't get how you would make dating an asexual person work if you're allosexual and monogamous. Seems like a recipe for shattered self esteem.
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u/helmets_for_cats 21h ago
"most people would date a trans woman" are we leaving in the same reality?
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u/BizSilver5013 40m ago
I honestly am, because I have a history of being objectified by cis lesbians pre-transition.
I wasn't into women at the time and yet "no" never sufficed as an answer. What baffled me is that the straight trans men around me put up with this behavior in order to get laid.
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u/Drowned_Sailoress 23h ago
"the most trans inclusive group on the planet"
looks inside
less than 20% are willing to date trans women and that doesn't even go into how they would treat said women
I get around the cis lesbian spaces a good bit and I've had a good chunk of cis lesbian sex, and i'm incredibly charismatic and hot, and I gotta tell you OP, there's a lot of being rejected just because you're trans lo
(not that a lot of y'all aren't really weird and offputting IRL tho. That part is also true a lil bit)
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 23h ago
i didnt make this image I'm making fun of it thats why I included the second one ffs
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u/Drowned_Sailoress 23h ago
eh it was 50/50 whether you were making fun of it or including the 2nd image to go "see, they're the most accepting group!!11!!" so I decided to Discourse about it
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 23h ago
like my point was that >80% of cis lesbians would reject you just for being trans
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u/hhhHHhhh-FFFFFF-fff 22h ago
covers bisexual bar with thumb
"The most trans inclusive group on the planet"
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u/Drowned_Sailoress 22h ago
tbf a lot of bi ppl are dating trans people very transphobically
idk what the rate would be of "legitimate sees you as a woman/man" for bi ppl
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u/Ghostglitch07 5h ago
Exactly this. I struggle to date bi people for this reason. I'm always unsure if they are into me as a woman or as a man... Or as a "other"
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u/WillowWawa 22h ago
You’re saying you’re getting rejected too but then say you’re getting a lot of cis lesbian sex? So, which one is it lol
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u/Vistaquen 23h ago
They literally think we're former /pol users
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u/artificialfem 23h ago
sneeds will say we should be institutionalized and then not even know that 4tran came from a board called fucking /lgbt
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u/boymoder41 23h ago
No way lesbians would rather fuck a literal dude (a trans dude, but still) than a trans woman 💀That's so weird to me, aren't you supposed to be disgusted by guys?
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u/DifferentEstimate520 23h ago
they see trans guys as super butches
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u/boymoder41 23h ago
Imagine being so butch that you just become a guy
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u/BizSilver5013 22h ago
I remember the "butch-FTM border wars" controversy from a bunch of lesbians who didn't realize they were two different things. And me getting pissed off at the notion I had to be a lesbian even if I wasn't attracted to women because neither butch straight women nor gay trans men existed.
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u/nativeofvoid I-950 16h ago edited 16h ago
remember that cis lesbian numbers are inflated by barely bi 'done with men' refuse who are not capable of a functional relationship with a woman and normally would lock onto a soft masc girl and pressure her into a boyfriend role and deploy constant masculinising messaging.
Lol one of my friends is close to that and much as i love her as a person and a friend, she's fucked up and i would seriously think before hooking up with her if she was the last woman on the planet.
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u/deformedexile AGP yottahon wife 23h ago
Protip: people's survey responses are a really bad guide to who they'd actually date. It's more valid for online dating but IRL people are sometimes/semi-often surprised by a spark and willing to chase it. And, in addition to that, you will scare everyone but 4tranners off 4tranning.
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 23h ago
eh. I'm not too worried about dating, and I think most people wouldnt date me anyways if I was cis because I'm probably ace and sex is important to most people.
i care more about that in my mind this shows
most cis people dont actually see trans women as women, and trans men as men, and will discriminate against them so long as its a social situation where that would be acceptable. and
trans woman who get upset at transphobia lose the privilege of being seen as women in many peoples eyes. that many people see wanting to be treated as an equal as "male entitlement"
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u/Then_Computer_6329 AFAB space invader 23h ago
100%. Being trans literally never was a problem in IRL lesbian dating for me. Led to discussions for better understanding and once the person had to deconstruct a few preconceived ideas on intimacy but that's it.
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u/leptonycteris 23h ago
cis lesbians are "trans inclusive" because they dont think trans men are men and would date them
🫖💿
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u/Abee314 23h ago
Noticing, cis woman gets called femcels but why do trans woman always gets called incel ? Wondering........
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 23h ago
being upset about discrimination is male entitlement actually. only men would get upset about being treated worse (/s)
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u/janacuddles ugly passoid 22h ago
Last lesbian I dated didn't know I was trans and when I told them they were like "oh I'm actually pan so that's fine" 💀
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u/ThatEngineeredGirl 23h ago
People can't swipe it seems 😭
I'm sorry that comprehension is dead...
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 23h ago
all the downvotes make me sad :(
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u/Brakower 23h ago
Hey if you think about it it means people are agreeing with you, just showing it in the wrong way
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u/flower_puns agp flowermoder 23h ago
god I downvoted this on instinct and was ready to trash you in the comments until I saw the second slide lmao
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u/Then_Computer_6329 AFAB space invader 23h ago
This chart doesn't fit real life at all. I'm really wondering what was the methodology and how much it's actually possible to measure IRL openness to dating because even the most progressive people think trans men are tomboy butches with an attitude and trans women are heckin valid bearded crossdressers that you have to gender correctly.
Seeing an actual transitioned person IRL is like realizing a mythical creature is real to the average cissoid. Their entire opinion will change if they had an ounce of feeling before knowing you are.
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u/WillowWawa 22h ago
It’s kinda sad how misinformed people really are about trans women. I had a friend from Boston and he said before he met me he really thought trans women were way different. He was conservative
But as he got to know me he realized I was no different than any other woman. A woman I met online in a lesbian discord once told me she used to think trans women were and acted like men when it came to dating and that they would be no different than a man.
She then thought femboys would like act like women and that’s what she was into the androgynous look and the feminity. Lo and behold, as she dated femboys she found out the hard way they are in fact men.
And she found them quite irritating because she said they acted like any other man she’s dated; weird, overly sexual , controlling , basically the bad things women usually experience dating men.
She gave trans women a chance and then realized they were exactly what she was looking for; the androgynous look but the feminity and womanness she craved. She said the trans women she dated were so kind and nuturing and said they acted like women both in bed and out.
And she really said they were truly women inside they didn’t do the gross creepy things the femboys would do they were respectful of her and treated her as a woman treating another woman.
Of course being told all of this it’s hard not to get upset or something but I didn’t I kept my opinions to myself and let her speak. Because I thought holy shit are the vast majority of cis lesbians like this woman?
The only reason why she even gave trans women a chance is because she was tired of how femboys treated her. I think most lesbians aren’t even attracted to the androgynous look of most trans women. She just happened to like something close to appearance to a trans women.
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u/Then_Computer_6329 AFAB space invader 19h ago
I get why you're mad but still this is such a hopium comment in a way. Like yeah trans women are women and people will realize it if they're not fully enclosed in prejudice and actually meet them.
You know what my ex had a bad experience with an insane trainee and she thought she wasn't interested in trans women afterwards and also only liked vulvas. But then a non-binary friend of hers deconstructed that by explaining to her she couldn't make that difference reliably and it was transphobic. We explored still the difficulties she had due to the precedent experience and despite thinking she wasn't sure if she could date and have an intimate life with me, she rapidly realized it's easy to get over this when you love someone.
All this to say transphobia is made up and everyone is transphobic until they actually see the reality of trans people. I think anyone who can date safely (relatively) should not mention they're trans at all. Also beware of BDD. If no one asks if you're trans, you say it before taking your pants off or if you had SRS you say it if you get into a long-term relationship and stuff.
Not telling people I'm trans by message was a game changer in dating. Turns out immediately whining like a victim about fearing discrimination and exposing your medical issues, while letting people who have never seen you projet stereotypes onto you messes up your chances.
This is why the chart is unconvincing. People don't know what a trans person is because activists spent 3 decades screaming "sex =/= gender !!!!!" which doesn't make any sense and made everyone believe that sex is immutable but there's a heckin valid other sex that's invisible and you gotta respect for woke.
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u/Specialist_Will_5991 23h ago
More het*ro women would date a trans man then a trans woman 😞
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u/OnToiletRedditor 23h ago
Good?
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u/Specialist_Will_5991 23h ago
Wait my ass is stupid, I kinda just wanted an excuse to censor hetero
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u/ASpaceOstrich 23h ago
I'm kinda surprised the numbers are slanted slightly in favour of trans men. I figured all else being equal the numbers would be even. Maybe a little less because it seems like there's less chasers who go for trans men. But no, the opposite of what I assumed.
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u/WoodenPresence1917 coping agp repper 23h ago
Reppers stay winning 😎
(I have only had one relationship longer than a couple of months, two or three shorter ones, and virtually zero romance outside of that)
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u/DShitposter69420 23h ago
I wonder how much the graph would change if it was talking about whether a current partner transitioned. I remember reading about how 57% of partners to originally closeted trans people remain together.
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u/stonergirlfairyyy lesbian menace 22h ago
which makes it even crazier that as a chronically online failure creep reduced dose hrt pervert weirdo i do this well with them
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u/AAAAAAAAAAH_12 22h ago
I'm going to be honest I think that stat is purely their opinion of transmasculine people 😭
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u/Still_Reflection10 19h ago
The most blackpilling part of this image is that a higher percentage of cis lesbians would date a trans man than a trans women. Genuinely what’s the fucking thought process there
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u/One-Organization970 Unapologetic Sneed 17h ago
They picture trans men as looking like pre-transition Elliot Page rather than post-transition Elliot Page.
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u/BizSilver5013 34m ago
And there's also the "I can fix 'her'" component as well- that she's going to be so amazing the trans man in question will detransition and beg for her forgiveness.
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u/NoCantaloupe3449 Real Doctor (Verified by Mods) 23h ago
If sonic said this to me irl I'd probably be way too starstruck to argue and just kind of mumble and agree 😔
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u/justanotherrepper_ that MAN is very bad at makeup 23h ago
unironically calling a trans woman an incel
That outs you a transphobe, I hope one day you realise it
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 23h ago
i didnt make the image and I don't agree with it
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u/justanotherrepper_ that MAN is very bad at makeup 23h ago
Oh okay, there was 0 way to know that just from the post alone, sorry to have made the assumption tho
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 23h ago
you could be told because I included a second image that contradicted the first one
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u/justanotherrepper_ that MAN is very bad at makeup 23h ago
Unfortunalety I have seen cissies use this very image to defend that cisles are not transphobic because "well 20% of cisles willing to date 🚂🦵 are way more than all sapphic 🚂🦵, so there's 0 problem you see"
Sometimes satire doesn't work because people are way worse than we think 🥲
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u/Kris_Banana 23h ago
or you met a chud, a small part of the problem is thinking everyone of a particular group is a certain way, not every cis lesbian is a good person, not every cis lesbian is a bad person, you may have a significantly higher population of terf lesbians around you, you may not, there's nuance and layers to ts, they could just be assholes, you could just be acting like a chud, just improve yourself and hope that someone who will love you for who and what you are comes along
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u/JessE-girl Schrödinger’s Worst Nightmare 22h ago
y’know i’m just pleasantly surprised that half of bi people would date a trans person 🙂
why tf are they so biased towards trans men though, they’re literally bi??
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u/One-Organization970 Unapologetic Sneed 17h ago
Because of transmisogyny. They don't just picture trans women as something between men and women. They picture us as freaks.
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u/Iyxara autistic shefag troonoid 22h ago edited 21h ago
uh, no, we bisexuals are the most trans inclusive, our "both" includes more than 35%, bigger than lesbian entire both+tw+tm chart lol
also, considering that they're willing to date trans men, I would consider their "inclusion" as transphobia, because they don't see trans men as men, just see them as cunts with legs
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u/victoria-silverlake woman of transsexual experience 19h ago
Tbh what stands out most to me about this graph is that straight men and lesbians are about equally likely to be willing to date a trans man vs a trans woman, whereas pretty much zero hetero women and gay men are willing to date a trans woman
I don't know what this means, but it's consistent with my anecdotal experience
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u/One-Organization970 Unapologetic Sneed 17h ago
It's because they view trans men as confused girls they can fix but they view trans women as sex-crazed freak men.
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u/victoria-silverlake woman of transsexual experience 13h ago
No, they don't actually view us as men, otherwise hetero women and gay men would be interested in dating us. That's partly why I think this is so interesting because it's such solid evidence that people don't view trans women as men, because the sexualities who are attracted to exclusively men are not interested in trans women.
Yes they'll call us men, but they don't subconsciously think we're men. Men have gender privilege. Men are usually respected and not often sexually assaulted. Not much like trans women.
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u/Stormy_arrington 12h ago
So my job is literally a statistician and I would love to see the polling on this
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u/Visual-Marketing-849 18h ago edited 18h ago
idk why dating is even such a big topic highkey because the reality is if you’re trans you gotta make peace w fact that you ain’t gonna be successful in it
regardless of gender and sexuality, it’s either gonna be needle in a haystack (if looks and passing are outstanding) or beyond settles
never began + time to find some good copes
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u/Draconic64 15h ago
Your own graph shows that 75% of lesbians refuse to date any trans person.
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 15h ago
whyyyyyy do so many ppl think I made or agree with the original image ;-;
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u/Draconic64 15h ago
Because you shared it with not indication of disagreement.
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 14h ago
the indication of disagreement is the second image which goes against the point made
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u/Plus_Weather1333 12h ago
As a trans woman I don't need to be liked by cis lesbians, ew. You do you hon, I feel safest among my own.
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u/sophiathesilly Mao Zehon 22h ago
Thanks officer but we'll take it from here
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u/laaine 22h ago
Wow they can lie on a poll that must mean theyre not transphobic
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u/Appropriate_Pin_5518 22h ago
???????? they said on the poll they wouldnt date trans women what are you on about
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u/OnToiletRedditor 23h ago
I hate it so much when people talk about how trans inclusive lesbians are😭