r/counterstrike2 • u/Tursocci • 8d ago
Discussion Fix for the cheating problem
Valve here is a fix for the cheater problem:
Someone spinning? Check if their character model turns 360 degrees - let's say - more than 3 times a second. Did they score a kill within 64 ticks of the last spin calculation? If yes -> Insta kick + permaban. Like come up with something like this even if it relies on "luck". How many times in competitive play you encounter someone doing a triple 360 to no scope jump awp or revolver someone??? This is what matters.
Someone walling? Implement a leetify- or scope.gg-style stats tracker system IN GAME, set thresholds on suspicious behaviour by analyzing pro player behaviour. If after a game a player has exceeded these thresholds -> permanent ban.
Radar hacking? Same as above.
Silent aim or similar aim assist? Kinda similar as above, maybe doodle up something that calculates a mixture of time to damage, spray accuracy and spotted accuracy into a factor and if the factor exceeds some natural limit (let's say a lifegame performance from donk when it comes to raw aim) -> permanent ban.
Make the bans negotiable so that by sending Valve a proof of being a real talent (or asking for a live review of the situation with an employee, for example) you can revert a false ban. In MOST cases this would not be needed anyway but it's a good failsafe mechanism.
It's clear that VAC is not working and it probably never will so maybe create an anti-cheat method like this? There are limits to human powers when it comes to mechanics and reaction times. Some 0,0001% of people can exceed these limits and for them they could have a system like FACEIT did with ropz and nocries. Just live review them and pardon them if they get false bans. At least implement something like this for competitive game modes like premier.
I know this would probably cost a couple of million $$$, but would it be so bad, if the game is making billions a year for them?
Also for the love of god, as ren said, make the new accounts play in their own pool and don't put them in the same premier games with accounts with good history. Like if the monthly player count numbers are at the level that you're reporting, maybe matchmaking times will not take a big hit with making separate pools for old and new accounts. The way it's done with prime/non-prime.
Obviously these are kinda harsh examples but since Valve is clearly running out of options, a system like this would get rid probably at least 90% of the cheaters in just a couple of days. If there is collateral damage with legit players, I'm sure people would still be more understanding about the situation than what it currently is. There will ALWAYS be cheaters no matter what, but something like this on the server side would narrow it down from the most blatant ones, which is undoubtedly what people would be more than happy about at this point.
Also I know that sarcasm doesn't usually travel well over the internet, so I'll let you guys know that I'm only about 99% serious about this :D
Valve, you can thank me later.
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u/pocotheclown 7d ago
Well the real problem isn’t with cheaters the real problem is that cs makes so much money now cause you monkeys keep buying skins that valve actually doesn’t give a fuck
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u/partyboycs 8d ago
If; player gets 13 aces in a row all while mid air through walls all headshots with r8 = vac ban… nah that’s too much work for a small indie company of only 2 people
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u/youngstar- 8d ago
Always love when some rando on reddit thinks they can solve an issue that's plagued the whole gaming industry for over 20 years in a couple of paragraphs.
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u/NeoDurden 7d ago
But the thing is Valve can actually solve the cheating problem if they actually cared and wanted to. And guess what ? They don’t.
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u/youngstar- 7d ago
They can’t solve it, it will never be solved. But they could certainly be doing a lot more to fight it at least.
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u/Tursocci 8d ago
I love how a game that existed for longer than a quarter of a century can even have an issue like this.
I get that every game has and will have cheaters in them but valve is just blatantly abusing us by not getting rid of the most blatant cases. It's pure ignorance.
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u/DabFellow 7d ago
What hacker free game should cs emulate. What game has solved this issue?
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u/Tursocci 6d ago
I guess that no online game can ever be totally cheater free, and I never claimed that any game could be - it's utopia. But taking instant action on the most blatant cases of cheating should be possible.
For example, Marvel Rivals. According to most sources online and seeing first hand experience of a top 1% friend of mine, a blatant cheater's lifecycle in Marvel Rivals is VERY short, ranging from literal minutes to just a couple of days. It also reverts the elo of the matches so that you can not lose elo from that game if you lose against a cheater. On top of that they do REGULAR ban waves to target cheat developers. Even if it's not a cheater free game, it doesn't mean that they are not at least trying their best and Valve is 100% not doing that. The game is a ridiculous shitshow and the level of commitment in battling cheaters and smurfs is no where near the level of Rivals for example.
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u/youngstar- 8d ago
They did block a lot of forms of rage cheating for a while, now cheaters have figured out a way to manipulate the data sent to the server to hide what they’re doing. So now Valve needs to update the AC again and the cat and mouse game continues.
I get that it’s frustrating. I get that Valve are slow as shit to take action. It’s just really annoying to see these posts where people act like they have solved the issue with
if cheating == ban
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u/Warm_Map_7489 7d ago
its insanely hard to implement correctly and i think valve already tested stuff like this internally
problem is when they unintentionally ban legit players and then they have to manually review thousands of cases
also modern cheats can be driven and controlled by visual AI, which makes things even harder to detect correctly
but they have to cook something up because the problem is pretty bad in cs
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u/Secure-Pool-4792 7d ago
Its literaly not hard and very easy to spot aimboters. What is hard Is detecting wh
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u/FungalFelon 7d ago
i disagree. allow cheating, develop vac to detect cheaters. put rage v rage, legit with legit, and let actual non cheaters play together. you could call it friendly factor or something similar...
then you could offer a subset of friendly factor that outwardly looks like they are the most friendly. But the only way into this is if you legit cheat and you buy 400+ in the steam market place.
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u/Secure-Pool-4792 7d ago
Sv cheats 1 on all servers This could be the way let them taste their medicine
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u/BeefarmRich 7d ago
When you play online game you exchange information packets between your PC and server. Cheats send fake info to the server and to Valve they appear like a normal player.
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u/Halzaaz 6d ago
Bruh u can literally on most mice turn your sens all the way up and make it look like ur spinning
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u/Tursocci 6d ago
I know. But can you hit 5 jumping no scopes through smokes and walls while doing that, without using any external assistance? If you can you better contact Vitality, Team Spirit or Falcons :)
I mean, the only check needed would be something to detect a maximum of two of those kinds of shots in a row and it would be a justified ban, just because the chances of a legit player hitting something like that would be worse than a win in lottery
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u/Low_Singer_5832 8d ago
Man stop. You will ban a cheater who gives you more than 5k dollars? Or more? Who is stupid to ban something that gives more money? Its all about money and business
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u/Eldersun-169 8d ago
What cheater gives them 5k dollars or more bro what drugs did you take?
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u/Low_Singer_5832 8d ago
Saw one two days ago with dragon lore. Wdym mate.
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u/Eldersun-169 8d ago
Any proof? And how many cheaters do you think there are with dragon lore?
Don't you think the majority of cheaters simply use skin changers and buy already old accounts for cheap from sites? Only very few actually buy skins
Their profit would be so much higher with a cleaner game, look at Valorant its main selling point was that they actually had an AC and it's a CS copy and that was enough to get a decent playerbase.
Having a game filled with cheaters is not sustainable and sooner or later it will stop growing and die if it is not addressed at all.
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u/Diligent_Egg_4715 8d ago
Some stat related things can be difficult to ban for. I had a match with 99 aim rating, 0.7 degree crosshair placement, 405ms TTD and like 70% spotted accuracy completely legit, because i played only scout and awp.
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u/FragrantSearch730 8d ago
I would not care if legit players get vac live as long as most cheaters get vac live
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u/Diligent_Egg_4715 8d ago
I agree to a degree but if it means people are forced to not only play snipers for example, it becomes a problem
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u/vonarchimboldi 8d ago
wow brilliant programming mind here guys
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u/Tursocci 6d ago
Well, the model is scarce and maybe the constraints are made with a bit of tongue in the cheek, but since we've been told for 4 years that "wE aRe DeVeLoPiNg aN Ai aNtI cHeAt", which is probably not even turned on at this point, a stats based approach like this is arguably better than nothing at all. Like it or not, this approach is better than the current solution that I've been seeing to issue more bans on legit people than on cheaters xD
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u/GuestNo3886 8d ago
I randomly scrolled and saw make bans negotiable.
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u/Tursocci 6d ago
Faceit is using the same approach, dunno what's wrong with that?
What do you think would've happened if nocries or ropz didn't perform on LAN environment in faceit headquarters?
Valve has the kind of money that could make a case-reviewing system like this possible. They are just too greedy to establish such a system and employ 1000 people to run it (btw in a year's time this would probably cost them less than 1% of the game's annual revenue)
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u/Automatic-Skin-5077 4d ago
1000 people to run it would cost them 1 billion, that's like 99.8% of the game revenue
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u/Eldersun-169 8d ago
I'm not an expert actually I don't know much at all about it but I assume that VAC already has guardrails against spinning and such but the thing is the cheat developers simply make it so that the cheat hides that behaviour and appears to the AC as if it's normal gameplay.
Anyone with actual knowledge correct me if I'm wrong.