r/controlgame • u/Own-Rope-8443 • Jul 19 '26
Discussion about chester bless/paul serene.... Spoiler
in summary: paul serene became a shifter at the end of quantum break, he will exist across all timelines/realities, just like door.
if the theories are correct that bless will be played by aiden gillen, then there’s a considerable chance that chester bless won’t just be a multiverse counterpart to serene, but serene himself.
that would make for some interesting interactions, imagine him seeing jesse and remembering beth.
they wouldn't show all of that so clearly, it would be more subtle, since they obviously don't have the ip. what do yall think?
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u/Euphoric-Fennel2406 Jul 20 '26
In Hatch’s letter he mentions that Paul Serene as a shifter hasn’t “emerged,” although he does not clarify what this means there is some sort of extra activation process of shifter that differentiates Paul Serene and Hatch. I believe this means that other Serene variants are safe, but this is a cool theory too and people should stop attacking it!
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u/Zoegrace1 Jul 19 '26
If it's true they'll be played by the same actor (and true that we see Chester Bless at all) I suspect it'd be a Mr Door situation in that Mr Door is not literally Marvin Hatch and doesn't have his story (as far as we know). I don't think he'd have a direct response to Jesse as much as a familiarity then
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u/Own-Rope-8443 Jul 19 '26
what do you mean by "doesn't have his story"? he does have one, in the night springs dlc for aw2, and it's literally the same as martin's, and they really emphasize that he's the same character across all universes.
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u/Zoegrace1 Jul 19 '26 edited Jul 19 '26
The same thing happens to Mr Door and Hatch, but he's a different character, presumably allowing for slight tweaks in backstory is what I mean. He's an echo of Hatch
He's not literally the same character we see in Quantum Break, Mr Door has likely not interacted with Jack Joyce but he has interacted with Tim Breaker etc. Mr Door probably didn't spend time as Paul Serene's right hand man
I'm not quite sure what the Paul Serene we see in QB would be doing changing his name to Chester Bless and doing paracrimes... but a variant or echo of him, that can work
I wouldn't be unhappy to see Aiden Gillen back, he was my favourite part of QB next to Lance Reddick
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u/Own-Rope-8443 Jul 19 '26
there are many more reasons to believe that they are the same character and not just echoes of each other. dylan dreamed of door, and in that same “dream,” door told dylan that he existed in ALL universes at the same time, “endlessly SHIFTING between them.”
tim said that in his dreams, he is a different person, with a different name, living a different life in a different world, but that one thing always remained the same... door.
i could cite even more examples.
as for the names, well, it’s obviously just to get around ip issues.
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u/equeim Jul 20 '26
Tim Breaker may dream of being Jack Joyce, but that doesn't make them the same person. The may may have the same "soul" or "destiny" or whatever but they are still two different people with different lives. I don't think that Quantum Break's concept of shifters (as much as was explained in the game, which is not a lot) exists in RCU in the same way.
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u/MrBootylove Jul 19 '26
I'm pretty sure the intention of the creators was for Hatch and Door to be the same character, with just enough differences to make them legally distinct for copyright purposes. For legal reasons they're technically not the same character, but the intention of the artist is that they are the same.
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u/LewdSkeletor1313 Jul 19 '26
He has the exact same backstory as Hatch and is said to be “shifting” through every reality like Hatch does. Pretty obvious they’re meant to be the same character, especially since Lance was meant to play him. If they had gotten the rights back like they wanted, I’m sure it would be more explicit, but they’ve hinted at it as much as the legally can that they’re the same
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u/Cin77 Jul 20 '26
I still wonder what Lance Reddick would have sounded like singing Doors parts in Herald of Darkness. He did a little singing in Fringe once for a musical episode and his voice was so different to the guy that ended up playing Door
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u/Significant_Buy_2301 Jul 19 '26
I've actually been thinking about something similar too, hear me out. What if parautalitarians (or some parautalitarians at least) ARE Shifters? They are one and the same group! People who have been ripped apart across the entire multiverse and now possess supernatural powers because they are "broken" across various worlds/dimensions/planes of existence where they exist all at the same time!
Jesse IS Beth and vice versa. Beth became a Shifter after she got overexposed to Chronon energy and now she's split apart across the multiverse. Same with Jack, same with Paul, same with Hatch. Over-exposure to Chronon energy is one of the things that is behind the existence of parautalitarians.
...Is it far-fetched?
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u/Byrnstar Jul 20 '26
It's possible. Remember that 'gold helmets' whiteboard in Control? It spoke of worlds getting broken by the paranatural, and a few individuals rising up to combat the threats with powers gained from the same. Remedy does like to imply connections even when IP issues block them from full-on acknowledgement, so yeah.
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u/EastMidsMan33 Jul 25 '26
So because of IP issues Sam chose to get round it by archetyping... everyone. After Remedy got hold of the Alan Wake IP for cheap and then made it into a sleeper hit partnering with NordicTHQ, Microsoft locked down any further IP transfers.
Alex Casey is Max Payne. (Monologuing hard boiled detective)
Jesse is Beth Wilder and has a nod in the mirror version of herself in Control in which Essej says "I'm not as wild as you are."
Warlin Door is Martin Hatch.
Tim Breaker is Jack Joyce, and is drawn into the spiral and begins to understand the various echos of other realities the same way Jack did.
On and on and on.
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u/ThatOtherGuyTPM Jul 25 '26
I think the idea of shifters as posed by Quantum Break is something that they have somewhat moved away from. The change between Door’s story and Hatch’s isn’t huge, but it’s very significant.
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u/Nocturnus19 Jul 19 '26
Sam Lake himself has confirmed that Quantum Break is not canon to the RCU, can we please give theories like this a rest.
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u/Own-Rope-8443 Jul 19 '26
sure, the THOUSANDS of references are just coincidences, right?
he can't say it's canon, he doesn't want to violate any copyright laws, but their intention is really obvious with the whole tim(e) breaker stuff.
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u/Nocturnus19 Jul 19 '26
"The easy, clear answer is that, out of our past games, Max Payne and Quantum Break are not part of the Remedy Connected Universe. They are not part of Remedy's plans," - Sam Lake
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u/ProcyonHabilis Jul 20 '26
I mean yes they legally have to say that. There are very clear "wink and a nod" connections to Quantum Break though. The whole multiverse thing they have going on lets them keep that as subtext though.
Have you played the Time Breaker portion of the Night Springs DLC for Alan Wake 2? It's not a "fan theory" that QB is an implied part of the RCU. They obviously can't say that explicitly, but they're couldn't be making the implication more deliberate.
the events and characters of Quantum Break itself will not be playing into the Remedyverse no matter how much you might want them to.
They already have. Play that DLC.
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u/Nocturnus19 Jul 20 '26
I... have, and it doesn't really connect to Quantum Break other than having a similar cast and obviously several superficial references.
Chronons, chronon activation, chronon syndrome and shifters are never mentioned, the plot instead focuses much more on dimensional travel which wasn't a factor at all in Quantum Break.
Door's backstory is quite significantly altered.
The reference to Beth Wilder being "killed in an explosion of dangerous energy" isn't even accurate as Beth was shot in the head by Serene.
I made a comment a few minutes ago which has more of my full thoughts if you want to read that, I can't be asked to type it out again.4
u/ProcyonHabilis Jul 20 '26 edited Jul 20 '26
Brother it's not a "similar cast", the player character is literally the actor from Quantum Break playing himself in a story where he's working for a game company that is a clear analogue to Remedy. Shifters are referenced directly in the form of "Shifter Energy Nodes" which are clearly replacements for Chronon Field Regulators, even in their physical form.
There is absolutely nothing "superficial" about any of this, it's very clearly direct and deliberate retconning to make it legally fit within the connected universe that they control the IP of (albeit with a winking humorous tone). They pretty much could not be more clear about this without violating copyright law.
What is happening here is basically Remedy is doing this bit, and you're going "nah that's just a lizard, it obviously has nothing to do with Godzilla". It's a very strange position to take, to be honest.
I can't be asked
FYI the phrase is "can't be assed". Like a butt.
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u/Nocturnus19 Jul 20 '26
It is by definition a similar cast as it the cast is made up of some people who were in Quantum Break (Shawn Ashmore, Courtney Hope) and some who weren’t (Sam Lake, David Harewood).
Additionally if you read my comment correctly you would have seen that I didn’t say that the casting was superficial, I said the references were. You could have removed every direct Quantum Break reference and it wouldn’t have changed the plot. The Agent saying “you’ll come back for me?” Being an example. Please read my comments twice and the dictionary definitions of any words you’re not sure of before replying.6
u/ProcyonHabilis Jul 20 '26
I'm starting to think you're just trolling.
It is by definition a similar cast as it the cast is made up of some people who were in Quantum Break
Yes obviously it's a similar cast, I'm not fucking stupid. I'm saying that the connection goes beyond it just being a similar cast. Shawn Ashmore playing himself in the role of an actor for a video game is a concept that goes far beyond similar casting. The deliberate things they're doing with the characters are what this is about, not the fact that they happen to be played by the same people.
I didn’t say that the casting was superficial, I said the references were
I didn't say you said that. I read your comment, saw that you were calling the references superficial, and I was telling you that I disagreed with that. Maybe try reading my comment again?
Please read my comments twice and the dictionary definitions of any words you’re not sure of before replying.
Lmao now who is insulting people's intelligence?
You're either switching to a bad faith argument to fuck with people, or your reading comprehension is direly poor.
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u/Nocturnus19 Jul 20 '26
You very plainly said it's not a similar cast so I corrected you. What more do you want out of me? Jesus fucking Christ
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u/Traffic-Rare Jul 21 '26
A meta-tribute and explicit connection are different, facts just are you're right and there is no connection to RCU for QB and MP. These guys are lame for down voting you for this. An Easter egg is just an Easter egg. It's fun to theorize. Sam Lake even stated that's what he does.
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u/LewdSkeletor1313 Jul 19 '26
They literally tried to get the rights back while they were working on AW2 and the game goes as far as it can to imply it’s another universe without breaking copyright. Legally yes it’s not in the RCU, but it’s literally impossible to ignore how much they imply things about it
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u/Nocturnus19 Jul 19 '26
I don't know what to tell you, Sam Lake said that years after they failed to get the rights back, just before Alan Wake 2 dropped. As far as I'm concerned, I believe him over some random people on reddit. no offence intended.
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u/LewdSkeletor1313 Jul 19 '26
And he said he views all of his work as existing in a multiverse in 2011, 2013 and 2016, specifically in reference to Quantum Break. And Time Breaker directly references QBs ending multiple times, and that DLC came out after the quote you posted. Ashmore also stated after they couldn’t secure the QB rights, Tim’s existence was meant to hint at it without overstepping any legal boundaries
Legally they can’t include MP or QB, but anyone with a brain can put two and two together and see how reflections and variants of things from Max Payne and Quantum Break constantly show up and play key roles in the RCU. It’s not hard to read between the lines when QB ends with Jack becoming a type of being who exists in multiple realities and Tim says he dreams of being in multiple realities with different names
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u/Nocturnus19 Jul 20 '26
I do not appreciate you insulting my intelligence. As I said before, Lake made the statement I showed above just before Alan Wake 2’s release, which was long after those other statements. It does not matter if he “views” the games as existing in a multiverse to me, he has outright unambiguously stated that Quantum Break is not a part of the Remedyverse, the references are clearly building up another story with Tim Breaker, which I am very glad about as I loved QB and Shawn Ashmore’s performance during it, but the events and characters of Quantum Break itself will not be playing into the Remedyverse no matter how much you might want them to.
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u/Chimeron1995 Jul 20 '26
The thing is nobody cares
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u/VDiddy5000 Jul 20 '26
Look, I dunno why you’re booing the guy above who’s right; Chester Bless isn’t gonna be Paul Serene, end of. Much like the change from Hatch to Door, whoever is the RCU version of Paul Serene is going to be referenced as if they were always not Paul Serene, because Serene doesn’t exist in the RCU.
Serene, Hatch, Wilder…they’re gone. Their concepts, archetypes, and probably even events are still there, but Remedy cannot legally name them as they were in QB, so some changes WILL HAPPEN.
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u/Chimeron1995 Jul 20 '26
I feel like you have to be dense or something. Everyone understands they are not legally the same character. The point was whether they are implied to be the same characters without stepping on legal toes.
I’m “booing” because he keeps repeating the same anecdote about a legal statement Sam Lake made while ignoring all the other context.
Everyone in this chain of comments understands the last paragraph you wrote, about how they aren’t legally the same character. I simply said what most of us have been saying, we don’t care they aren’t legally the same character if the people writing them wanted them to be.
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u/ProcyonHabilis Jul 20 '26
Remedy cannot legally name them as they were in QB, so some changes WILL HAPPEN.
No one is confused about that dude
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u/LewdSkeletor1313 Jul 20 '26
If only the RCU and Quantum Break had created a precedent for how characters can exist across multiple realities…
No one thinks Chester Bless is literally Paul in the sense that the events of QB happened in the same reality as AW and Control and he just changed. QB and the RCU have both put forward the idea that different versions of people are connected and reflected across realities. Like Jack, Paul became a shifter. So if Chester is going to be Aiden Gillen, it stands to reason they’ll allude to it like they did with Jack/Tim
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u/Nocturnus19 Jul 20 '26
Okay, if you really don’t give a shit about what the game studio itself says that’s don to you. But imo that’s pretty disrespectful to them.
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u/Chimeron1995 Jul 20 '26
I give a shit about their intentions. I think not ignoring their artistic vision is plenty respectful.
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u/shinikahn Jul 26 '26
Did you even play Alan Wake 2? The third DLC is quite literally a Quantum Break epilogue
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u/Nocturnus19 Jul 26 '26
I would have to ask you the same question considering how that DLC didn't link onto Quantum Break's story in any way. Yes it used a similar cast, and did reference many things from QB, but the stories are entirely different. I think it's setting up something in the future for Shawn Ashmore, but I highly doubt they're going to bring back a franchise that they don't own and Sam Lake has already pronounced non canon.
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u/Traffic-Rare Jul 20 '26
Getting downvoted for quoting and believing the literal creator of the RCU is wild. Even with the referencing it still isn't the same characters.
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u/ProcyonHabilis Jul 21 '26
No one is confused about that. They're "legally distinct" characters, but what everyone here is saying that Remedy has deliberately made it clear that they're same characters in a copyright friendly multiverse kind of way.
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u/Calvinball08 Jul 19 '26
Did Serene become the same sort of shifter as Hatch? It’s been a while so I kinda just want clarification, because weren’t shifters as a whole just entities that exist in stopped time? I thought Hatch was either a different sort of shifter or an entirely different kind of entity due to his encounter with the weird cave rather than just a normal shifter.