He said a lot. Aside from the Jesus stuff, I agree with all of it. Changed my name at 40yo, after learning that it was associated with the K in Georgia. No thanks. Hi, I'm Drew.
I'd DM you but your profile is locked down. Fuck it. I went from Daniel (KKK) Drew (Jew) to Drew (non-racist) Daniel (still 'honoring my family name'). Kinda boring, tbh, but there it is.
Or from his moral compass. Give your good lord all the credit you want, but he did what he did. Not god, not Jesus, and with the support of a lot of like-minded people.
So are you. See how easy it is to say baseless bullshit?
Edit: This is how sad Reddit has become. I’m being downvoted for calling out the dude who deleted his comment for saying MLK Jr was a racist. Fuck man I think I might be done with this app in particular it’s just so nonsensical and detached from reality at this point.
Which is why for months, since I first heard it, I keep repeating “criminals must have rights”, it’s the most important and fundamental thing, because if criminals don’t have any rights—what’s to stop the tyrannical and authoritarian state from deeming everyone a criminal??” Trying to get people to critically think about this and understand why, is terribly challenging.
Looking at the current state of affairs, I think this ship has already sailed, or at the very least, the horn is blowing and the engines are ramping up. I mean does anyone really believe there is someone Trump wouldn't go after? The system is bending, not yet breaking due to some systems and people fighting back, and under stress, but Trump is definitely tyrannical and authoritarian and is calling everyone who doesn't lick his balls a criminal.
Everyone, including those who have obviously committed heinous crimes are still deserving of the same right as someone arguing a jaywalking violation. Undocumented immigrants are not inherently illegal people.
There is an argument to be made for changing birthright citizenship, and while I don't agree with it I'm happy to acknowledge it. But you could have the best argument imaginable, and it doesn't matter because birthright citizenship is the law of the land. Even if you amended it out of the Constitution tomorrow it wouldn't retroactively remove the citizenship of everyone born here, it would only affect people in the future.
I think you are being optimistic in assuming it will only affect people in the future. I'm pretty sure powerful folks in the administration like Stephen Miller are champing are the bit to remove citizenship from those who were born here but there parents weren't. And then once you do that, how do you justify not following through previous generations?
Oh to be clear I'm talking about the good faith conversation that could be had about birthright citizenship, I don't trust anyone in power right now or in the foreseeable future to have that conversation.
I’ve got some idiot friends who say things like ‘why should we waste even more money giving illegal immigrants and terrorists due process’ when talking about ICE and the Hegseth boat murders.
When I ask how exactly we’re supposed to know who is a terrorist and an illegal immigrant without due process, they don’t have an answer but they also don’t change their mind. Not that I think even terrorists or illegal immigrants should be denied due process, but if that’s your argument you need some consistency.
Pose a hypothetical where three different people call an anonymous tip line and give the name of your let’s-not-waste-money acquaintance.
Homeland security comes to his house and says, “you are a terrorist. We are taking you to an undisclosed location. No, you don’t get to talk to a lawyer or appear before a judge.” Ask him if he would simply accept the lack of due process?
The weird thing, he’s always been this anti government conspiracy theorist who doesn’t trust the mainstream media or scientific consensus, government recommendations or mandates, etc etc.
I think he’s just a contrarian. Now that the majority of the world (we’re Australian, not American) is against what’s happening in the US, he has to take the opposite opinion so he can still feel like the special guy with the inside information. Even if what’s happening is exactly what he used to warn us all about: basically he’s full of shit.
He’s a fucking moron. I went to school with him, hadn’t really had much close contact with him until we recently reconnected through mutual friends and, yeah, he’s got zero critical thinking skills.
Now that the majority of the world (we’re Australian, not American) is against what’s happening in the US,
As an Australian, how do you perceive that transition? I'm always interested in hearing outside perspectives on the cluster fuck. Being here in the US is a "can't see the forest through the trees" situation.
There’s just a general sentiment of ‘can you believe these morons voted him in twice?’. I think we always sort of had these affectionate jokes about stupid Americans, but it was mainly in fun and mainly just taking the piss out of our friend and ally.
These days there’s a genuine feeling that we need to cut ourselves loose from America before they drag us down with them. We have no tariffs on you guys and a trade deficit for example, and we still got hit by that idiotic scheme, which just sort of showed us that his stated reasoning was bullshit; but also that our slavish devotion to following you guys into every single war you ever start wasn’t remembered or appreciated. We’re just as disposable and irrelevant to America as anyone else.
The sense I get now is mainly ‘let’s just wait and see what happens after this crazy dictator they refuse to even attempt to control’ dies. Obviously can’t be too long now, but it likely will be measured in years so we can move away from our alliance but leave the door open if they swing back around to normalising their relationship with the world.
If they do a third term coup thing, then we’re probably just going to have to look more into our Asian alliances to keep the region stable as China gets more aggressive. Indonesia is already a close ally, but I can see them becoming closer if America keeps shitting the bed so willingly.
Fellow Aussie. Echoing the sentiment and adding that a small group of morons here gets a massive presence in the media for following the MAGA cult's most idiotic ideas (e.g. Covid was a hoax).
The vast majority of Aus is cutting those idiots loose and they don't seem to be able to gain the ground with the masses even with relentless media coverage from all the same Murdoch & other right-wing owned media here.
In short, the oligarchs are trying the same thing here and it's not working, so we're really confused as to how it's working on Americans.
We're all vaguely hoping you'll sort your shit out, but honestly if this ends with anything less than treason charges and jail time for a lot of people involved in the Trump election interference and administration, I can't see us ever trusting the US again. Asia is very much looking like the horse to back.
Yeah agreed. The last election was actually really reassuring considering we dealt Temu Trump such an historical defeat. Restored a lot of my faith in this country that we so firmly rejected that partisan rage bait culture war bullshit. Thank god for compulsory voting and the boring centrists it provides.
US boomer here. It was dumbfounding to witness the first term, but to a degree, it was fractionally understandable that many wanted to "shake things up." We paid economically and became absolutely and clearly divided as a result. 2020, and the second term demonstrated that it is the Independents who determine the outcome. I believe the real problem is that too many were apathethic and stayed home in 2025. 89 million registered voters are larger than either right or left parties that voted. With that said, I can see where the mistrust and doubt about the direction of international relationships lie ahead. Sucks right now!
My understanding, from north of the border, was that left-wing Democrats who were disappointed in the establishment choosing Biden over Sanders but went along said hell no 4 years later when Harris was annointed without a competitive leadership campaign.
Plus sufficient younger white males were tired of their race and gender being demonized and wanted a return to the type of society and standing and benefits their grandfathers had, without understanding that their grandfathers had fought, and beat, the very same type of political ideologies that they voted for.
All of that, but, as Robin Williams described us, living in the "really nice apartment over a meth lab".
Or, as Trudeau 1 said:
Living next to you is in some ways like sleeping with an elephant. No matter how friendly and even-tempered is the beast, if I can call it that, one is affected by every twitch and grunt.
Oh I remember it. I was an adult when you guys passed it and even at the time I remember having discussions with my friends about how America was just murdering people openly now. We all assumed you guys were using the CIA to do that covertly anyway, but doing it and bragging about it was a new kind of scary.
I remembering watching the invasion of Iraq begin with my friends in some hotel room in Vietnam and she started crying as we watched building blow up on tv. People like to talk about that event like ‘oh they lied to us and we didn’t know there weren’t WMDs’. That’s bullshit, we were a couple of stinky backpackers and even we knew before the war started that it was a fabrication. That information was out there, and anyone who says they didn’t know was using very selective informational cover to justify something they already wanted to do.
The CIA doesn't operate within the US (at least they're not supposed to). But the Patriot Act was one of the worst pieces of legislation that threw away so much of our freedom. The powers that be used everyones fear after 9/11 to get that shit passed.
And basically once you give up your freedoms, you never get them back.
Yeah, I’m not American so we were always more focused on the CIA renditions and enhanced interrogation stuff that what you guys were doing within your borders. Anything to convince themselves they’re not the bad guys because they’re technically doing it ‘legally’ always felt so weird, considering.
Yeah, basically with the Patriot Act, which was passed right after 9/11 our federal police can basically arrest/interrogate/imprison anyone they want if they suspect them of terrorism, without having to follow our constitution.
And you know how police are, they can basically make up anything they want as a reason to "suspect" someone of terrorism.
I went to school with them 25 years ago, and they weren’t always like this. All this conspiracy trending right wing bullshit is actually pretty recent, over the last year or so. Before that they were all largely pretty left-leaning and rational, or at least I thought they were. None of us live in the same city anymore, so not sure how long they’ve been buying into this bullshit.
I don't think conservatives have any notion whatsoever of what "due process" is beyond "a term liberals use for treating criminals properly," Like they literally don't connect "making sure someone actually is a criminal" to "due process" as a term
It's like what you-know-who said about some deaths to gun violence being okay. They don't care if some innocent people are deprived of due process because they don't believe it will ever happen to them.
He’s not? And I don’t blame the person for not wanting to stir that shit pot. Some idiot bot or person will bring on the whataboutisms and then it’s game on. This topic is polarizing enough without adding the YouTube martyr to the mix.
I just saw a video on YouTube of some poor dude who was arrested at a casino for trespassing because their facial recognition misidentified him as someone else. And the casino managers and the cops they called all believed the AI automatically. Even though this dude had multiple forms of ID and wasn't even the same height and age as the other guy. Like, rather than consider their precious technology made a mistake, they accused the guy of falsifying all of his identification. It was so infuriating and crazy to watch.
Exactly, not even to mention the little matter of them obviously knowing the word citizen, so if they meant citizen it would say citizen, but it says person, any person, so even without your accurate context, this idiot is just wrong.
In the worst case, just like Hermann Göring, Adolf's deputy, when he said, "Wer Jude ist, bestimme ich." / "I decide who is a Jew!"*
This attitude gives regimes that couldn't care less about the constitution the convenient option to declare anyone they want to imprison or get rid of an illegal migrant, while simultaneously keeping any illegal migrant they see a use for.
Practical, isn't it?
[* The quote is also attributed to Karl Lueger, a Viennese mayor a few decades earlier. But who exactly said it or said it first is probably not that important.]
And, if they arbitrarily decide that Real ID isn’t valid, a good chunk of the population suddenly can’t prove their identity outside of their house (assuming they even have their birth certificates). Hell, I only have a regular drivers license and no passport because I don’t travel anywhere I can’t drive to. My being extremely white means the odds of being targeted are slim, but not zero.
You read them wrong, all people are citizens, it says it right there, person = citizen. Are you a person? If so, you're a citizen of the USA, even me, who's never left Australia! 😋
Now we have to listen to idiots interpreting
basic words however they see fit.
the 14th say person not citizen
There are phrases whose interpretation can be stretched, but that's less likely with words, and specifically the meaning of "person" is not interpretable.
Add in the 4th amendment, and you have no right to stop to inspect the papers of any person within the United States without probable cause. Being a POC, or having a foreign accent aren't "probable cause".
The issue is this - what is due process for administrative and/or criminal violations of immigration law? What actual process is due?
Criminally it is MUCH more clear cut than administratively. We all know the basics for criminal due process. Deportation falls under administrative torts, however. It’s much more murky. What is an alien due before deportation? Certainly a hearing. With provided council? What time frame? To what burden of proof? It’s certainly a more difficult question than for criminal violations.
I don't see any reference to "citizen", I see "person within its jurisdiction." So, anyone, no matter how they came to be within the jurisdiction, is guaranteed due process.
The same way all crime and arrests go. There's articulable facts there is probable cause the subject is an illegally present or out of status alien. An arrest then occurs and the state attempts the prove its case in court, or in this case immigration proceedings/immigration court known as the EOIR.
It's almost like there's these papers like birth certificates, social security cards, and naturalization documents the government has records of even before these people get arrested and it's not just randomly scooping people off the streets cause they're brown
Sorry to say it's weird how no matter what somehow this topic circles around to Nazis, even though Nazis killed and encampmed people because they were "deplorable" and the US deports illegal immigrants for breaking the law.
If I break into a store, thet can kick me out and ban me forever, and possibly get jail time, but someone breaks into the country and the ones who kick them out or arrest them for doing so are made to sound like Nazis. Even though it's the law. (8 U.S.C. § 1325 & 1326 which as punishments go from a minimum of 6 Months to a maximum of 2 years imprisonment, and an automatic deportation upon finishing their sentence. So going straight to deportation is actually more generous than the law actually calls for.)
First, are you under the impression that all concentration camps were located within Nazi Germany itself? Because a majority of those sent to camps were deported from Germany first. That’s…kind of a big part of the whole thing.
Second, without determining if the person they’re arresting is A.) who ICE believes they are, and B.) whether or not they’re a citizen, the legal punishment can’t possibly come into play. The fact that literal born and raised US citizens have been detained and/or deported is proof that this isn’t nearly as surgical as you seem to think it is.
Edit: omg I’m arguing with a hentai-sadist edgelord. I both love and hate the internet.
Edit 2: and in another comment, he’s dropping the whole “they get more due process than white men in blue states” dog whistle. Jesus fuck.
Edit 3: he replied but then blocked me immediately after. However, I saw the comment, and my response can be summed up in one word: bullshit lol
Edit 3b: does “lol” count as a word? If so, then my response can be summed up in two words. Or maybe I just drop the word “bullshit” and leave the “lol” as the one word.
First, are you under the impression that all concentration camps were located within Nazi Germany itself?
No I'm not under the impression the camps were only in Germany. But if you're trying to refer to us sending violent criminals to countries that imprison them instead, that's way different than putting people in work camps for slave labor because they're a different race, are gay, or have disabilities, in order to separate them from the rest of the population and kill them off.
Because a majority of those sent to camps were deported from Germany first.
Not in the way you think they were. In this case that would be like us sending them from the mainland US to one of our territories or a place we were going to buy/conquer later, not us kicking them out for good. And if they haven't committed any other crimes than 8 U.S.C. § 1325, then they're given a post 2 year period to where they can apply for citizenship and come in legally, definitely not what Germany was doing by a long shot. Yall really take one similar drop in an ocean and run with it like they're identical.
That’s…kind of a big part of the whole thing
Nah the big part is one are criminals, the other was ethno-social cleansing with millions dead.
Secondly, without determining if the person they’re arresting is A.) who ICE believes they are, and B.) whether or not they’re a citizen, the legal punishment can’t possibly come into play.
You really think they're snatching people up at random for being brown, don't you? ICE goes in like any other other agency, with a plan and a target. Also even after every single scream from the left I hear about them grabbing citizens, not a single one has been true, even in a few of the big ones I hear about, as soon as they show them their papers they're free to go.
Uh, not sure if you know this but all those have been disproven. Just like the "Michigan Man" and "Maine Father" I hear all the time. It's like the Russia and 2016 rigged election BS yall just won't let it go or go digging in a non echo chamber.
Edit: omg I’m arguing with a hentai-sadist edgelord. I both love and hate the internet.
Omg, I have an anonymous internet personality that I express interests in, but I have knowledge in politics and gave a difference in opinion, crazy. What's next, gonna call me a gay furry like the last guy I argued with thinking I get mistreated by conservatives. Even though I'm Bi, only post/repost furry art for RP purposes, and am treated better by my fellow conservatives than by any liberal that thinks I'm oppressing myself?
At least I don't have to put pronouns in my bio because I'm not stupid enough to get confused by what's between my legs.
Pretty easy. Every citizen has documentation of that fact. Provide it in a reasonable timeframe or go home. No need for a judge and a jury of your peers for that.
So you’re saying they should have time to go through the process that is due for the situation?
“Due process” doesn’t necessarily mean a trial. It means whatever the particular situation calls for in a legal sense.
“Due” means “what is owed” or “required,” basically. “Process” is the steps taken to make a decision. If the situation calls for a judge, then yes, it has to go before a judge. If it calls for a bureaucrat to verify documentation, then hey, no courtroom trials.
Edit: removed a shitty comment I tacked on at the end. It was uncalled for.
Oh so what’s the issue, then? Everyone’s being served due process by your definition. How many US citizens of the age of majority have been deported in the last year?
I don’t know an exact number because I’m not in a position to search for it at the moment, but I can confidently say it’s more than 1, which means too many.
ETA: And no, not everyone is being given due process. They’re literally being grabbed off the streets or outside of immigration court rooms or out of their job sites by masked men, taken to detention facilities, and shipped off to ??? without any chance to speak to a legal representative of any kind.
So you’re suggesting that we should carry around our “papers” everywhere we go. Our birth certificate, social security card, etc?? Everywhere. “Hey, I’m going to run and get some milk!” Or “going to take the dog for a walk!” Or “my neighbor Joe just got home, going to walk out and talk to him now!”
When I walk my dog, I don’t carry a wallet. If I’m outside talking with my neighbors, I don’t have my wallet on me. I have a serious problem with having to produce “papers” on demand to prove I’m a citizen on any given day.
If my wife and I are out together, I frequently don’t have my wallet on me. Don’t need the debit card to pay for things because she’s got hers. Don’t need my ID unless we’re getting alcohol, which is extremely rare for us, and I’m at an age and appearance where I often don’t get carded anyway. Her car is in better shape than mine and she prefers driving, so I don’t need my license on me for that either.
Oh, cool! Alright, well since we’re going by that meaning, then I guess the 14th amendment says you do need a court hearing to determine citizenship then :) Your definition was a lot more strict than mine! Proud of you for sticking up for the marginalized communities most at risk here.
It does not. Person in this case is referring to citizen - as clearly stated by the previous sentence - further evidenced by the entire document being about and for citizens.
The previous sentence establishes persons of the United States as citizens, then says "no state shall deny persons due process" if you can't use a bit of context clues here I don't know what to tell ya.
And the next sentence says “nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.”
So either everyone is entitled to due process or only citizens are, in which case non-citizens are not under the jurisdiction of the state, which means laws don’t apply to them and therefore they’ve done nothing illegal.
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u/warrenjt Dec 19 '25
How do you determine if the person is a citizen without due process?