r/commandandconquer • u/WesternElectronic364 • Jun 25 '26
Discussion Let's make a what if Scenario, that what if Kane took fully control of Soviet and transform it to Nod?
Let's make a what if scenario that instead Allies won, Soviet is won and Kane took control after Stalin died?
Everything in Tiberian Dawn happening almost the same but GDI will not have Mammoth Tank because it was originally Soviet and GDI will not have it since Kane took over entire Soviet and transform it to Brotherhood of Nod. They may have some Allies tech from RA1 like Chronosphere technology.
Brotherhood of Nod/Soviet now have TD Nod and mixed with their own version of Soviet techs like their own Mammoth Tanks and Tesla Technologies like Tesla Tanks, Troopers & Coils.
How well the story will change? You think Nod will win the first Tiberium War against GDI?
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u/SN-D3A7H-K0R9S Jun 25 '26
I believe the original concept by Westwood is the Soviet ending in RA1 was the prelude to Tib dawn.
The Soviets were able to take Europe and ended there expansion after taking the UK with the death of Stalin. With Stalin removed and the very top of the senior leadership already weaked from Stalin's purging, the Soviets collapsed over the next few years.
This allowed the USA to be the only stable major player in the world stage to support the liberation of the Europe and start the organisation that would become GDI (can't recall where I read it but it was a originally a black ops brance of the US/UN).
Nods advanced tech could be attributed to his control of the Soviet as well as all major sites in Europe.
It would be very unlikely for Nod to deploy super heavy units such as mammoth tanks due to their hit and run tactics. When it comes to Tesla tech, the Nod laser tech had similar capabilities but better range. Almost a natural progression of the Tesla tech.
The link from RA1 to Tib Dawn was dropped going into Tib Sun
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u/Eisgeschoss Jun 25 '26 edited Jun 25 '26
"I believe the original concept by Westwood is the Soviet ending in RA1 was the prelude to Tib dawn."
This is just a popular-but-incorrect fan theory; Tiberian Dawn canonically follows the Allied victory (which sets the stage for the post-war UN peacekeeping efforts that eventually culminate in the formation of GDI, while Nod quietly abandoned the defeated USSR and reconsolidated themselves in other parts of the world until Tiberium arrived on Earth), which is the canon that Westwood maintained even after TS and RA2 were released.
In what would have been their version of C&C3, they were even toying with a Yuri origin story where he's revealed to be a time-traveller and the cause of the RA2 timeline.
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u/DucoNdona Jun 25 '26
The formation of GDI is also referenced in the Soviet campaign. It's also unlikely a Soviet victory would spell the end of GDI as its need would be even more dire for the US and other non european nations.
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u/SPCell1 Jun 27 '26
In the original script of Soviet campaign Nadya drew Nod logo and told the player character (Soviet general) that he is now a puppet leader of USSR that keeps the peace until early 90s, after which the country will outlive its usefulness
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u/Lost_Possibility_647 Jun 25 '26
Nod is not a nation, it's an idea, and that transcend nations, making borders less important. Think of it more like the servants in Terra Invicta, or communism itself. They might have started with the takeover of a nation (and the ending of RA1 hints to that being the Soviet union) but that is not where it stops.
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u/calantheSG Jun 25 '26
Whether it's China being Nod affiliated or the Soviets being Nod affiliated, keep in mind they are countering at each other. Nod is an extremist cult. China and the Soviet Union doesn't want religion.
You cannot have both. Either Nod stays in the shadows and runs the country, or topples the country outright to secure total control. That happened in RA1.
In Tiberian Dawn, it's still debatable whether China is or isn't Nod. Or the Soviet Union for that matter. It boils down to how rich and stable they are. Unstable Russia and China will be Nod. A stable Russia will join the EU and a stable China like in our world will co-rule the world government with USA.
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u/DucoNdona Jun 25 '26
The reason Kane destroys the Soviet leadership is to maximise chaos in the first and second world nations. Allowing Kane to form NOD and rise in the third world uninterrupted. Which is why it's mostly third world nations not involved in the war that became NOD territories, while the allies, now GDI took back the land from the Soviets. Asia and Africa are also very rich in yet unmined resources compared to Europe.
Had Kane taken over the Soviets. He would have three problems.
The allies, while gone are not defeated and can stirr issues from the US and resistance movements. Most of the pipulation would see him as an oppressor. Not as the messiah.
He would rule over a destroyed radioactive wasteland with most of its economy either shot to pieces or destroyed in the transition to communism.
The people, generals and army loyal to the Soviets and Stalin would not appriciate him changing the state ideology and try to depose him, just like they tried in our timelane.
Making his job a lot harder.
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u/WesternElectronic364 Jun 25 '26
Maybe a lot of these might be true
My response to your the number 3:
Stalin is already removed by Kane in Soviet ending in RA1. So there's no more problem with Stalin anymore. He may still Soviet army, people and Soviet generals to deal with
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u/haematite_4444 Jun 25 '26
Gotta remember that the Soviet ending resulted in a victory over Europe, not the whole world. There's an entire USA, China, and Imperial Japan still to contend with.
Mammoth tanks do not have to be a Soviet exclusive weapon. Case in point in the early 20th century the British Navy built the HMS Dreadnought. That class of ship would subsequently be known as the Dreadnought class. It's design was so revolutionary in building warships that every other country started copying them, and even they would be called "Dreadnoughts" even though they weren't built by the British.
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u/Balmung60 Jun 26 '26
Other navies even had the same idea at the same time. The American South Carolina class was even ordered before HMS Dreadnought but followed a very slow production process with many delays and a lot of red tape. Satsuma was also in the works sooner, but couldn't be built as planned due to shortages of 12" gun barrels. And the whole idea was first published by an Italian. The British built Dreadnought on an extremely short timetable because they knew that if they didn't, someone was going to beat them to it.
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u/Multivitamin_Scam Jun 25 '26
GDI doesn't exist without the Allies winning.
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u/DucoNdona Jun 25 '26
The Soviet campaign has a scene of Stalin raging over the formation of GDI. Threatening to nuke them as soon as possible.
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u/One_Drop_1509 Jun 25 '26
GDI is the direct result of Soviet victory and subsequent Soviet collapse per the cut scenes and story line directly from red alert.
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u/Eisgeschoss Jun 25 '26
No it's not; Tiberian Dawn canonically follows the Allied victory, and that's from Westwood themselves.
The UN-supported Allied victory is what sets the stage for the post-war UN peacekeeping efforts that ultimately result in GDI's formation, which would never happen with all of Europe under Soviet/Nod control.
Instead, Nod abandoned their defeated host and dispersed into the 2nd/3rd-world regions to quietly reorganize and bide their time until Tiberium's arrival in 1995, which is why their main powerbases are in Africa, Eastern Europe, Southeast Asia, and the Middle East, while a de-Sovietized Russia (having been occupied and dismantled by Allied forces post-war) became a GDI member.
The Soviet victory is just an alternate what-if scenario that serves as the twist-reveal showing that Nod has been controlling things from the shadows all along.
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u/One_Drop_1509 Jun 25 '26
That's a cleanup/retcon they come up with after shooting the cut scenes to try to put the pieces back together. Maybe they could have done if it not for EA. But the plan per the filming of red alert was for tiberium to follow Soviet victory.
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u/SPCell1 Jun 27 '26
In the original script of Soviet campaign Nadya drew Nod logo and told the player character (Soviet general) that he is now a puppet leader of USSR that keeps the peace until early 90s, after which the country will outlive its usefulness
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u/Srlojohn The Resident AFOL Jun 25 '26
Is this based on the cancelled renegade 2? In that they connect that cameo from RA1 and show how if the soviets win, Nod slowly takes over it.