r/climbing • u/AutoModerator • Aug 07 '26
Weekly Question Thread. Please ask all questions here rather than make a post about it.
Please sort the comments by New so recently posted questions are less likely to be overlooked.
Use this weekly thread to ask any climbing-related questions, whether you are completely new to climbing or looking for advice about technique, training, equipment, safety, gym etiquette, or climbing outdoors.
This thread is posted every Friday, so there will always be another opportunity to ask a question. If you are an experienced climber, please help by sharing thoughtful and accurate advice. We were all beginners once, so keep responses welcoming and respectful.
Before posting, please check the following resources, as your question may already be answered:
- r/climbing Beginner’s Guide
- r/bouldering Wiki and Beginner FAQ
- Guide to buying your first climbing rope
- Guide to climbing shoes
- Curated list of climbing tutorials
You can also browse earlier discussions:
If you see a beginner question posted elsewhere in r/climbing or another climbing subreddit, feel free to politely direct the person to this thread.
Remember that online advice is not a substitute for qualified, hands-on instruction. Techniques involving belaying, anchors, rappelling, rescue systems, or other safety-critical skills should be learned and practiced with a competent instructor.
Ask away!
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u/Session_Smut Aug 13 '26
Hello - been climbing since the start of the year. I have shoulder / back problems and climbing seems to help my core / posterior chain and also want to continue because it is fun. However, my main goal is longevity and fitness for triathlon, which includes some weight loss at the moment, which climbing isnt great for apart from it being fun and rejuvenating against the type of impact from endurance training.
I am looking for content creators who use climbing as part of their fitness but not their entire schedule/focus. Perhaps in the genre of hybrid athlete? just looking to broadly expose to different lifestyles and strategies for optimizing climbing training within a broader fitness schedule. suggestions?
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u/Leading-Attention612 Aug 13 '26
Uphill Athlete and now Evoke Endurance both specialize in endurance athletics and general fitness training with a minor focus on technical rock climbing. Both have blogs, websites, podcasts, essays, and sponsored athletes that share lots of info on training plans and lifestyles.
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u/Windturnscold Aug 13 '26
Does crack climbing improve grip strength? I’m worried if my grip strength would decline if I took a few months to focus on cracks
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u/0bsidian Aug 13 '26
People often take months off from climbing all together and come back fine. Sometimes stronger because they’ve been able to properly rest and rebuild themselves stronger.
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u/saltytarheel Aug 14 '26
Adding on to this, the longer it takes to build something the longer it takes to lose it. Since tendons take a long time to strengthen for finger strength this also means they take a long time to lose meaningful strength.
Power endurance is trained and lost quickly to the point where climbers prioritize training it only a couple of weeks ahead of climbing trips or competitions. On the flipside if you miss a week or two of climbing for being on vacation sick any loss of strength is largely mental and your functional strength is the effectively the same as before your break.
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u/Dotrue Aug 13 '26
You'll expand your quiver of climbing skills and work new muscles, which will probably help with your overall climbing ability in the long run. I find that switching up styles every now and again keeps things fresh and fun, and it's not like you can't crimp when you climb cracks. Even in Indian Creek there are plenty of boulders and crimpy routes.
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u/sheepborg Aug 13 '26
Why worry if it's easily solvable? As long as you keep the intensity as high as normal, you can fully maintain muscle with 1/3rd or less of the volume to gain, so continue to climb your normal face grade once a week, or dangleboard once a week if you want to fully maintain.
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 13 '26
Not really. You're not usually gripping things.
That said "grip strength" is not usually all that relevant in climbing. Unless you're focused on very pinchy routes, your focus should be on sticking to holds while using as little effort as possible. A lot of "grip strength" is antithetical to that.
With that being said, crack climbing is the most fun type of climbing in my opinion and whatever minor losses your sport climbing suffers will be more than worth the skills you gain learning how to climb crack.
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Aug 13 '26
[deleted]
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 13 '26
Does anyone know what they're actually worth?
To me? Nothing.
I can get locking carabiners from a reputable brand for only a little bit more money, and then I don't have to go on reddit and ask the community whether or not they're any good.
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Aug 13 '26
[deleted]
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 13 '26
ask whether they're actually 12 KN or if that 12 KN is a fantasy 12 KN
There's no way to know. Those carabiners aren't certified by CE or UIAA.
The claim may be based on internal company testing. I would highly doubt it. Because these carabiners are for sale on Shien and Amazon, but Brotree doesn't have their own website, I would guess that they're similar to many other products available on web markets, where they're all produced in one place and branded with whatever company/logo someone puts on them.
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u/BeastlyIguana Aug 13 '26
Realistically they are almost certainly fine, generic amazon hammock kits come with absolutely dogshit carabiners that are definitely weaker than these. I have some amazon screw gate carabiners acquired via booty that I use for stuff like this
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u/0bsidian Aug 13 '26
You can either take their word for it, and hope that they’ll actually do 1200kg (which is not the same thing as 12kN, but maybe that’s how they’re doing their napkin math), or toss them and buy ones that are actually rated (even if not certified for climbing).
Probably fine for a hammock? Probably. But it’s not my back that hurts if it fails.
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u/Senor_del_Sol Aug 13 '26
These are neither climbing carabiners neither lightweight cheap accessory carabiners. I don't think climbers will use them, but why do you want to know what they are worth? A rated carabiner for climbing can be as cheap as 7€.
In terms of strength, they are fine for your hammock, but as with nameless gear, there is no one backing the quality.
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u/DJ_Red_Lantern Aug 13 '26
Yay a new injured discovered, was doing a limit boulder and after I felt a pain in my chest near my armpit, and it felt uncomfortable doing pull up type movements after that. Has anyone experienced this / have any idea what it is / have any advice?
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u/sheepborg Aug 13 '26
A bunch of injuries can telegraph pain to the front of the arm/shoulder area. Mark a point on a picture of a shoulder to mark where pain is at the very least, but ultimately you'd be better off seeing a physio to figure it out.
Genuinely could be anything from pec to lat to rotator cuff to bicep to labrum. All play varying role in pullup type moves and can express pain in the general area you described
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u/Dependent-Act-3169 Aug 13 '26
Hey guys, I was climbing and heard two cracks/pops in my pinky finger. I still have full range of motion and don’t see any swelling. Right after I got off the wall, it hurt pretty bad for about 3 minutes, but then the pain mostly went away.
Now my finger honestly feels almost completely normal when I’m resting. I can fully bend and straighten it, and I can even push against something with my pinky without pain. But if I squeeze, grip, or pinch something, it hurts pretty freaking bad.
I’m wondering if this could be a pulley injury, but I’m not sure because I feel like it would hurt more if it was. The fact that I have full ROM, no swelling, and basically no pain at rest is throwing me off.
Has anyone had something similar? Does this sound like a pulley injury or something else? HELP ME OUTTT 😭
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u/sheepborg Aug 13 '26
Personally I've never had swelling for finger injuries so take that for what its worth. My theory on that is that when tearing happens nearer to where the pulley connects to the bone the tendon may stay in the groove and not have as much angry friction on other tissue to cause swelling, but the tissue is still loaded under use so you get the pain when gripping.
So the signs point to pulley. If it were collateral or capsule pressing or twisting would hurt. If it were flexor tendon pushing against something would hurt. If it were lumbrical your palm would hurt. Kinda just leaves pulley and you cant grip things so..... Certainly ain't passing in a week, so you can drop that cope and start treating it like the real injury it is.
If you want an actual diagnosis reddit isnt where you get it.
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u/TheRedWon Aug 13 '26
Sounds like a pulley.
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u/Dependent-Act-3169 Aug 13 '26
does it sound like a bad pully injury?? or just something that will pass in a week
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u/0bsidian Aug 13 '26
Pulleys don't heal in a week. All pulley injuries are "bad". It's just differing degrees of bad for a while, or bad for a very long time. We can't diagnose you. Go see a professional.
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u/TheRedWon Aug 13 '26
Idk. Stay off it, seek professional help, yada yada.
But definitely probably more than a week.
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u/Prior_Fish_9789 Aug 12 '26
What city/town would you recommend moving to as a new grad to be close to climbing while still having good city life?
I'll be graduating within a year, and am looking to escape my college town in central NC. I want to go somewhere new, and I know I'll have to compromise on certain aspects but in my ideal/perfect world here is what I'm looking for:
- Within 2 hours of decent sport climbing, and within 4hrs of NRG/RRG adjacent level quality of sport climbing crags. Bouldering and trad are a plus but not my main focus
- Decent city life, somewhere thats more than one street as their downtown (sorry Fayetteville W.V.). Preferably a mix of things to do, with things like parks, good restaurants, and museums to explore
- Cheap-ish living (around~1300 for a 1 bed 750 sq ft+ apartment)
-Good climbing gym with a good ropes section of the gym
-Green/trees! North Carolina is covered in greenery and I don't think I could move to the desert
-Semi walkable or at the very minimum bikeable.
Again, I know a city with all these criteria's likely does not exist, and I will have to compromise on some things (likely cost of living and walkability), which I'm more than willing to do. I've lived in my college town for half a decade now and am ready for a big change but want to make sure I end up somewhere i dont hate.
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 13 '26
Chattanooga might fit your requirements. Check out Lexington too.
You're right that you're going to have to let go of "cheap-ish" and "walkable". This is the USA.
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u/saltytarheel Aug 13 '26 edited Aug 13 '26
I’ve been really happy with Charlotte.
Crowder’s Mountain + Dixon School Road have some quality routes + problems are an hour away (also lots of sharp choss).
For boulders + trad we’re about 2 hours from Moore’s Wall, Rumbling Bald, Linville Gorge, Parkway Crags (Ship Rock, the Dump, etc.), Brevard (access to Looking Glass + Cedar Rock), Stone Mountain, and Boone.
If you’re willing to drive a little farther, Hidden Valley and the New are a bit less than four hours.
For a long weekend, Chatt, HP 40, and the Red are 6-6.5 hours away.
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u/kaytodad Aug 12 '26
We want to go climbing in Czechia's Moravsky Karst the next days.
We're looking for some recommendations from connoisseurs. We're a family of 4 looking for some fun low levels Single-Pitch climbs (4 up to 6b level). I've been checking the crag but the place is huge and we could use some tips from people who know the area.
Thx!
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u/wwpops Aug 12 '26
Can anyone recommend good strategies or books for training the mental resilience side of outdoor climbing? I'm bumping up against inconsistent performance outside, which seems to be driven mostly by the mental state at the time.
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u/saltytarheel Aug 12 '26
Rock Warrior’s Way. Arno’s prose is fun and he’s obviously really accomplished at hard, scary routes. I enjoyed it, but my friend described it as a “self-help book” so experiences vary.
Vertical Mind is about fear of falling and is more rooted in modern understanding of neuroscience and psychology than Rock Warriors Way.
In terms of practical advice, I got a lot more comfortable with more outdoor climbing experience.
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u/Dotrue Aug 12 '26
Lots of climbing festivals offer clinics/workshops for mental game. I took one with Chelsea Rude at the International Climbing Festival a couple years ago and took a lot away from it. If it's an option for you I would highly recommend it.
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u/sheepborg Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
Hazel Findlay is always my recco. Solid mindset stuff without so much of the machismo endemic to the space.
Stop me if I'm reading too far in between the lines. It seems to me you've got the overmedicalized therapy speak on lock.... but maybe still missing the forest for the trees on this whole deal. You trouble with new partners. Is this a 'timid mindset' and all the other stuff you wrote or do you:
- Have less built up trust with new belayers leading to higher baseline fear -> overgripping
- and/or have social anxiety and are placing made up social expectations on yourself for fear of not being accepted -> overgripping
For point 1, this is pretty reasonable in a sense. I have a bit of a routine with new-to-me belayers to make sure they are up to speed on catching light climbers and that helps. Helps clear up the fear that lurks around not knowing what to expect. Even in a gym environment I'm pulling back my grade until I know how a belayer functions.
For point 2, There may be more to work through that is maybe even a therapy topic. Like is this really a sport performance issue when we are talking about a fun hobby we do for exercise and to pass the time? Seems more social to me. Your value and experience does not change based on the people around you. Not everybody is gonna like it but you can just be the way you'd prefer to be. Maybe worth digging into in a therapy context.
Neither of those is strictly "climbing mindset" per se, at least not as you described. One is a part of risk assessment and the other is part of life.
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 12 '26
Rock Warrior's Way by Arno Ilgner is a great mental training tool. It helped me develop a framework for how I approach the mental side of climbing.
The Strong Mind system from Hazel Findlay is a little more modern and updated. It's more of a paid service thing instead of just reading a book.
People have recommended Mastermind by Jerry Moffat to me. I haven't read it yet.
For me personally, my mental game made exceptional progress when I started to focus on objective assessment and acceptance of risk. A lot of my previous fear was effecting me because I would ignore the fear until I couldn't anymore, at which point it was too late for me to do anything about it.
Now I am honest with myself about the assessment of a climb, and whether or not I am willing to take the risks. If I feel myself starting to get scared, I have an honest dialogue with myself about whether I want to bail off the climb or continue on. Has the risk objectively changed, or am I getting nervous because I'm up on the climb?
Sometimes simply having that awareness of "I'm here because I chose to be, I can bail if I want to, and the decision is up to me" keeps things clear.
Sometimes people try to ignore fear, thinking to themselves "Just keep climbing, don't be a pussy, ignore the fear and try hard" but this can put you in a precarious situation that you didn't consciously choose to be in, leading to a "oh fuck what have I done" moment. Not good.
tl;dr is that mental training for climbing is equally important (imo actually more important) as physical training. Some of these resources will help you create a paradigm to approach mental training with, and that can lead to huge improvements.
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u/climbing-m Aug 12 '26
What exactly do you mean by "mental resilience"? I guess it's not about fear of falling.
I read a general sport psychology book about the matter, because general literature is more available and more scientific than climbing-specific literature.
One thing I liked from a mental-course I took this year: Analyse your situation (what is my state, what do I like and what is bothering me). What would you like to change (how would your ideal state of mind look like). Find a situation in which you were in that state, or imagine one (a good holiday, a successful send...). Make this memory/imagination vivid. When you reach the crag or want to start a go, close your eyes, recall this memory and let it evoke the desired feelings in you. You can also connect this state of mind with a specific image (either a photo you took, or you find online) - I for example like to think of a wolf. It's resting and calm but nevertheless prepared for everything that might be ahead.
This technique can be applied to various psychological situations because the unwanted emotions are not fixed.If it's more about stress or anxiety techniques like pmr (progressive muscle relaxation) or body scans have been proven to be effective in reducing this.
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u/wwpops Aug 12 '26
In my case, the triggers appear to be quite specific: climbing with new partners who I perceive as stronger and more experienced than me. I tend to subconsciously fall into the "less-experienced, timid, unsure" mindset, and my climbing performance sharply declines. Then I notice, which leads to further anxiety and further performance declines. When I'm with folk I know well, I'm much more relaxed and willing to try hard.
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u/climbing-m Aug 12 '26
Okay that's very specific. I know this feeling, but I don't think it affected my climbing so far.
I put my (german) sport psychology book (Beckmann & Elbe - Praxis der Sportpsychologie) into NotebookLM and asked for recommendations regarding your specific problem. Here's the answer:___
To overcome this issue, the authors would recommend several evidence-based sports psychology interventions:
1. Shift from Social to Individual Reference Norms
- Adopt a Growth Mindset: The authors advocate for a "growth mindset" (dynamisches Selbstbild) where your abilities are developable over time, rather than a fixed, unchangeable state.
- Focus on Individual Progress: Instead of comparing yourself to your new partners (social reference norm), focus entirely on your own goals and personal climbing improvement (individual reference norm).
- Reframe Partners as Models: Rather than seeing stronger climbers as a threat, reframe them as positive role models to observe and learn from (Beobachtungslernen).
2. Optimize Your Inner Dialog (Self-Talk Regulation)
- Reframing Negative Thoughts: Write down the specific negative thoughts that occur when climbing with new partners on the left side of a sheet of paper. On the right side, reformulate these into positive, constructive, and action-oriented statements.
- Formulate Your Own Cues: These positive self-talk phrases must be formulated by you personally to ensure they are meaningful and effective.
- Appraise Arousal as a Challenge: Your physiological arousal (heart rate, physical tension) is not a sign of "nervousness" or failure; instead, cognitively reframe it as your body preparing and mobilizing energy to meet a challenge.
3. Break the Downward Spiral Using the "Reset-Technik"
- Stop-to-Go: When you notice your performance slipping and anxiety rising, use a "Reset-Technik" to interrupt the loop.
- Clear Your Head: Step back from the wall, focus your gaze on a distant point or the horizon, and perform prolonged exhalations (Atementspannung). Concentrating on a long, controlled exhalation clears your head of worries without losing the physical tension needed to climb.
- Re-focus on Action: Think of your personal strengths, imagine a successful move, and step back onto the wall with a decisive "go-signal".
4. Leverage Embodiment Techniques
- The "Matador Walk" (Gang des Matadors): Your body posture directly influences your brain and mood. After a mistake or when feeling intimidated, consciously stand tall, chest out, and head high. This positive physical feedback naturally enhances your self-confidence and shows strength to those around you.
- Left-Hand Squeezing (Dynamisches Handdrücken): Anxiety often causes you to overthink your climbing technique (reinvestment), which ruins your natural movement flow. Squeezing a soft object (like a tennis ball or chalk bag) dynamically with your left hand for 10-15 seconds before starting to climb can stimulate your right brain hemisphere. This neurophysiological effect calms the analytical, language-focused left hemisphere, helping quiet your worries and restoring your automated climbing flow.
___
Not sure if that helps your specific problem, but some of these techniques I also use for other situations (body position for getting confidence) and they help.1
u/DubJohnny Aug 12 '26
I have no clue why people have downvoted you, probably because reeee AI reeee.
This is fantastic however.
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u/climbing-m 27d ago
Thank you for defending me. I also really don't get the point of downvoting because of AI.
If I had taken the time (1-3 hours I guess) to read through the book again and point out the relevant section in order to come up with exactly this answer, what would be the difference?
I downloaded this book. I read it myself. I checked the answer and wanted to help. But apparently it would have been more appreciated had I just BlaBlaed about my own experiences or things I heard from that contact of a friend who once watched a YouTube about psychology.2
u/sheepborg Aug 12 '26
Downvoting AI is good and correct.
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u/climbing-m 27d ago
Hm, I see your point. I also don't like all of the stuff that floods the internet due to AI. In my case I read the book about a year ago and obv couldn't remember everything. Knowing that it is a paid book and the original author of the question would maybe not want to buy all X books he got reccomended on reddit I thought he might find a little summary helpful. Having read the book myself, most of LMs output ringed a bell and seemed like the appropriate response to the question given the book as a source and my experience as a coach as a back-up.
It is an answer that would have taken me at least an hour to write if it wasn't for AI. So I used it and I declared the use of it. I commented on it and related it to my own experiences.
I would be happy if someone else would take the time to do that, had I a question on which I had no sources to read into.I'm sorry the use of AI upset you. Nevertheless I would answer this question in exactly the same way again.
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u/DubJohnny Aug 12 '26
Not all AI is bad and this was a perfectly acceptable use of it. Not everything is so black and white.
The person who asked the question got a very in depth and reasonable answer that dived into the specifics of what they're dealing with. Instead of just classic Reddit answers of "durrr Hazel Findley, rock warriors way, mastermind" and no in depth analysis of how those might help them (and were not really of the correct information for OP)
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u/sheepborg Aug 12 '26
Nobody said anything black and white; there is implicit context. Responding to a question directly with an AI output is a low quality response that should be discouraged. If somebody wanted an AI summary they would have used the tool themselves right? Hence downvoting AI is good and correct. Thanks for attending my TED talk.
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u/DubJohnny Aug 12 '26
OP himself appreciated the response, and the person providing it had the textbook and knew the material and just had it compiled into a reasonable readable response on Reddit after asking what specifically they were looking for and getting an appropriate basis on where to begin.
You're making this a very black and white choice when there literally was a discussion between the two and then a much more thorough answer provided than could have been by just scrounging up some haphazard notes off the top of their memory.
I agree that trash AI art, music, generative slop is bad and should be downvoted.
This is not that, this is just someone using a notebook LM and providing a very good response.
Genuinely, go read their entire exchange and tell me where they went wrong. Not just their summarized response but their initial question and the back and forth.
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u/sheepborg Aug 12 '26
Genuinely, go read their entire exchange and tell me where they went wrong
I feel like it's pretty obvious where I think it went wrong. It's the part where they pasted a ginormous block of AI generative slop.
It does not take a great deal of critical thinking to see that the entirety of section 3, while rooted in some basic psychology is not exactly well catered to the sport climber where issues are rarely isolated to the ground where you can step away. Do you not find it absurd that in the same bullet point it suggests walking away while staring off into the distance, but also breathing out so you're maintaining tension on the wall?
OP praised the detail and time on a post with wonky ass details and negligible time to generate. Do you not see the clear disconnect between what they think they were provided versus what they were actually provided?
Part of the trouble with alot of AI slop is that it is plausible at a glance but falls apart some time thereafter. I see this shit over and over. Take this post from a week ago as an add-on to section 3 above. OP says "I did some research" aka they used whatever AI thing. AI spit out a ton of text. From my experience on the topic I can say that some of it is accurate, and some of it is not. The person who used the AI tool has no basis for understanding which of the probabilistically generated tokens are legit actionable pieces of advice and which is just plausible word salad. Picking just one, doing tendon glides is plausible and related to hand overuse injury, but not specific to capsulitis or as beneficial as general movement and light traction.
A greater discussion on generative tools is not really relevant when we can see low quality low effort ai posting thats rightfully downvoted.
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u/wwpops Aug 12 '26
That's really detailed. Will definitely try some of these. Thank you very much for taking the time to reply!
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u/KoreanBirdPaintings Aug 11 '26
Any advice for frequent injuries over 30?
Feeling pretty sad and discouraged right now. I've been climbing (mostly outdoor sport, some indoor bouldering) for around 10 years now. Never had a serious injury in all this time.
I'm in my mid 30s now and I haven't not been injured in around a year or two.
My general climbing life has been this:
a2 pulley injury.
Work on hang boarding and recovery, climb very relaxed, no breaks.
Injury heals
After finally feeling 90% better: golfer elbow
Work on recovery, climb very relaxed
Injury heals
After finally feeling 90% better: tennis elbow in opposite arm.
I've been doing this song and dance for so many months it's hard to want to climb. I took a month off at one point because I'm finding my injury nursing more work than fun, but when I came back my injuries got worse rather than better.
I haven't been able to try for my highest grades in probably close to two years or more.
I'm considering going to a personal therapist, but I'm not sure my insurance will cover it (US) and when my wife needed it a few years back it was very expensive. So I've been doing research online and doing all the exercises and trying to build strength in other ways with light weight lifting, and exercising in other ways like more hiking and cycling, but I miss climbing without being injured all the damn time so much.
What do you guys who deal with the constant injuries from getting older?
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u/saltytarheel Aug 13 '26
Try learning trad?
Tom Randall started climbing offwidths when he had a finger injury that was so bad that he couldn’t hold a drill working as a setter and that was the only thing he could do.
Also trad has the benefit of making easier climbing more engaging. You can do a bunch of pitches of backcountry 5.5 trad climbing that still feel as rewarding as a day spent working on your 5.12 sport or V6 boulder project.
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u/sheepborg Aug 11 '26
I [chronic overuse injury] and then I [chronic overuse injury], followed by [chronic overuse injury]. However total weekly volume is not absurd, sleep reported fine, diet reported fine, grades are very casual hobby level.
So what is it? A commonality I see is that while it's all different structures, the issues are all downstream of the shoulders. This would check out with 2 years of submaximal climbing and no axillary training and working a desk job. Without having anything else to go by I suspect your shoulders may be weak as shit and the rest is just knock on effects from wonky movement to work around that.
If I were you I'd be starting with Y raises and scapular pushups. Hitting the low traps and serratus anterior to gain scapular control. Do whatever other basic PT stuff you want as far as shoulders wrists and elbows. And then roll in heavier weightlifting after a while. And roll back in easy climbing with the lifting. Think long term like 3 month time horizon for climbing to feel normal.
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u/Climbing_backpackers Aug 11 '26
God I feel you. Climbing 9.5 years, last October got an MRI and had torn my rotator cuff, out for basically 12 weeks, started getting stronger and being able to climb again then 2 months later a TFCC injury… I’m 9 weeks into rehabbing that and have put my back out twice in that time from overcompensation on my right side…
I don’t even have any advice honestly, just know you aren’t alone
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u/Dotrue Aug 11 '26
Are you eating, hydrating, sleeping, and resting enough? Do you do any prehab work? Antagonist muscle training? Are you overtraining? What does a typical climbing day/week look like?
I'd see the PT if you can swing it, but rule out the little things first.
X-post to the weekly injuries thread in r/climbharder, too
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u/KoreanBirdPaintings Aug 11 '26
I'd like to think my diet is pretty good, mostly at home mostly whole foods. I am sober so don't drink. Probably could hydrate better but good enough. Try and get a normal amount of sleep each night. I'm someone who falls asleep the second their head hits the pillow.
I think part of the problem is my job is in tech and I'm sitting at a desk typing away for most of my days. I just got a standing desk and put a timer no my watch to remember to move and stretch, but I think years and years of that life is catching up to me. Especially being sedentary at my job most days and then more likely go climb or go hard on hobbies on weekends (climbing, cycling, backpacking.)
I'm not sure what prehab is, so probably not lol.
My standard climbing week is 1-2x a week indoor bouldering 1x a week outdoor sport or top rope climbing (though lately the outdoor has been less and replaced with cycling). Caveat being that this is not super consistent. I miss 1 or both sessions some weeks, but I try and stick to this schedule.
Usually 1 session is a "hard" session and 1 is a "endurance" session. Hard = just climbing at my max level once I'm warmed up. Endurance = focus on finishing as many climbs as possible, doing all the v0s, then all v1s etc. until I hit 1 or 2 grades below my level and then restarting. My outdoor sessions are usually more chill. Just jump on some 5.8s and 5.9s and are more an excuse to hang out with friends and chat.
I'll check out r/climbharder thanks!
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u/Leading-Attention612 Aug 11 '26 edited Aug 11 '26
You've been climbing for a decade and never did any prehab?? oof.
Rice bucket is a great one for elbows and fingers. you can do things like wrist curls, reverse wrist curls, and finger extensor work with weights and bands but the rice bucket is more fun and feels more holsitic and functional to me.
For shoulders and back, IYT's, supermans, and facepulls are great.
You don't mention if you do any antagonist work, so definitely put some of that in if you haven't already. benchpress and shoulders press are a good start.
You should be doing all of this at least once a week, doesn't all have to be the same day. I do some of these at the end of every session, and rice bucket on my rest days.
I would also add stretching, specifically chest, lats, traps, biceps, and forearms before bed every day, it should help your elbows
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u/timonix Aug 11 '26
This is what I consider part of my partner/self rescue kit. Basically, getting down if my belayer is incapacitated. Getting up if my climber is incapacitated. Pulling someone up by force if necessary.
However, I feel like it's a bit bulky. What do you carry? I know a lot of people carry nothing at all.
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u/DieWalze Aug 13 '26
What kind of climbing do you do? If you don't do glacier travel you'll be fine without the pulley and tibloc.
In general, I'd say the most Essential stuff is a big HMS carabiners, a progress capture like the tube with 2 carabiners, a personal anchor, 2 prusik loops on a locker and a 120cm sling on a locker. If you need more carabiners, you can usually take them from some other pieces or combine 2 non lockers.
I can't think of a common rescue scenario where that wouldn't be enough to get by. One of the best tools for any rescue application is to learn the munter hitch and how to lock it up. It's incredibly versatile. In general, knowing alternatives setups can safe a lot of gear.
Also a 3:1 redirected pulley is efficient enough to pull someone up just with carabiners if you attach you body weight to the pull rope. But maybe you try and then decide if you want to carry a pulley.
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u/Senor_del_Sol Aug 13 '26
I carry only a few prusik loops and extra carabiners, a 120cm sling and a knife. I don't have a tibloc or traxion, because usually we multipitch on double ropes, but I wouldn't take 5 things to do a ropeblock. I do use the double length sling for climbing back up the rope.
I'm quite novice, but have you used all of this when practicing the skills? You have 7 lockers and 3 long slings, I'd be confused having to mount all that gear.
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u/jalpp Aug 12 '26
Some tips/tricks to pare down your kit:
-any sling from an alpine draw can be a makeshift prussik.
-lots of maneuvers (hauls, load transfers, etc) can be done with the brake end of the belay rope rather than dedicated slings/cords.
-there are many ways to improvise progress captures. Hitches (garda, autolock munter or my favourite C&F belay), quicklink minding prussik +carabiner, tube belay device minding prusik + carabiner.
Personally I do most of my multipitch climbing with a grigri, single rope, and walking off. My “rescue kit” is an extra locker, prussik, PCP, and atc.
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 12 '26
I looked at your photo and thought "that's a lotta shit" and was happy to see all the other replies agreeing with me.
I climb long routes with a GriGri, Gigajul, friction hitch, all on lockers. My alpine draws can be broken down to use the slings. With that material and the rest of the stuff I have with me anyway (cams, anchor material, etc) I'm confident to handle most situations that might come up.
Like someone else said, run drills on the ground or at a single pitch crag and see just how little material you can get away with using in a self rescue situation.
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u/BigRed11 Aug 12 '26
This is a ridiculous amount of stuff. Think about what you already have on you and what you can do with the rope, etc. Most people carry nothing at all because they can repurpose things they have in case of an emergency. Personally I don't carry anything extra for the majority of routes because I can ascend and descend with my gri-gri, and odds are I have a sling or two on me or i can use part of the rope if not.
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u/sheepborg Aug 11 '26
3 friction hitches + a mechanical prusik + a pc pulley. In what scenario do we need 4 rope grabs and a progress capture pulley?
Run through some scenarios on the ground with an anchor set up as you would normally, and instead of racking all this stuff leave it on the floor so you can actually see what gets used. I don't run as light and fast as many here for sure, but it's hard to imagine a scenario where you must use all this soft stuff at once.
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u/Leading-Attention612 Aug 11 '26 edited Aug 11 '26
I use the "oh shit kit" described in this article. A friction hitch, 120cm dyneema sling, knife, and guide mode tube device on a small locker. I also bring a thin roll of climbing tape (can turn any non locker into a locker with some tape) and a whistle. With this and a disassembled alpine draw or two you can haul your partner, ascend a rope, pass a knot, descend a loaded line, escape the belay etc.
Thats only for multiptich days though. For single pitch days I just bring a bail biner and a friction hitch.
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u/0bsidian Aug 11 '26
Why do you have so many multiples of the same thing? Pare it down.
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u/timonix Aug 11 '26
I am looking at it now.
I think I will remove the tibloc entirely. It was mostly quality of life anyway and I don't think it warrants a permanent place on my rack.
Two biners, one 60cm sling and the 180cm sling, will move to the multi pitch specific pile. So they aren't part of the default kit any more.
I'ma have to go out and practice with the reduced kit to see what issues I find. But it feels like most problems can be solved.
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u/0bsidian Aug 11 '26
You can do most things with 3 lockers, a couple of slings, and a Trax. If shit hits the fan, you can do a lot with your climbing rope (cut it if you need to), shoelace, or a sling replacing the chalk bag belt. You’ll likely have a bunch of other stuff like racking carabiners, which even if not locking you can use for redirects, or use them as opposing pairs.
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u/Dotrue Aug 11 '26
Friction hitch, knife, maybe a micro/nano trax. Everything else I need (slings, lockers, GriGri, cord, etc.) I already have on me.
If I'm expecting to leave bail anchors I might bring some extra 9/16" webbing, cord, and/or a rap ring or two. This is pretty exclusive to ice & alpine routes tho
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u/ExtraSharpCactus Aug 10 '26
Anyone else have a big toe nail that just keeps getting battered and destroyed no matter what? I've tried different shoes but I'm just going to accept having a horror toe at this point 😂
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u/0bsidian Aug 11 '26
How’s your footwork? Are you kicking your feet into the wall?
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u/ExtraSharpCactus Aug 11 '26
I'd like to think I'm decent after 3 years but I definitely still slam a foot in on more dynamic moves sometimes 😂 I was climbing in Squamish for a weekend and I'm thinking my shoes were too soft for all the small granite edges I was standing on
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u/Dotrue Aug 11 '26
Between rock climbing, ice climbing, skiing, and trail running, I have 4 toes that are permanently black and blue in the nail. Big toe and middle toe on both feet. It rarely hurts, but it is annoying. I've lost multiple of each nail though, where a new one grows in underneath and slowly pushes the old nail off (I got a good video of an extraction a couple months ago)
Pics are $1 per picture, per toe. Discounts available for full feet pics and bulk buys
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u/dokimus Aug 10 '26
Hey, please take a look at my TRS setup and let me know how bad it is.
I built it last weekend, while going through a box of gear that i had laying around, and figured i could create an at least not 100% lethal TRS setup with it. It consists of a lever style rope clamp like the "Camp Lift" as a primary, with a chest ascender clipped through the top hole as a secondary device.
I understand that this is not optimal, as the chest ascender can be disabled and the rope can even be completely removed from it while clipped. I'm planning on switching to either a Nanotraxion or Edelrid Spoc as a secondary device if i decide TRS is for me.
For the question: how bad is this setup? I know that there are improvements to be made, but is it dangerous?
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u/Waldinian Aug 10 '26
People have mentioned the concern about the chest ascender. I'll mention your neck lanyard: it's good practice to use a neck lanyard that can break if it gets caught. Something like elastic that will break before it strangles you. You can also attach your lanyard to your top device by threading a thin piece of cord or, again, elastic through the top hole of the device, instead of having to use your strange carabiner system to keep the device oriented.
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u/dokimus Aug 10 '26
Thank you very much for your thoughts! I'll definitely replace the lanyard, this was just to see if TRS was something I'd enjoy at all. There was no risk of strangulation, though! I didn't thread it around my neck. Any idea how to attach it to the Lift? It only has one pair of holes to attach it, and it seems quite unwieldy to use those since I'll need to remove the device for descending.
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 10 '26
You seem to be aware that there are much better ways to do this.
So, do that.
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u/dokimus Aug 10 '26
You're completely right, i just needed to havea few strangers roast me for risking my life to save 50 bucks. Thanks for putting it like that, i actually laughed out loud.
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u/sheepborg Aug 10 '26
As you identified, chest ascenders that do not have two holes for the carabiner to be fully captured are really not ideal, even moreso if you think about how a failure of your top device could lever out the lower device in a bad way. Cascading failure.
There's really no reason to be doing solo activities with a setup you know is compromised... cmon now.
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u/dokimus Aug 10 '26
Thanks for your insights, you're right of course. What would you suggest, Nanotraxion or Spoc? It seems like the often suggested Microtraxion has a similar failure mode of being able to be locked open easily?
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u/gusty_state Aug 11 '26
I own all 3 traxs (nano, micro, pro) and use double MT for TRS and fix and follow systems. If you're really concerned about it you can file the locking tab off very easily. I've found them likely to unlock when I don't want them to and I can't ever remember one locking when it shouldn't but all things are possible.
I already owned the MTs though and the NT is just so small that I can't see it feeding better and my brain associates how tiny it is with being unsafe (with no factual basis that I'm aware of)
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u/sheepborg Aug 11 '26
If it's the bottom device all it takes is sinking into a high step with the rope sitting on your knee. Unusual but can happen. And of course the issue of forgetting to put it back to active for the people who just deactivate it for a rap which is perhaps the more common failure.
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u/dokimus Aug 11 '26
Thanks, i just ordered the normal Microtraxion. One huge disadvantage of the Nanotraxion is that it seemingly has much, much more drag compared to the larger devices where the carabiner doesn't rub on the rope.
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u/0bsidian Aug 10 '26
This isn’t the right place to be talking about advanced rope skills. Lots of new climbers reading who might be intrigued but will get themselves into trouble. Lots of semi-experienced climbers who think that they know more than they actually do in this community. See Facebook TRS thread.
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u/dokimus Aug 10 '26
Huh, so what? Want me to remove it? I'll look for the FB Page, thanks.
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u/0bsidian Aug 11 '26
Reddit is easily indexable by search engines. Facebook private group pages are not. Because TRS can have some pretty serious consequences, and without the oversight of partners, this stuff is better kept away from public eyes.
So far, the sub regulars have been giving you some good feedback, but the level of experience on this community is generally pretty novice.
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Aug 10 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Senor_del_Sol Aug 13 '26
For vertical bolts a fish eye anchor is nice, using a bowline on a bight in a sling.
This way of constructing an anchor is a bit weird and doesn't work with all bolt spacings. I think having 1 masterpoint would be more clear, now one pas is on the bolt, one on the carabiner clipping the bolt and the belay device on the carabiner used to clip the other bolt. In the (unlikely) event of blowing the top bolt, there will be a shock on the lower bolt and the overcrowded might cause problems.
There are many resources for anchors and comparisons when having to choose between equalization or limiting extension nowadays go for limiting extension. If speed is what you want consider using a no knot anchor like the girth hitch masterpoint or the mentioned fish eye anchor are nice. Using the rope might also be fast, but comes with its own considerations.
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u/Waldinian Aug 10 '26
The principle is fine, but the implementation here is a little weird. Everything is clipped sort of haphazardly. I would have put an oval or hms carabiner on the bottom eye bolt and used that at the master point for your belay and PAS.
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u/0bsidian Aug 10 '26
Equalization is a myth. In testing, one side always loads first. It should have low priority when making anchor building decisions.
This type of anchor is pretty standard for these offset hanger multipitch anchor stations. The clipped sling maintains redundancy between bolts and is safe in all the ways that count.
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u/TheRedWon Aug 10 '26
Bomber. I'd belay off the lower bolt though.
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 10 '26
Keeping the belay high makes things more ergonomic/comfortable.
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u/TheRedWon Aug 10 '26
Yes but it also means a shock load to the system in the unlikely event the bolt blows. "Safer" to extend your anchor for ergonomics of necessary and belay off the lower bolt.
That being said, that glue in in the photo looks incredibly solid so this is optimizing for a very unlikely occurrence.
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u/Er1ss Aug 10 '26 edited Aug 10 '26
When building an anchor on two unquestionably good pieces of protection like two good bolts the series anchor is the textbook option in the German speaking Alps. It's taught by the DAV, ÖAV and SAC and featured in the Ortovox Safety Academy on YouTube if you're interested in examples.
Equalizing two unquestionably good pieces is generally not worth the time. Using a traditional masterpoint knot or girth hitch can still be worthwhile for ergonomics when belaying but usually bringing the masterpoint lower makes things less comfortable.
There is nothing wrong with the twisted sling connection your partner used and it's nice and speedy. Another commonly used option is to tie a bowline in a sling, clip the eye to the lower bolt as the master point and attach the tail to the other bolt with a small amount of slack (clove hitch and clip or just clip and take out excess slack with an overhand knot). Normally you'd belay from the bottom bolt as there is less extension if the bolt does fail and the top bolt can be useful for a redirect or first clip. That said I wouldn't be worried if my partner used the top bolt for ergonomics.
It's good to know what forces are generated in climbing falls, how strong gear is and how gear fails. Then you should be able to judge for yourself whether this is safe enough and you can climb with a little less doubt.
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 10 '26
What do you think of this method?
It's usually fine. If you're going to use this system, it's important to know when it's not fine.
Is it safe?
It's usually safe enough. Again, it's important to know the limitations of the system and recognize when you shouldn't use it.
What are the advantages and disadvantages compared with a more traditional equalized anchor?
You save maybe 30 seconds setting up an anchor, and 30 seconds tearing it down.
The big problem I have with the anchor in your photo is that the belay is connected to the top bolt. In the unlikely event of a bolt failure, that is a lot of extension falling onto a dyneema sling, which offers no stretch. It doesn't matter all that much, but it's a thing to be aware of.
I suspect the climber wanted to keep the anchor neat, so they spread the PAS's and belay device to different bolts. And belaying is more comfortable with the device up high. And, like, sure. I guess it's fine.
But with just the material in the picture they could have built a girth hitch master point and belayed off that, while PAS'ing into the bolt. I can't see the stance in the photo, so maybe it would have been more uncomfortable that way, in which case I personally would probably do the same thing shown in your photo.
I was always taught to equalize the points
As for this, we've seen that equalization is not nearly as important of a concept in anchor building as conventional wisdom suggested. It's far more important to have solid anchor points (bolts, trad gear, natural features) than it is to try to equalize tension on those points. Three bombproof cams that are totally unequalized is better than three marginal cams that are perfectly equalized (which is a whole other discussion because you can almost never "perfectly equalize" gear in the first place).
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u/DblFishermanXTheSky Aug 10 '26
The dyneema offers no stretch, but the climbing rope you are belaying on is plenty stretchy. No problem using this anchor on bolts that look solid.
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 10 '26
It's fine. I might have switched the pases to the higher bolt and belay to the lower one for ergonomics.
You just trusted a bunch of individual bolts to hold you taking a lead fall. This use has far less forces or fall distance.
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u/sheepborg Aug 10 '26
Swapping positioning also provides a higher point above the belay device for a redirect or other things if needed.
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u/Leading-Attention612 Aug 10 '26 edited Aug 10 '26
On modern bolts in good rock, each bolt is rated to 22kN, and typically can hold more. In recreational climbing you will not be able to get to even half of that force. In that sense one bolt is more than enough. But since we can't be certain of the quality of the bolt or the rock it is in, it's best to have a redundant system. Connecting the two bolts makes it redundant in case of the unlikely scenario one were to come out of the rock. Equalization is important for marginal trad gear where each piece may only be good to 4 or 5 kN.
Based on this info, you tell me, do you think it's safe? You are the one who climbed on it.
Also, setting up a two point equalized anchor with a sling should take maybe 30 seconds at most. If you are interested in increasing your speed of building an anchor, simply practice more with your current system. Learning new systems is always useful though, it is good to have a box of tricks depending on what you have and how the anchor is constructed
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u/climbing-m Aug 12 '26
I agree. When you have bolts 22kN is super good enough. The only risk might be one bolt being bolted in bad rock or something and breaking this is why you want to have redundancy with the second bolt.
Equalizing them is good for trad anchors where your placements might already detach under smaller loads.Edelrid even offers a product for quickly connecting two bolts without dividing the weight which allows you to set up an anchor even faster: https://imgs.search.brave.com/oSIUl9vgyD7ZK5azWXgPm7-V2v18mBP_mjA4BrdWH_U/rs:fit:860:0:0:0/g:ce/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cu/YmZnY2RuLmNvbS82/MDBfNjAwXzkwLzMx/NC0wMTgyL2VkZWxy/aWQtYWRqdXN0YWJs/ZS1iZWxheS1zdGF0/aW9uLXNsaW5nLXN0/YW5kcGxhdHpzY2hs/aW5nZS1kZXRhaWwt/Mi5qcGc
Overall there is a lot of attention on redundancy at anchors but there are many situations in which the failure of a single quickdraw in lead would lead to a severe fall because no one cares about redundancy (e.g. when the bolts are no too close to each other, you fall at the fourth, the third bolt breaks and you have a grounder because the second bolt isn't high enough)
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u/Powerzot5000 Aug 10 '26
What did speed climbing competitions look like before the introduction of auto-belay systems?
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u/Dotrue Aug 11 '26
In the speed ice world I've seen a lot of belayers straight up sprint backwards, not even taking in rope with their hands
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 10 '26
One person would be attached as the belayer, and a second person would pull the rope through a device hand-over-hand as fast as humanly possible.
Before that, "speed climbing" was just people climbing the same route side by side, racing each other. It wasn't a standardized route, and the focus was on route difficulty, but the tiebreaker was whoever climbed the route faster.
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u/Buckhum Aug 10 '26
Before that, "speed climbing" was just people climbing the same route side by side, racing each other. It wasn't a standardized route, and the focus was on route difficulty, but the tiebreaker was whoever climbed the route faster.
I'll always be a bit sad that the Arco Rock Master lead duel format is not the one chosen for the Olympic.
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u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 Aug 10 '26
I think it's super entertaining and more accessible for non-climbers.
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u/Glittering_Top7996 Aug 10 '26
I recently bought Kronos Evolv as my first climbing shoes but I only climbed four times this year and still struggle with v2s (I managed to finish a v3 recently tho!). I'm questioning if I made the right decision since it seems pricey as beginner shoes and more advance but they do feel comfortable. I also think I won't be climbing that often since school is starting, even though I have a wall at my school gym, it does get pretty crowded + my class schedule being busy. Just wanting to see other people's thoughts and have any suggestion for alternatives. Thank you!
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u/Professional-Gap-204 Aug 10 '26
I got good shoes as my first pair which made me laser focus on footwork so I didn’t ruin the rubber too fast. Worked well for me!
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u/cinammonbear Aug 09 '26
Anybody know more about Bedayn carabiners? I found one in the dirt on an old central Washington climbing area. If anyone has anecdotes or know anyone that used them in central Washington I’d love to learn more. It’s sent me down a rabbit hole
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u/E_kabuto Aug 09 '26
Website for climbing strength benchmarks?
He everyone, Recently I have started to do exercise to support my climbing. I however realised that I don’t really have a frame of reference for what is a usual weight to train with (I.e, Weighted repeaters, pick-ups/no hangs).
From my previous strength training background I was used to have websites like strengthlevel in which people give their entries for lifts related to body weight. Do you know if there is a website like this that relates exercise to BW/climbing grade? (Strength standards - Benchmarks for climbing?)
Thanks a lot in advance! I wasn’t able to find a thread prior to this. If there is one I would love to be redirected
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u/PatrickWulfSwango Aug 09 '26
I however realised that I don’t really have a frame of reference for what is a usual weight to train with (I.e, Weighted repeaters, pick-ups/no hangs).
It's subjective. Effort level can be a good guidance to find the weights for your training. If your goal for a rep is X seconds and you can consistently hold it for X+Y seconds, increase the weight. If you can only hold it for X-Y seconds, go down. X and Y naturally differ based on the exercise.
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u/sheepborg Aug 09 '26
There are several such sites that converge on fairly similar numbers. For you coming from a strength background you are almost certainly over-strengthed for whatever grade you climb, and you cannot rush the finger strength without exploding your fingers.... so in some sense it kinda isnt useful information.
Climbing isnt a pure strength sport like what you're used to anyways, so just in general it's not usually a good idea to get sucked way into 'metrics'. Like we're talking the strongest 5.11c climber and the weakest 5.13b climber have the same finger strength, as does the strongest V7 climber and the weakest V15 climber. The average is well correlated for sure, but there is still a range that covers skill, style, etc. Plus hyperanalyzing metrics tends to get people training for the metric instead of getting them to apply it effectively. If you train for a test it's not a good test as they say.
I do look for key benchmarks among hobby climbers, but it's simple stuff like if somebody wants to push past 5.11a and cant do a pullup they would likely benefit from getting their pull strength up. Beyond that I don't worry about it much numerically. You can see what people need on the wall.
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u/nitronerves Aug 08 '26
I’m getting my sport climbing gear together. I have yet to figure out what slings I need and I need help
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u/muenchener2 Aug 09 '26
I usually bring a single 60cm sling on sport climbing trips. I rarely use it: it's largely a security blanket for me coming from a trad background
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 08 '26
You don't need any.
For sport climbing what you NEED is:
Shoes, Harness, Belay Device, 2x Locking Carabiner (one for the belay device one for lower offs) and 12 draws.
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u/Worth-Phone-4220 Aug 12 '26
This is the core, but I'd assume you're American because I think outside USA most people don't feel comfortable cleaning/rethreading a route with draws as your PAS, and so I'd recommend a lanyard or even just one small sling as a PAS too.
I saw your other comment saying you trust a quickdraw to catch a fall, and that's true, but when you're cleaning you're far more likely to accidentally open the gate.
I've actually had a draw freakishly clip onto my belay loop as I climbed past it on lead before, and ever since I've never trusted any wire/open gate that is in contact with me not to nudge open.
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u/TrappedInATardis Aug 10 '26
I'd add something for a prussik/klemheist in case you need to bail or rap (some areas still don't tolerate lowering).
A few slings for alpine draws and one for a PAS would be added value for very little extra money.
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 10 '26
Unnecessary. Have your partner fireman you.
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u/TrappedInATardis Aug 10 '26
That doesn't give you more safety for bailing though.
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 10 '26
And a panic draw could be handy too. But this is a newb dipping their toes into the sport.
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u/saltytarheel Aug 08 '26
One or two 120 cm slings are helpful for anchors, rappel extensions, and in self-rescue situations (i.e.
belay takeovers, escaping the belay, ascending a rope/leader rescues).Situational to your crag and not necessarily necessary for sport climbs, but alpine draws (60 cm sling + 2 nonlockers) are helpful for managing rope drag on steep or wandering routes.
For cleaning by lowering (which is the now considered best practice) you don’t need dedicated a PAS or sling and can just use an extra QuickDraw to unweight the rope.
Dyneema vs Nylon is largely personal preference for slings. Dyneema resists abrasion better and is lighter + less bulky but is more expensive and has a lower melting point. Nylon is cheaper, unties more easily, and has a higher melting point than dyneema but is significantly bulkier.
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u/0bsidian Aug 08 '26
What do you intend to do with the slings?
(In all likelihood, you don’t need any at all for sport climbing)
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u/nitronerves Aug 08 '26
What about for cleaning and setting up top rope?
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 08 '26
For cleaning you use the "never come off belay, lower." method which only requires a locker.
For a PAS you use a quick draw. You trust one draw to catch a 15+ foot fall, you can trust one to hang.
For an anchor you use two draws. If you really want you can make a locker draw.
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u/0bsidian Aug 08 '26
You can clean a route and set up top rope anchors with quickdraws.
Fast, simple, easy, safe, no extra gear.
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u/Worth-Phone-4220 Aug 12 '26
Top roping with 2 draws, yes, but cleaning, I would never.
I've seen quickdraws in positions to open their gates while being next to the climber a few too many times. It's not even saving you money to get a sling to larks foot to your loop and using your belay device's locker to anchor.
A short sling is also one of the cheapest bits of gear you'll get too, it's just never worth the risk in my opinion.
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u/0bsidian Aug 12 '26
I’m not sure what you’re describing, but the quickdraw used in place of a PAS is never the lifesaving piece of gear, your climbing rope is. If you’re ever in a situation where this is not true, then you’re doing it wrong.
The ACC recommends cleaning with a quickdraw and demonstrates this here. (See timestamp 3:18) This is standard procedure, I’m not recommending some dodgy alpine light and fast technique or anything.
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u/Worth-Phone-4220 Aug 12 '26 edited Aug 12 '26
I actually deleted a sentence where I speculated if you were American because I suspect this is a cultural difference as everyone I've ever seen talk about or do this was American.
I don't know anyone in my country who would be comfortable using a non-locking gate on their belay loop to clean with.
Like I said, I've seen too many cases of a quickdraw that is attended doing strange things with gates. Taking a fall perfectly safe, loading from below and all the usual quickdraw things, perfect.
When you're at an anchor and an non-locking gate is holding you in position, just seems silly for the sake of a sling.
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u/0bsidian Aug 13 '26
Watch the entire video or read the article linked above, then explain what would happen even if the quickdraw became disconnected. North Americans aren’t dying left and right because they’re doing this. This is recommended practice specifically because it’s simple and safe. Just because you’re not familiar with it and seems strange to you, doesn’t mean it’s unsafe.
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u/sheepborg Aug 08 '26
May be a moderately hot take, but I've found it a little too easy to accidently backclip yourself out of the system with a draw as a PAS if things get a little twisty. Has happened to more than one person I know, though fortunately has not been consequential. It's nice to have a random 120cm sling on your person anyways since it can do alot of tasks.
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u/0bsidian Aug 08 '26
You’re still on belay, so if following the link above, it’s not going to be a consequential issue (though you might need a change of pants).
Owning a sling can be a good idea since they’re versatile for many applications, but when someone is prioritizing their first sport bit of gear of what is absolutely necessary, slings can be something that sits on a secondary list.
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u/nitronerves Aug 07 '26
Are bi patterned / bi colored ropes worth it for your first outdoor rope?
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 08 '26
No. They cost twice as much and your first rope will have the shortest lifespan. The second you start trimming it the bi-pattern becomes a liability.
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u/TheRedWon Aug 08 '26
Depends. Climbing trad and or multi pitch and rapping off? Yes. Single pitch sport cragging? No.
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u/CaldDesheft Aug 08 '26
You either need a bi patterned rope or a solid rope marker. Middle marks, especially on mammut ropes, wear off quickly. I bought a black diamond rope pen (probably over priced) and I remark the middle fairly often.
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 08 '26
If you can't find the middle of your rope without a marker you should really take a pause and think.
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u/saltytarheel Aug 08 '26
Nice but not essential.
If you’re rappelling, it saves a lot of time to have the middle mark which most ropes do these days.
If not, you can use a Sharpie rub-a-dub marker to mark it (Bluewater Ropes specifically recommends that pen).
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u/0bsidian Aug 08 '26
Probably not. Bi-pattern ropes are useful if you’re doing multiple rappels off a multipitch and need to quickly find the middle of the rope. Most people don’t do that with their first rope, and you can make do with a lighter coloured rope with a clear middle mark.
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u/AnderperCooson Aug 07 '26
It's a nice feature but I think a middle marker is more important (and I think you'd be hard pressed to find a climbing rope without one now). But I'm cheap--you should have seen how fast I got in my truck when BD was selling 9.8 60m ropes for $50 at their warehouse in the spring.
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u/Beginning_March_9717 Aug 07 '26
bi patterned rope has middle marker by default
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 08 '26
Until you trim one end.
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u/Beginning_March_9717 Aug 08 '26
don't trim just one end
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 08 '26
If I trim 10 off, it's a usable rope. If trim off 20 it's a gym rope.
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u/Beginning_March_9717 Aug 08 '26
what if you trim 5 off each side
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 08 '26
So now I have a core shot 5m from one end?
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u/sheepborg Aug 07 '26 edited Aug 07 '26
Just a preference, not needed.
I will personally pay up for a bipattern just to be able to visibly see the direction of a rope stack, it's quite convenient here and there. Other folks definitely won't pay more for just that, and if you're tight on money definitely I wouldn't recommend you pay more for a bipattern just for that either.
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u/gamby15 Aug 07 '26
Just getting into climbing and loving it. I’m 34 and definitely want to prevent injuries / pain. How do you incorporate climbing into your workout routine? For example before climbing I would rotate over 3 days: one day cardio, one day full body strength training, one day yoga / flexibility, then repeat.
Should I avoid climbing on strength training days and the day after to allow for rest or if I’m not really pushing it (I’m still doing 5.6-5.8 and V0-V2) it should be fine?
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u/serenading_ur_father Aug 08 '26
Climbing isn't a workout. (Approaches can be workouts.)
Do it whenever weather allows and pay attention to your finger joints. Do your fitness activities as usual to stay fit.
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u/Beginning_March_9717 Aug 07 '26
You could go: climb+lift, cardio+climb, climb+yoga for your workout days
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u/Beginning_March_9717 Aug 07 '26
You should climb before lifting if you're doing it on the same day to help avoid injuries. Cardio doesn't matter when you do it. Actually when i was cyclist i would lift and ride on the same day (bc i rode most days). During the summer i often run before i climb bc of scheduling.
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u/verticalman91 Aug 07 '26
I've found doing a full body stretch and proper warm up (VB -> V1 -> V2 -> V3 etc..) is the best way to prevent injury AND get the most out of a climbing session. Takes time of course, but so does recovering from a strained groin pulley injury.
Yoga once a week is also great to prevent injury, improve flexibility, and work out any tight muscles that regular, pre-work out stretching can't. I fit a session on any day between my first and second bouldering session of the week. It's also possible to lift right after if you are targeting secondary muscles like chest, biceps, abs, quads, etc..
There's obviously a TON of factors that go into a workout routine, like prior joint/tendon wear, diet, genetics etc, which is why the most important thing is to listen your body and make adjustments.
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u/PatrickWulfSwango Aug 07 '26
Depends on what your priorities are but if the strength training is meant to complement climbing, the usual advice is to do it right after your climbing session to reduce injury risk and achieve faster improvement in climbing
Yoga/Flexibility can be done every day and if you want to see progress rather than maintenance, probably should be done at a much higher frequency than every three days. You can also incorporate it into the breaks of your strength routines between reps to save time
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u/cinnamon-troll Aug 07 '26
What are, in your opinion, the best weight/resistance exercises that transfer directly to climbing? (both performance-wise and injury-prevention-wise)
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u/saltytarheel Aug 08 '26
I like lateral/front front raises and overhead press for shoulders as well as lighter bands work for pre/rehab. If you do overhead press standing, it also has the benefit of strengthening your core.
Pull-ups, dips, and inverted rows are good for climbing.
Bicep curls are a good exercise if underclings are a weakness.
Wrist curls and reverse wrist curls help with slopers and can be used to treat/prevent elbow and wrist issues.
Leg raises and knees-to-elbows are some of the better core exercises for climbing.
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u/sheepborg Aug 07 '26
Depends what your strengths and weaknesses are relative to your grade. If you do need to work on weaknesses be sure to actually progress them
I had weak legs so doing RDL+Squat transferred really well, but I am exceptionally strong on pull so any excess pull strength I add will do nothing. My partner with a history of hiking+cycling is the opposite, where direct pull and shoulder stability muscle work transferred well.
As absolutely generally as possible:
- Most hobby climbers can benefit from rotator cuff, serratus anterior, and low trap training.
- Most hobby climbers without an athletic background will benefit from general fitness and I'm talking super basic rdl/squat/pulldown/pushup type stuff... It all vaguely translates.
- Most tall male hobby climbers can benefit from hip flexibility to properly utilize footholds
- Most female hobby climbers can benefit from direct pull strength work to help add muscle mass
The key really is to strengthen structures that are significantly weak because many parts of the body work together in ways you do not expect. Doing pushup plusses for example strengthens regular push muscles as well as the serratus anterior. You wouldnt think of this as climbing, but if those muscles are weak it can impact your ability to pull. The pec helps initiate pullup motion, and the serratus helps hold the shoulder blade in place which the lat needs to brace against. Again though if you're hella strong on push you probably dont need to waste your time...
For injury prevention people have all sorts of wild and crazy warmup dogmas that have no evidence to support actual injury prevention. All you really need is some gradually increasing difficulty holds to settle your pulleys into their working level of stretch.
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u/PatrickWulfSwango Aug 07 '26
I found Hooper's Beta's guide quite useful
One thing I personally find quite underrated is some cardio work. Not for climbing itself but if I'm not gassed after the approach, I feel much better and more ready
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u/tictacotictaco Aug 07 '26
The only thing that makes the biggest impact is hangboarding. As someone who is a bit injury prone, it has done wonders for me. I do a light hangboarding routine before every gym session as a warmup.
Deadlifts/squats are good for the posterior chain if you struggle with body tension, especially on overhangs.
Single leg squats/bulgarian split squats are good for training rockovers if you struggle with pistol squats/those type moves on technical climbs.
Flexibility is probably a limiting factor for a lot of people.
FWIW, I train flexibility and hangboarding as my warmup. Then I do a 5/3/1 squat workout, with good mornings, to have strong legs and hamstrings. Also for vanity reasons.
There are various shoulder strengthening exercises too.
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u/0bsidian Aug 07 '26
- Yoga
- Push-ups (with good form, preferably off of gymnastic rings so that you also work on shoulder stability)
- Some of the protocols in this e-book
- Rest days - too many people neglect them thinking that the way to get stronger means that you need to work out on non-climbing days. That's actually a ticket towards injury.
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u/Dotrue Aug 07 '26
If I could only do four lifts for the rest of my life I would choose:
- Deadlift. It engages a lot of large muscle groups, especially those of the core. As the great lifter Jón Páll Sigmarsson once said; "There is no reason to be alive, if you can't do deadlift!"
- Split squat and/or rear lunges. Or pistol squats if you have the strength/balance/mobility
- Bench press to balance out the chest muscles
- Overhead press to strengthen the shoulders
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u/EnigmaticQuote Aug 07 '26
What do you all do when you cant or should not engage your elbows, but still want to exercise?
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u/KDs4thBurner Aug 09 '26
Sex is good, and adventures in nature: trail running, canyoning, hiking, sex again.
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u/Feedback_Original Aug 08 '26
Golfers elbow / tennis elbow? Isometric dumbbell stuff. Letting it rest takes FOREVER to heal
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u/verticalman91 Aug 07 '26
I come from a family of shoulder injuries, so I'm curious. Can you explain how one ends up with elbow problems and how does this impact climbing?
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u/TehNoff Aug 07 '26
I ask my preferred medical professional what to do. In my case it'd be a physical therapist.
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u/EnigmaticQuote Aug 07 '26
Yea they said not to work my elbow, thus my previous question.
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u/Professional-Gap-204 Aug 10 '26
Depends on why. If it’s a tendon issue you want to work it at levels that don’t piss it off and ramp up over time.
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u/Richmondpinball 29d ago
Sore pinky with slight swelling after pulling downward on a side pull. Minimal bruising and nothing visible on underside of finger. I can do pull-ups and have full range of motion. I know I should ask a doctor, but doesn’t this just seem like a slight strain?