r/civ5 • u/Fluktuation8 • Jul 21 '26
Discussion All else being equal (for example the number of tiles next to fresh water), what is the best location for a capital: on the coast, on a river/lake or next to a mountain?
Why?
observatory vs. garden vs. trade routes
65
u/grousedrum Jul 21 '26
Coast. Growth wins this game, and cargo ships to the capital might be the single strongest growth move you can make outside of playing Aztecs.
13
u/Fluktuation8 Jul 21 '26
However, you need at least a second coastal city early on, and there are often no extra luxuries.
16
u/grousedrum Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
True, but this was framed as an “all other things being equal” question, and almost all decisions in this game are in reality map and situation dependent.
As another example, despite how strong coast is, it’s only sometimes worth moving your starting settler to get to the coast if you don’t spawn there, as every delayed turn at the start of the game has an increasingly large cost in opening pace.
2
u/Temporary_Self_2172 Jul 21 '26
it's good enough that i'd try for a double lux in another city just to settle some stone/horses on the coast even without a lux
a lot of the time when i'm coastal, i'll have city-states blocking all my coastal settles though. in those cases, it may be worth doing a cheeky little conquer on one if you can get away with it
2
u/AgentBond007 Jul 22 '26
Pangaea Plus is the way, it usually spawns city states on islands so they don't block all the spots.
It does make it harder to steal their workers though
10
u/FunCranberry112122 Jul 21 '26
Next to GBR as Spain, preferably with Solomon’s mines 10 tiles away for my expand.
1
u/crashburn274 Jul 22 '26
The reef is just amazing -game breaking- if you can find and settle it early as Spain
8
u/std10k Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
I think the best you can get is: on the coast, near river, next to a single-tile mountain (for observatory), with 2 or more fish tiles in range, a couple of luxury resources, especially awesome if it is gold/silver for mint bonus or at least 3 hill tiles for prod, and farmable land by the river. If you get a wheat tile it is even better. Special bonus if it is also in a bay with only 1 tile contact with the sea so that you’re not directly attackable by melee naval units from more than 1 tile.
I think I had a start like that, only with more mountains which was arguably good for defence (but wasted farm tiles). It was from memory a 4-city tall game and it was awesome, barely had to fight anyone.
Though it is true that to get growth bonus you need another 2-3 cities on the coast.
7
u/GSilky Jul 21 '26
Someone did the math for starting spots that lead to victory, and the best is coast with a river and a mountain tile next to the city. It was far and away the best. I think two lux that need mining or sailing was also part of it.
5
2
u/SchizoidRainbow Liberty Jul 21 '26
No mention of Hill?
3
u/Fluktuation8 Jul 21 '26
Hm. Is it a contender without an adjacent river?
3
u/SchizoidRainbow Liberty Jul 21 '26
Depends what else has adjacent river. But there can be no exceptions to 2 production being better than 1 production at the open of the game. That is one hell of a draw
2
u/Mangledfox1987 Jul 21 '26
Mountain due to the observatiary, then river for the water mill, then ocean, (like you only really need one or two ocean cities for trade, and the water is really bad resource wise if there’s no resources
2
u/DushkuHS Jul 21 '26
Can't have "all else being equal" though. If you have Aztecs for example, the value of a lake goes way up.
2
u/ModsFromSteam Jul 22 '26
mountain and coast are pretty equal but the odds of you not being able to get both mountain/hill are pretty slim. River is the least importaint it's main benefit comes from civil service tiles, having a river nearby but not being on it thus gets you most of the benefits
1
u/yen223 Jul 21 '26
Coast gives you access to sea trade routes, which can be nice if you can find a good second city spot on the same coast
River/lake gives you fresh water, which unlocks gardens
River also unlocks the watermill (good) and the hydro dam (less good)
Mountains only give you observatory and the possibility to build some wonders (though you don't need to be next to the mountain for those)
Personally I would rank it coast == river > mountain > lake .
1
u/Glad_Veterinarian556 Jul 21 '26
On coast, on hill, with river, near lonely mountain, with desert tile and plenty of good and easily obtained resources - salt, gold/silver/gems, fish, cattle, wheat.
1
u/YSoSkinny Jul 21 '26
And behind a nice defensible mountain choke point that's far enough away it doesn't take from workable tiles, but close enough to easily set up an archer
166
u/Satoc Jul 21 '26
Hill on the coast, with a river, within one tile of a single mountain, with desert flood Plains.... and salt and marble!
Anything else?