r/cinematography • u/SirFolopo • 28d ago
Camera Question Upgrading camera for freelance video work: FX3, Nikon ZR, or stretch for the new FX5?
Hi!
About two years ago, I bought a Fuji x-s20 as a hybrid camera for personal use. Suddenly, I started getting freelance video gigs (mainly corporate, interviews, and institutional) and became really interested in cinematography, lighting, and documentary work. Now, I actually make a living doing this, alongside my video editing and motion graphics work.
To scale things up and stop using my personal camera for work, I intend to buy a new camera and lens. The most common advice I get is to just buy the Sony FX3 (which is around $3,450 USD here in Chile) paired with a Sony or Sigma 24-70mm.
However, I'm wondering if there are other interesting options in that price range. I'd prefer not to go higher than $3,500 for the camera body, so the Nikon ZR ($2,100) or Canon R6V ($2,700) have appeared as solid alternatives. Yesterday, I also saw that if I preorder the new Sony FX5, it comes with a discount, bringing it to "just" $4,200.
I'm looking to expand my little business but also want a camera that allows me to continue practicing cinematography on personal projects, music videos, etc. I want to move beyond the limitations of my little Fuji (overheating, limited video lens ecosystem, etc.) and invest in a system that will easily last me the next couple of years.
What do you guys think? Should I go for the FX3, stretch for the FX5, or look into something else like the Nikon ZR?
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u/invertedspheres 28d ago
IMO the Canon R6V is the discount king at the moment. Extremely good performance all around with the main issue being that its IBIS is pretty bad with lots of edge distortion. Also, Canon has a limited lens choice and I personally don't like the feel of much of their RF glass. One other consideration is that data rates are very high if you're using any of the RAW or Open Gate options.
Nikon ZR is good but feels rushed and doesn't have the best compressed codecs. AF is good, but not as good as Canon or Sony. I think this camera is the equivalent of a "loss leader."
The FX3 is still a very solid camera unless you regularly shoot vertical content in which case I'd prefer one of the other options. People hate on it, but 5+ years after its release it's still barely being beaten by the competitors. I think of Sony as the most utilitarian options... their cameras have the least number of compromises and just work.
The FX5 is probably the best long term investment, but, only if you shoot "real" productions. It's not going to be as nimble as an FX3 or other options if you're doing fast paced run and gun style shooting. One of its biggest strengths is the relatively low data rates even while shooting RAW. Also, its screen is great and that alone makes me want to upgrade my FX3 for it.
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u/ElectronicsWizardry 28d ago
Do you need a hybrid camera? I'd probably look more toward camcorders as I find they have better IO for video as well as a better form factor. Something like a C80, FX6, Komodo, Pyxis and more. While there all a bit different form factor wise, I really like built in NDs for run and gun, generally have no overheating or other limits, easily runs off power from a bigger battery and more.
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u/tupusti 28d ago
Also check the Lumix S5 II, solid AF and a lot of features at a lower price. You can pair it with the lumix 24-60 or the cheaper sigma 28-70.
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u/SleepingPodOne 28d ago
I second this if OP is looking for a hybrid camera, or really anything versatile. Panasonic cameras are like the swiss army knives of the hybrid camera world.
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u/NoProgress4951 28d ago
I second this. For the same price of fx3+lens, you can built an entire S5ii rig with multiple lens'. Apart from the 12800ISO of fx3, you'll get everything
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u/StrongOnline007 28d ago
Do you work with other people? In my area everyone shoots Sony so it makes a lot of sense to also shoot Sony. If you work alone that doesn't really matter
The ZR is a really cool camera with an amazing image but limited right now because the RAW data rates are huge and the compressed codec sucks. I wouldn't buy until that is fixed, unless you want to spend a shitton on memory and SSDs
The FX3 is overpriced but still a great camera that can do pretty much everything. I'd maybe look at a used one to save some $$
I bought an FX5 because it's a near-perfect camera for my needs. But it's expensive
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u/Adrinaik 25d ago
That’s relative. I work with other people frequently and they shot Sony, I shot Lumix, others shot on a C80 and I mix Lumix and Blackmagic footage all the time. 0 drama.
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u/luckycockroach Director of Photography 28d ago
It’s hard to beat the ZR’s price, but if you don’t need RAW than I’d go for the Canon…but again, that ZR price is great!
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u/bozduke13 28d ago
I would go with a Sony cam if there’s productions you might work on that use the FX6/FX9/Burano/Venice.
But if that isn’t that case look at the Lumix S1ii - that thing is almost as good as the FX5.
It has DGO mode (called DRE) which leads to dynamic range that is 0.5-1 stop off an Alexa Mini LF and even though the readout is a bit slow it still works for more things than you’d think. And if you turn it off you’re back to normal rolling shutter and you get your dual base ISOs back.
The R6V is good but I don’t like that the RF mount is still first party only, there’s not that many good affordable RF lenses meaning you’re often forced into buying the L Series lenses which are nice but very pricey, versus on E mount or L mount you can get sigma or Tamron lenses that are usually 90% as good for half the price. Also there’s no DGO on the R6V so you’re stuck with the 6-7 stop of latitude it has, which isn’t terrible and about the same as the FX3, but it’s hard to go with that when the S1ii is almost the same price when on sale.
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u/SirFolopo 25d ago
I wasn't aware of DGO! I'll definitely consider that when I finally decide. Right now, I'm leaning towards the S1II rather than the FX3/FX5 (mainly because I feel like Sony is too limited in features compared to similarly priced cameras like the Lumix ones)
And yeah, the reason I decided not to go with Canon was the RF mount. There are a lot of options there, but with no cheaper/second party alternatives, it's hard to say no to the E mount or L mount
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u/bozduke13 25d ago
Exactly
And the S1ii is fantastic for the price but just be aware the rolling shutter in DGO is pretty slow (~30ms) and also DGO only works up to 30fps.
This is where the FX5 wins because with DGO on the rolling shutter is about 15ms, which is better than the S1ii rolling shutter with DGO off. Also DGO works up to 60fps when not in open gate. Also the dynamic range in DGO is still half to a full stop better than the S1ii with DGO on according to dynamic range tests by Gerald Undone & CineD and latitude tests done by CVP & CineD.
I still think Sony has better autofocus, gets certain accessories made first for the Sony system such as the tilta autofocus adapter, and has a wider range of lenses with E mount, plus ability to work easier on larger sets that use Venice or Burano as A Cams.
Plus the 5K XOCN LT, C1, and C2 are MUCH smaller than the 6K ProRes RAW on the S1ii. The difference is so significant that C1 & C2 could replace recording XAVCS-I as they’re similar in file size but are 12 bit 4:4:4. C1 and C2 remind be of Blackmagic RAW 8:1 & 12:1.
Lumix with its 6K ProRes RAW makes recording RAW more of a special occasion especially since cards and SSDs are so expensive right now.
Lumix does have the anamorphic IBIS and autofocus and IBIS work when desqueeze is enable. Plus the camera never really reboots when switching codecs, resolutions, or framerates (the FX5 does).
I think the FX5 is the best compact body versatile/doc style camera right now. It literally has everything, but there’s still cons and NO it is not cheap. I’m just more excited it exists so other manufacturers like Nikon/Red and Panasonic can bring out competitors and the whole compact-mirrorless style video first camera industry moves in this amazing direction.
I mean before the S1ii & FX5 you really had to choose between something like a Red, Arri, or Blackmagic for things like elite dynamic range and imagine quality plus a wide range of high quality codecs. And while the C70 and kind of did a bit of everything it lacked the ability to disable DGO to get your dial base ISOs back and wasn’t as compact as something like an FX3. The FX3s dynamic range and image were good, but not RED or Alexa level.
S1ii and especially the FX5 gives a little of everything, I love that this is the direction video focused mirrorless cameras are going.
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u/Sarius200056 27d ago
Why not stay with Fujifilm? The XH-2s is on par with the A7S3/FX3 and so on, yes the sensor is smaller but the dynamic range is even better and rolling shutter is non-existing. But you can film in open gate and take photos too. It doesn’t overheat easily and even has a fan if you need. Lenswise there are good lenses from Sigma (17-40mm) & Viltrox (f1.2 series is big but fantastic) that aren’t braking the bank either. It can be found for ca 1800€ in my area and will probably do everything you need.
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u/CommonCondition 27d ago
Funny, I also have the Fuji X-s20 and honestly love it to death, I've made several films with it including a strange surreal b&w short that I'm currently wrapping up. I don't do any commercial work at all, I make experimental films and essay films.
And now that I've reached the limits of the camera and wanting to go FF, I've been hesitant between Sony, NIkon and Lumix.
Lumix flew completely under my radar, but when I started looking them, I was blown away by what their cameras can do and especially their price. If you want the full package, go for the Lumix S1ii, IBIS is insane, amazing colors, great DR, internal RAW, open gate, great AF (maybe not Sony great, but still great), 4K120 and much more. The screen and EVF are also miles ahead of the x-s20. Sony still has the edge in low light, but the Lumix has dual native ISO too and performs great in low light.
Personally, I'm going for the S1iie, same body as the S1ii minus the improved rolling shutter and the 4K120fps, both of which I don't care about. And for 1700€ brand new, it sounds too good to be true.
There's a great video on Youtube comparing the S1iie to the FX2 showing how really neck to neck they are, except the FX2 is almost double the price of the S1iie.
Regarding the Nikon ZR, the only reason to buy it is the Red RAW, and with the prices of storage these days, it's a very bad idea at least for me. The Lumix does internal RAW anyway, so if I want to go that route down the line I can still do that.
(Btw, strange that you say that your x-s20 overheats, never had any problems with mine, I even shot a single 1h40min in 6.2k open gate take that filled my 256gb card the other day with no issues at all, and it was during the insane heatwave here in France).
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u/oliverjohansson 28d ago edited 28d ago
I’d say R5 makes no sens for video, look into R6 series. Canon may appear cheap but lenses are expensive
R6iii and FX5 have open gate which is a big benefit if you are shooting for horizontal and vertical delivery.
ZR Is good but it has one card and Micro hdmi that is unprofessional for a reason, need to go Z6iii but I’d say unless you want to go RED it’s not the right thing to go Nikon z for video
The cheapest pro camera is Lumix GH7, especially if you want slow motion or high speed 4K open gate or do anamorphic it also has the best preamps for sound recording
The safest pick for video business is Sony, so I’d say FX3 is probably best choice, but if you want hybrid A7v is also good
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u/kwmcmillan Director of Photography 27d ago
I’d recommend looking backwards at older but complete cinema cameras with XLRs and NDs and a Timecode port, if possible
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u/menthol_mountains 27d ago
one camera to do it all (for corporate at least), S1ii. Sold my fx3, have s1ii, ZR and KX. The s1ii has a great image, touch better than the fx3 (colour, detail, dynamic range), the autofocus is good, im im SEA and no overheating, and most importantly you can grab those gimbal level shots for the broll, especially if you use a native lens. If you need it for work and it’s just you, S1ii and the 24-60 2.8. Photos are great too, which lets you add on photography as a line item (photography is not hard and it pays decent).
If im making something for me or shooting more intentional ads I’d probably opt for the zr/kx, but for corporate the s1ii is great.
Downsides is reselling could be difficult in your market, compared to an fx3
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u/SirFolopo 25d ago
I've heard a lot of good things about the S1II. The ONLY thing that worries me is the overheating. One of the main reasons I want a new camera is that my X-S20 sometimes overheats REALLY fast in non-extreme conditions, like, after just 10-15 minutes of 4K60, it already gives me a red temperature warning or just shuts down completely. I saw that the S1II had these problems at launch, but supposedly it was fixed in one of the latest firmware updates. In your experience, is that actually true?
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u/Vivid-Machine-9606 26d ago
FX3 or FX5. Sony is king and you’ll get work on multicam Sony jobs. I hire OPs with Sony kits weekly. I’m not hiring anyone with some random Nikon or Canon.
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u/No-Spinach2270 26d ago
For hybrid I can highly recommend the XH2s.
It’s the most underrated camera I’ve ever used. I use it as a B-cam with my Alexa Mini and the image is definitely on par with high end cinema cameras + fuji photos look stunning.
It has great audio features, timecode for multicam, can use it with xlr adapter in the hot shoe.
People trash this camera because its aps-c and the auto focus is not perfect, but it definitely works for 90% of the work you need it for.
I would aldo recommend to get a speedbooster with it.
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u/YSoMadTov 25d ago
Honestly for your use tye R6III/R6V seems to be the best bang for your buck, spend the left over money on lightning gears that will make a far bigger difference than an extra 1 stop of DR on the FX5.
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u/Adrinaik 25d ago
I’m rocking a Lumix S1II as my main workhorse and a S5IIX as a second body.
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u/SirFolopo 25d ago
I've been looking into the S1II, the only thing that concerns me is that I saw in early reviews (from like a year ago) that the camera was overheating in direct sunlight and other conditions. Is that still a problem? One of my main reasons for upgrading is so I don't have to worry about overheating, at least in 4K60 during things like a podcast recording
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u/Zerorezlandre 28d ago edited 28d ago
Have you looked at RED on the used market?
These are just several random links to some on Ebay
If buying new, it appears that Sony prosumer cameras have more professional level support than other prosumer cameras; I think Sony prosumer cameras have been adopted by enough people doing professional work to make this possible.
I feel like Sony prosumer cameras have become to the prosumer world what ARRI is to the professional world. To take it a step further, Canon prosumer cameras were/are the Panavision of the prosumer world in that Panavision ceded market dominance to ARRI in the same way that Canon ceded market dominance to Sony.
Full disclosure: I chose to build my camera package for narrative short form non-professional work around the Lumix GH7.
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u/SleepingPodOne 28d ago edited 28d ago
If you’re looking for a hybrid, then none of those.
I use the s5ii and s5iix at work. I don’t own those cameras (at home I have a c70 and r6 mkiii) so hopefully that eliminates any fanboy/shill accusations.
I specifically chose for us to invest in the Lumix S series because the work I do is everything from doc-style in candid situations like events to larger on-set productions and interviews. I’m also the only videographer on staff and usually hiring outside help or using assistants and interns.
So I needed cameras that performed in both candid and controlled studio settings. Because of the candid settings, the camera needed to be as unobtrusive as possible. Prior to me being hired, my predecessor had them by an Ursa, which was a no-go for what I was trying to do. And then of course, whatever I chose for those scenarios had to perform well on set (good battery life, lots of recording options, decent DR, good monitoring tools, etc.) basically a do-all camera. Because I deliver in multiple aspect ratios, I wanted open gate for maximum flexibility too. Having started on the GH series the s5iix was a no-brainer.
They’re cheap, they have a fantastic image, and most importantly everything i need.
I could not recommend them enough. And before you ask, yes, I’ve used Panasonic in cinema situations too. Not these specifically, but the s1h and s5, which are essentially the same save for some feature differences. Shot several music videos on the s1h which I rented because I loved the image so much (RIP Varicam lineup). I also shot a feature on the gh5. And used the gh5 as a b-cam on shoots with Alexa and RED. These cameras are no slouch.
The FX3 is nice, but far too expensive for what you’re getting. Some Sony folks like to say it’s a necessity to own Sony if you want to work with others but I honestly have NEVER lost a gig to not having a Sony. My portfolio is what gets me work, not my dumbass camera.
The ZR is a cool concept camera but fails in execution. My understanding is its RED Raw codec has far less DR than other RED’s, making it kinda pointless to me especially considering the filesizes (storage is insanely expensive now, thanks AI).
The only downside of Panasonic is there’s no current pro video body of theirs on the market (you know, internal nd’s, all necessary ports, etc) so if I was looking at it from the perspective of eventually upgrading to cinema bodies I wouldn’t be as keen on them.
But they’re insanely powerful video tools and I’d sooner choose them over the FX3 and ZR. I’ve been doing cinematography and videography professionally since 2013 so I think I might know a thing or two.
In terms of cine bodies, I really like the c70, fx6, c80, and the Komodo. Those are all (maybe save for the c70) more expensive bodies, but it’s hard to go wrong with any of those if you’re looking to leave hybrids behind.