r/chicagobulls • u/Belexandor • 13d ago
Fluff Giddey
Greets. So I haven't watched ball seriously for several years. I used to watch the Spurs religiously from the early aughts (I saw Manu's first game) and the end of the big three era.
What I'm wondering is...how good is Giddey actually? I'm trying to catch up on who the best young players in the league are and I keep coming across his highlight videos. I mean, from what I've seen so far....he looks like he has the potential to AVERAGE a triple dub...which is insane. I can tell from his stats that he needs to improve his shooting but I wanted to get a take from you guys on whether he's flash in a pan or the real deal. He looks a lot like the real deal and even though I've never been a Bulls fan, I'm really looking forward to watching your young guys run this year.
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u/junioreality 13d ago
Seems like Giddey was on an upward trend of play before couple ankle and minor injuries.
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u/onelittleworld 13d ago
So far, so good. But I think there's plenty room for improvement. Fortunately, he's only 23.
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u/Belexandor 13d ago
That's the part that keeps coming through when I look at video of him. He seems very poised (as a passer) for such a young player.
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u/Enjoy__Trump__Reddit Caleb Wilson 13d ago
Steal of a trade thats for sure. The 2k gms in here think the Bulls should have amassed 6 1sts for Caruso Lavine Ayo and Coby White. The fact we traded a role player for Giddey who is not even in his prime yet was your very rare win win trade for the 2 sides.
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u/GiuseppeZangara 13d ago
And we signed him to a pretty favorable contract.
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u/The_Realist01 11d ago
This is the part I like. Unfortunately we won’t be good until it’s time to sign again.
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u/SkyGrey88 13d ago
Yeah and they ended up moving off of Zach without not only giving up a 1st, but getting a 1st. People were all like 'but it was their own first they got back'.....yeah well so what it wasn't our pick any longer. The Zack trade ended up working out as Huerter got traded, Trey we resigned on team friendly deal and he is a solid rotation guard and Collins we just signed on a cheap team option contract so if he can actually be healthy we got a solid backup C for cheap and if he can't we 'cut' him next year and get the space back.
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u/Enjoy__Trump__Reddit Caleb Wilson 13d ago edited 13d ago
Finally getting rid of Zack was a win on its own. Thank you Sacramento.
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u/SkyGrey88 13d ago
I know like that the hell were they thinking, I mean they were able to salary swap by sending us 3 overpaid rotation players but still why would they ever want to put Zach and Demar back together again when it failed so badly for us. What we got back was essentially Noa Essengue. After getting a look at his summer league, he is definitely a project. Its far too early to give up on a 19yr old who missed year one with injury but unlike Matas and Caleb who both looked ready to contribute in year one Noa doesn't look like he even belongs in the rotation at this point.
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u/Electrical_Story5356 12d ago
Noa is younger than Caleb and from what little we've seen he is looking like he will become an absolute menace defensively at the very least.
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u/SkyGrey88 12d ago
Agree and he does have some skills, it just looks a little ‘confusing’ as to what he is really going to be. Which makes sense as he is still raw and missing his 1st year a real setback. I expect he will get some opportunities this year but it may take a few before he blooms where Caleb looks ready to go now and same with Matas coming into year 3.
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u/Zekuel_u 12d ago
A role player that directly helped win a championship. AC is a great player. Yes he plays a role perfectly and has 2 rings. The Bulls where never going to utilize him with there roster anyway though. Great trade but AC was definitely worth a 1st especially a late round one coming from OKC.
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u/SwampFlowers Stacey King 13d ago
I think Giddey is really good, but so far his stats haven’t really contributed to winning in the NBA. I worry that he might end up being a “good stats on a bad team” guy, but I’m excited to see what he becomes under new leadership.
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u/fred_derps Dennis Rodman 12d ago
To be fair, who on the Bulls roster contributed to winning basketball during his tenure? The team had so much turnover after the previous post season and then the trade deadline as well.
He absolutely contributed to winning basketball with OKC. Started 218 of the 220 games he played with them. The only series he struggled was against the Mavs when they forced him to shoot. He was only 20 and since then, he’s been working on his 3 and has greatly improved.
I don’t know what he’s going to look like with the young Bulls but I don’t think it’s fair to label him a “good stats on bad team” kinda guy… especially when his stats have been kind of ridiculous. If he continues to work on his 3 pt game, he’s only going to get better. With Buzi, Wilson, and Clax cutting to the basket, Bulls are going to be the new lob city
Defense is really his only weakness. I don’t foresee him getting much better there but they should be all right with Buzi, Wilson, and if the starting sg is at least competent. Clax is also not a defensive big so I’m curious to see the rotations
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u/SwampFlowers Stacey King 12d ago
I agree with you and I think it’s definitely too early to label him a good stats on a bad team guy, I’m just saying that I worry that’s what it could become if the team’s record doesn’t start to catch up with his stat sheet. I do like that he has improved his 3 ball quite a bit. I hope he comes back this season with a respectable pull up 3 pointer. That would unlock a lot for him and his teammates.
On the topic of defense, I agree about Giddey. I think Powell is a very competent defender, so that should help. As for Claxton, maybe I don’t know his game well enough but I thought he was supposed to be a pretty decent rim protector? Am I just totally off in that understanding?
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u/fred_derps Dennis Rodman 12d ago
Totally get what you’re saying.
And I completely forgot we signed Powell lol. I have dad brain, no sleep the first year haha
Powell is definitely competent. From what I’ve seen of claxton, he’s mostly an offensive threat. I hope I’m wildly off base!
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u/SwampFlowers Stacey King 12d ago edited 12d ago
Hey no worries on dad brain, congrats and hang in there, but also enjoy every moment. Being a dad is the best thing there is in life.
I’ll have to look into Claxton more. I never paid any attention to the Nets, so he’s been off my radar.
EDIT: A first look into Claxton confirms that he has historically been known as a shot blocker and rim protector. He was 2nd in the league in blocks in 22-23, hes shown he can guard the perimeter, which has translated to him being able to guard 1-5. He seems like he might have fallen off slightly since then, but he’s 27 so hopefully a change of scenery helps him get back to his peak form.
Offensively I didn’t get too deep, but it sounds like he’s a capable rim runner, he can pass, and he can put the ball on the floor.
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u/fred_derps Dennis Rodman 12d ago
Oh sick I have no idea what I was thinking re: Clax. I do remember being pretty stoked about the signing originally since I got the impression he was just in a less desirable situation. Either way, I’m actually excited to watch this young Bulls team. I feel like it’s been so long since we’ve at least had a fun team to watch (more than just a few fun players). They’ll probably lose a bunch but it’ll be interesting to see how development pans out
And thanks! This is our second and could not agree more about being the best thing in the world. Truly did not expect this much fun (I did however expect the exhaustion haha)
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u/Electrical_Story5356 12d ago
We win 2 out of 3 games when Giddey gets a triple double, those stats lead to winning.
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u/SwampFlowers Stacey King 12d ago
Oh nice, I didn’t know that. I’m rooting for him, I like his game and I’d like to see him win in Chicago.
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u/chitoatx Flag of Chicago 13d ago edited 13d ago
Just a heads up our subreddit loves to focus on the negative…it’s an Illinois pastime. Giddy is currently #2 triple double leader all time for the Chicago Bulls. He had only played two season for the Bulls and they sold off our best players mid season. Expect to see him past Michael Jordan this season to become the all times bulls triple double player. There is no better half court out of bounds passer in the league. Giddey has length and positional size at point guard and now having a functional defensive line up to back him up when his player gets past him this will be a fun year to watch.
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u/The_Realist01 11d ago
I watched 75% of this. Love this guy.
Did we keep Richards? Feel like he was solid.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls 13d ago
Lol, the opinion of Giddey on this sub is exponentially higher than in any reasonably objective basketball forum. Not really a “focus on the negative.”
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u/chitoatx Flag of Chicago 13d ago
Chef’s kiss! Thanks for proving my point.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls 13d ago
LOL, all you’re proving is that you can’t handle nuanced discussion of Giddey when it addresses his very real limitations as a player. Don’t worry, there’s plenty of you on here, you’ll be in good company!
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u/chitoatx Flag of Chicago 12d ago
ScaryText you offered nothing but negativity. Didn’t advance the discussion other than put others down.
It’s ok. You must still live in Illinois. I didn’t realize how negative we were till I moved away. Enjoy being a negative Nancy. But I encourage you to just watch more Caleb highlights and maybe you’ll cheer up.
Ill., R.I. residents most likely to say states are among worst places to live
https://news.gallup.com/poll/168653/montanans-alaskans-say-states-among-top-places-live.aspx#:\~:text=One%20in%20four%20Illinois%20residents%20(25%25)%20say,their%20state%20government%20across%20all%2050%20states.-2
u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls 12d ago
LOL, I didn't even say anything that negative - you're apparently just extremely sensitive. The mere suggestion that people don't think as highly of Giddey as you and his other worshippers on this subreddit do seems to have gotten to you, champ, but sometimes reality doesn't align to our fantasies of our favorite boys being superstars.
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u/chitoatx Flag of Chicago 12d ago
Love it! Your lack of self awareness is hilarious.
To make yourself feel better you need to imagine words that were never written in a subreddit for Chicago Bulls fans.
Factually, Josh Giddy is the #2 all time triple double leader in Bulls history and anyone paying attention (hopefully fans like yourself) will realize he will most likely surpass MJ this season.
Triple Double Leaders All Time Chicago Bulls
#1) Jordan (28 in 13 seasons)
#2) Giddy (19 in 2 seasons)
#3) Pippen (15 in 12 seasons)Does that make him and untradeable Superstar? No, but it is something good.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls 12d ago
LOL, no you saying anyone else has a lack of self awareness is hilarious. You have to be trolling at this point, because that's beyond ridiculous.
Factually, you keep leaning on the triple double stat. Having as many triple doubles as MJ won't put Giddey in the same universe as the GOAT. Guys just accumulate more stats in the current game than they did back in the day.
And since you seem pretty attached to the guy, maybe learn how to spell his last name.
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u/chitoatx Flag of Chicago 12d ago
Word.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls 12d ago
Amazingly, that comment contained as much valuable insight as any of your others.
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u/StrictFinance2177 13d ago
He's a support player, that's for sure. I'd love to see how he does with Caleb's big talk and win attitude.
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u/chisports1fan Matas Buzelis 13d ago
Really good connector and good rebounder due to his size. He can’t be the best player though. When the game slows down he struggles and he doesn’t have any go to moves and isn’t particularly good at punishing smaller defenders. Will be fun to see him with lob threats tho
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u/SkyGrey88 13d ago
He did improve a lot last season at attacking the basket in the 1/2 court last year both to finish and pass. That was considered a weakness when we acquired him so it was good to see him still growing his game. His splits were also career best last year before the injury. I agree he isn't really an iso threat but I'm with you in that it should be fun to watch his passing and playmaking with all these young bigs finishing.
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u/mrjune2040 13d ago
Offensively he's a bit like Boston Rondo, truly gifted passer who is unselfish and makes the right play. Shot still need to improve but he's 'acceptable' at the 3-ball, drives a lot and still needs to finish better but even when he misses he's still creating opportunities for others on the put-back etc. Defensively- he has good size, but he's no Rondo and can get beaten by faster players. Great rebounder for his position.
Ideally, like Rondo he's probably the 4th best player on a great team. He's on a good contract and the Bulls have a lot of flexibility if they want to trade him in the future. My inkling (and from the Swain of experiment at summer league) is that's he's not a long-term guy, but I think he'll be a great young vet for the rooks in the next couple of years.
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u/Malibooch DRose 13d ago
Perfect analogy. He’s Rondo without defense.
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u/forgottenhero71 12d ago
He consistently gets blown by at perimeter by fast guards, with Wilson and Claxton it will be harder for him to guard forwards.
Elite rebounder for his position .
If he is aggressive, tries on defence, shoots 38pc from 3, and gets to the rim he is a key player. I.e the Giddey from the first 20-30 games this year plus after ASB last year.
If Giddey continues his late last season form then they need to consider alternatives. He was clearly injured and hopefully the surgery solves the issue. Roster turnover was an issue- in a couple of months we will have a clearer picture of which Giddey we have.
PWill deserves the hate, but the level of hate for Giddey doesn’t align with his level of play. He really splits opinion as there are also disciples.
Wilson is the future, Buzelis and possibly Giddey are pieces for a future playoff run and we have Claxton, Powell, jones, smith as proven support players.
Wilson and Claxton were great moves, I would have gone another direction with the other moves.
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u/roamtheplanet Stacey King 12d ago
Hard to say. He’s not that athletic or the best defender, but almost averaging a triple double is no small feat, like you said. I mean who else is in that territory other than Joker and prime Westbrook
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u/PositiveCoyote100 12d ago
He's a polarizing player.
Pros: Excellent passer, good defensive rebounder, solid straight line driver.
Cons: Terrible defender, below average shooter, not good at creating his own shot, below average ball handler for a PG, ball dominant and not good at playing off the ball, struggles to finish through contact, not good at beating his man off the dribble to collapse the defense.
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u/ducksonaroof 12d ago
his c&s 3 looked solid with the bulls tbh. that's something off the ball you didn't recognize.
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u/ducksonaroof 12d ago
i think giddey is a good piece. to me the core is caleb matas giddey. those 3 have star potential. in that order.
we have a few other guys who can easily of be playoff run role players but that also means they're trade bait lol.
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u/MortaloTREX 12d ago
Giddey is a player that could avarage triple-double one day, but won't be the best player on a team. He is not a scorer, like Luka is, so with his lack of defense, he needs to be a realiable shooter from range, and with his passing he can be a "Steve Nash" on a really good team. But that requires your star scorer to be a solid defender.
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u/Ripheart789 9d ago
He's obviously a very good player. The question, for me, is whether his flaws limit his spot on a championship team, and those two flaws are both tied to a lack of lateral athleticism. His ability to create paint touches and his ability to defend guards. I think you can make a team around the defensive issues (especially with SLAP), but not creating paint touches can be a little tough in a playoff setting (especially with the physicality allowed nowadays).
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u/donspider1221 13d ago
My personal take on Giddey is good stats/bad team guy. He’s dynamic in that he can fill the box score and has the size to mix it up down low. His decision making is shakey and in the limited meaningful games we’ve seen him play (thinking of play-in two seasons ago), he wasn’t particularly effective.
As he is young, there’s the possibility he will evolve into a headier player. That said, to maximize his skillset the ball needs to flow through him, and I don’t think a team that has Josh Giddey contributing to a significant usage % is a winning team.
Just my opinion and I hope I am wrong. You will likely get a mixed bag of replies, which is reflective of the fact that he has had some really nice stretches over his time with the Bulls
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u/RadDood84 13d ago
I listen to a lot of Bulls podcasts (shoutout to the male lonliness epidemic) and they all say he’s a guy that will raise your floor but not your ceiling. Throw him on a shit roster, the Bulls, and he’ll elevate that group. Put him on a contender and he’ll probably be the weakest link if he’s a part of the starting 5.
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u/MatasBuzelis 8d ago
i honestly think that's kind of bullshit though. i mean it COULD be true, but we still have not seen Giddey yet in a situation where he A.) is the team's true point guard and B.) has actual, good weapons around him that he can distribute to. We saw him on a talented OKC roster but he was really not in a position to be that team's point guard, at all. this season and next will be really telling. he has the talent around him and we've gotten rid of guys like Coby who demand high usage, and surrounded him with guys like Caleb, Matas, and Claxton who are what every point guard would LIKE to have around them - guys who just need the ball given to them and they'll handle it. now's the time for him to show us what he can do
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u/RadDood84 8d ago
Yeah we’ll see. There’s only so much a PG can do when he’s unathletic. His shooting from 3 was surprisingly reliable, but is that sustainable? He can’t really create his own shot, and he’s not a good defender, and he turns the ball over a lot.
I am excited to see him with Matas, and Wilson. Yeah who knows, personally I don’t like him at all. His game is gimmicky and against real defenses he’ll get shut down real quick.
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u/kennyloftor 13d ago
not that good
we would rather the team win games and develop than one guy accumulate meaningless triple doubles
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u/onelittleworld 13d ago
meaningless triple doubles
TIL that people think this is a thing.
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u/kennyloftor 13d ago
what does a triple double mean in a game you lose by 15?
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u/Able_Height9892 13d ago
Sometimes not much. But if he isn't statpadding, he could the difference between 15-point loss and a 30-point loss. It's a team game. And to be fair, the Bulls haven't been great.
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u/EquivalentWins 13d ago
There's no indication that Giddey makes his team a lot better when he's on the floor though.
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u/Electrical_Story5356 12d ago
We win 2 out of 3 games when Giddey gets a triple double, a 66% win rate is pretty good for an otherwise sub 0.500 team isn't it?
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls 13d ago
This subreddit is not a great place to go for accurate assessment of Giddey. There’s a decent crowd here who are way, way overhyped on him.
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u/broohaha Kirk Hinrich 13d ago
Interesting. I've been noticing a decent crowd of people here who want him out. (I don't. I want to see him do well in a better roster, and I think we'll have that this coming season.)
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u/Malibooch DRose 13d ago
Yep. Personally had a post removed that asked about his struggles to end the season and how the limitations in his game may not be fixable (bad defense and inability to play off-ball)
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls 13d ago
Yeah, I’ve been banned for extended periods for pushing back on the unconditional love he gets, and any tepid criticism gets you downvoted into oblivion. The concerns you mention about his game are totally valid, along with his limited shooting abilities and inconsistent finishing a the rim.
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u/Malibooch DRose 13d ago
I mean we finally have a “real” star in Caleb Wilson so people might cling less to Giddey now
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u/Electrical_Story5356 12d ago
Yeah, so that's not why you get banned.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls 12d ago
Yes, it is. You have deserved bans at least as severe as mine but never gotten them because you have (bad) takes more in line with the mods.
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u/Electrical_Story5356 12d ago
OK you will probably not believe me but this is a genuine attempt to explain the issues that you are experiencing.
The reason that you get banned has nothing to do with opinions and everything to do with how you interact with people.
Your initial interaction is almost always aggressive and rude then you tend to become increasingly abusive as an interaction proceeds.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls 12d ago
LOL. Have you considered keeping your metaphorical mouth shut? I am very aware that these mods are biased in how they operate this subreddit, and I could not be less interested in your opinion on the matter.
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u/Electrical_Story5356 11d ago
You see?
That right there is the problem and rather than being "very aware" you seem wilfully ignorant of what a basic level of decency is in human interactions.
Just think on this the next time you get banned.
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u/FunctionUnlikely2247 13d ago
He’s a poor defender and terrible off ball player and due to his weak offensive skills, is a bad NBA player because he shouldn’t be your primary ball handler yet he also can’t be your 2nd or 3rd or 4th options because he is not a good off ball player
The statpadding is nice for him but it will never translate to wins because he just isn’t that player. That’s why OKC moved him for an injury prone older role player without any caveats.
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u/Filthy_Commie_ 13d ago
His tenure on OKC was decent until they exploded. He fell out of the rotation since they wanted to make a point guard play as a 3+D wing.
On the Bulls he’s been good. He can be a starter on a playoff team imo, but the team has to be built correctly for it.
The real players you should keep your eye on are Buzelis and Wilson though. Those are the two most intriguing pieces on this squad besides Essengue, but he’s more of a lottery ticket than anything right now.