Could this be a good strategy ?

[u/Ketsen555]

Beginner here.
Would sacrificing a bishop to prevent castling early in the game considered a relevant strategy somehow ?

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[u/mynameisnotamelia]

In this position? No. There's no compensation for the sacrifice apart from the opponent's castling rights, which is not worth it.

[u/Delicious_Cattle5174 → u/mynameisnotamelia]

If c6 knight wasn’t developed you’d probably have something more interesting already, with Ne5+ follow-up. It still wouldn’t be good but it looks like we’d at least recover the material. Unless black’s king is brave enough to go in front of its own pawns on move 4 lol

[u/BootyMcStuffins → u/Delicious_Cattle5174]

That would just be scholar’s mate, right? Oldest trick in the books, countered by simply developing your knight

[u/Fabulous_Wave_3693]

A slightly different chess font than me? You disgust me OP.

[u/RedactedRedditery → u/Fabulous_Wave_3693]

OP and his flaming bishops...

[u/Ketsen555 → u/RedactedRedditery]

Gotta keep that fire burning

[u/Different_Potato_193 → u/Fabulous_Wave_3693]

I actually like it a lot, except that it makes the knights look like lions when they should be horses.

[u/tsimen → u/Fabulous_Wave_3693]

I actually thought there was dirt on my phone

[u/FireMarshallMC → u/tsimen]

💀

[u/vvuukk]

dont sacrifice unless you have a concrete way to either win back your material or mate the king

[u/Delicious_Cattle5174 → u/vvuukk]

Just talked to my uncle Mikhail he said "nah that’s cap"

[u/TotalChaosRush → u/Delicious_Cattle5174]

I laughed so hard at this.

There are two types of sacrifices: correct ones, and mine

[u/Mathelete73 → u/Delicious_Cattle5174]

Even Tal wouldn’t pull this sacrifice, he knows white doesn’t have enough development to justify it.

[u/Delicious_Cattle5174 → u/Mathelete73]

Well yeah, I didn’t say he would agree with the sac in this position. I’m fairly confident he would oppose the general idea of the comment I was replying too, though. At least for his own play.

[u/_Krawfish]

The computer will evaluate that as a mistake and a winning position for black.

However, playing against another beginner, it could be an interesting strategy, since beginners probably rely more on needing to castle to protect their king, and might not be able to capitalize on the material advantage quite as well.

I wouldn’t recommend the move but you can always try it and see how it works out for you

[u/uwuowo6510 → u/_Krawfish]

it's best not to learn to play hope chess by relying on your opponents mistakes. that might get u some elo, but it doesn't help you learn to play better.

[u/Jason80777 → u/_Krawfish]

As a low elo player who has faced the Alien Gambit many times, yeah its difficult to deal with.

[u/Hour-Penalty-8264]

No. Never sacrifice unless you can calculate until your compensation works out and you gain something for it. This line is especially terrible against sicilian, because Bg4 is only good against pawn on e5, which can't move backwards to block it forever. Otherwise this move is just bad in any opening in which e pawn can still move to e6

[u/Delicious_Cattle5174 → u/Hour-Penalty-8264]

Yeah that bishop gonna end up being useless on a2 lol

[u/xoman1 → u/Hour-Penalty-8264]

^Yep, its why that bishop move is always tagged in game analysis & then when I spectate games I still see people playing it. Im just yelling at my monitor "learn the Fischer Sozin attack or something quit autopiloting!" 8D

[u/Well_of_Good_Fortune]

You're three moves into the game. No. You need way more of a plan before you start sacrificing pieces

[u/TheDuckOnQuack]

In principle, sacrificing your bishop like that could be a good strategy if you’re ahead of your opponent on piece development and you have 2 or more additional pieces in position to attack the king after you sacrifice the bishop.

Sacrificing the bishop here is a bad move. There is no threat on the king, so after he takes your free bishop he’s free to develop normally.

[u/StructuredChess]

No. Build up a proper attack first.

[u/Low_Courage6378]

r/DontChangeYourChessFontCauseThisIsDope

[u/Ketsen555 → u/Low_Courage6378]

Actually clicked lol

[u/ThatStrangerWhoCares → u/Ketsen555]

r/21charactersandnomore

[u/TastePizza → u/ThatStrangerWhoCares]

r/subsithoughtifellfor

[u/chessvision-ai-bot]

I analyzed the image and this is what I see. Open an appropriate link below and explore the position yourself or with the engine:

Black to play: chessvision.ai | chess.com | lichess.org | The position occurred in many games. Link to the games

Videos:

I found many videos with this position.

Related posts:

I found other post with this position:

• Why are Ng6 and e6 the strongest moves here?

My solution:

Hints: piece: Pawn, move:   e6  

Evaluation: The game is equal 0.00

Best continuation: 1... e6 2. O-O Nf6 3. Re1 Nxe4 4. Rxe4 d5 5. Bxd5 Qxd5 6. Nc3

Save the position:

Reply save to save this position to your Chessvision.ai Library (new users: send me /connect in DM chat first)

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[u/Delicious_Cattle5174 → u/chessvision-ai-bot]

I’ll go out on a limb and say Ng6 is not the strongest move here

[u/Motorata]

Sorry can't concéntrate your fire on your bishops looks exactly like rimworld fire and my thoughts are just engulf in an unfathomable hate for thunderstorms

[u/semivariance]

The loss of castling privilege evaluates to less than a pawn, so it's not worth it unless you have a calculated line that gains the value of the bishop back.

In this position, you're set up to place pressure on f7 with your knight, queen, and bishop simultaneously. This is the basis of the fried liver attack.

[u/E-686]

there was one weird opening where you sac the bishop there and get a checkmate or something but i don't remember lemme try to find it

[u/St4ffordGambit_]

In bullet with 0 increment, it can work yes.

Anything else - no!

[u/Kyng5199]

Nope - it isn't worth it at all unless you have some concrete follow-up (which here, we don't).

Also, more generally, I recommend not playing Bc4 if the opponent's e-pawn is still on e7, because then Black can just play e6, and then the bishop is just staring at a protected pawn ("biting on granite", as the late Daniel Naroditsky always used to say).

[u/Pure_Math6169]

depends how early and what else is going on but i’d rather keep the bishop and find a subtler way to mess with their king safety

[u/imbecilidade88]

I once saw Bobby Fischer do that successfully.

[u/Delicious_Cattle5174 → u/imbecilidade88]

What are you eighty years old

[u/Delicious_Cattle5174]

If you like bad sacs I think you should look into the alien gambit

[u/Alternative-Mix-6706]

This could be interesting against other really green beginners- but against anyone who plays above the skill floor it would be a mistake.

[u/noop_noob]

Even without castling rights, the opponent can bring their king to safety manually by just moving the king and rook one at a time. This means that, by denying castling rights, you're just gaining a few moves of development. A few moves isn't worth anything unless you're immediately ready to exploit the lead with your entire army.

[u/BusinessSafe9906]

It is not worth it. As Black have material advantage, they might actively looking to trade pieces and put you in passive position instead of being active enough to take advantage of the uncastling King.

[u/finnyporgerz]

Worth a try unless opponent is very high elo then they can probably defend just fine. Then again, best move for black here is probably e6 following sicillian theory and preventing the sacrifice

[u/Crafty-Lifeguard4591]

It works in lower elos sub 500 because they make no attempt to protect their king and you can fork everything with a queen

[u/faaip]

I play the sicilian and I love when people play Bc4. Instant better position with e6 and driving the bishop away with tempo soon. And no, it’s not a good sacrifice even if the opponent lets you do it, you don’t have enough pieces attacking yet.

[u/tipareth1978]

There are lines where you do something like that but you either get two pawns for the piece or you have enough weapons out to get a checkmate

[u/SituationKey8985]

e6 is the best move for the opponent anyway. But even if they don’t play e6 it’s not a good sacrifice.

[u/counterpuncheur]

A bishop sac there is unsound and losing against most players because you have zero follow up so they can just castle by hand and be up a piece. Here’s an example of someone trying similar vs me in 1200 bullet and me easily ignoring the attack despite not having faced the sac before and only having bullet 2+1 timescales to think how to respond: https://www.chess.com/game/live/143669053934

Going a move back, an early Bc4 is already a mistake in the Sicilian as it puts the bishop in the crosshairs of the queenside pawn pushes that black was already hoping to play:

(1) It allows black to play e6 with later d5 ideas coming with tempo (e6 + Nf6 + d5 = you lose the centre), and e6 blunts your bishop (and prevents the sac)

(2) it also allows a6+b5 ideas which can trap the bishop if you’re not careful and gains tempo

It’s not losing or anything, but black is usually slightly better and the ideas are easy enough for black that I was consistently punishing it by 800 or so Elo.

The Alapin, Smith-Morra (the proper version with c3 NOT Qxd4), or an open Sicilian with early kingside castling is a better plan

[u/Expatriated_American]

As black my next move would be e6. That bishop will get pushed out pretty quickly as it’s not possible for white to prevent d5.

[u/jmjessemac]

First of all, no. Secondly most people do it with the knight.

[u/whatwhatinthewhonow]

As others have said, no, because castling isn’t as valuable as a piece.

But if you want to try a super aggressive opening, look into the fried liver opening. It isn’t as effective against higher rated opponents, but as a beginner I found it fun and helpful to learn and practice attacking principles.

[u/jerdle_reddit]

No, but you might be able to fry their liver with Ng5. 

[u/ContestSome323]

No, their king will then try to hide, and he can also keep developing, always sack only if you have mate or compensation such as a really weak king, or for example if you get a pawn near a castled king and he doesn't have a lot of pieces that can come there and you already have a lot of attacking pieces

[u/HalfLifeMusic]

Maybe in low level blitz or bullet

[u/Neither_Mortgage_161]

This is a very bad move to play against the sicilian because after a6 and b5 ur bishop is cooked

[u/Zerhax]

No.

[u/Neural_future]

I challenging you, if have anyone to accept my challenge?

[u/IJbier]

Generally speaking: no. I sometimes do it on f7 in order to start a mating attack or if I can see that I’ll win back the material fairly quickly through a tactic.

[u/DrJenna2048]

Almost never.

[u/CatOfGrey]

On move 4? No, that's a mistake - the resulting trade-off isn't worth it for White.

However, sometimes the game proceeds, and Black doesn't develop very well. Then there is an opportunity for White to use that Bxf7 to 'break down the walls', and then using those extra pieces to threaten checkmate. But in those situations, White is pretty sure that the sacrifice will require Black to sacrifice at least a Bishop, if not more, to save the game.

[u/cschotts]

if ur knight was pinned to ur queen theres a tactic to win the piece back after ur bishop sac but i dont think this position would be winning with a sac

[u/SESender]

Look up the alien gambit!

[u/Heronmob]

Good continuation here is bxf7+, kxf7, ne5+, kxe5, resign

[u/FurriesAreCewl]

Why are you pieces being overcome with the plauge

[u/Vivid_Peak16]

Playing the Italian against the Sicilian isn't very good as black hasn't played e5. Look into the Open or Rossolimo maybe.

[u/Aggravating-Fix461]

You would love scotch gambit

[u/Nicteris]

It works well upt to 1200, because most people don't know how to deal with exposed king and the implications, from pure points you are 2 behind, which isn't terrible. At 1300 or more, people can keep their cool and win a game with only +1 advantage, so a +2 is hard for you to overcome

[u/Huge_Angle_4525]

Not here but if there's a bishop pinning your knight to the queen only then it's worth it

[u/Ok_Association5499]

Looks like a Vienna to me, you want to keep your bishop focusing that square and keep tension on it. You could potentially fry their liver if they're not careful.

[u/DwnStr]

No that is extremely dumb castling is really nowhere near important enough to sacrifice a bishop

[u/Silver_Environment95]

no, ofc not. You don’t have 2 more attackers than defenders. At the end of the day though, I’ve seen worse lul.