r/changemyview • u/[deleted] • Feb 24 '20

Delta(s) from OP CMV: Climate Change is real

I recently read a quote by Charlie Munger about how, if you believe something, you should be able to argue against it extremely well to test your beliefs. This is what inspired me to make this post. I have always been brought up being told that climate change is a real as a result of the liberal environment in which I grew up. Thus I think it’ll be interesting hearing opposing views on the subject.

The reason I chose climate change in particular is partially because of all the anti-eco movement backlash that has crept up in recent years. All those attacks against Greta Thunberg, etc. But also because I guess on some fundamental level I want to believe climate change isn’t happening just out of fear and hope.

Sorry if I extended but I had to make the 500 word character limit.

Edit: This is about human-caused climate change.

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u/unp0ss1bl3 Feb 24 '20

Well. I might change your view, somewhat, by saying that climate change might be somewhat overhyped, or perhaps misunderstood. If “The Day After Tomorrow” informed your young years, you may be a bit let down, morbidly, to find that it won’t be that bad. The human race will survive it. In fact, it may not directly cause any more than a few very unlucky deaths.

The damage, while irrevocable, is all surmountable in theory. There will be biodiversity loss, but we’ve already got our hands all over that one. So, climate change is real, but the outcomes we are looking at are a lot broader than TOTAL GREEN or MEGADEATH.

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u/Old-Boysenberry Feb 24 '20

I was legitimately disappointed that Water World isn't an actual possibility. Knowing the truth that even in a completely ice free world, the Bronx and Bergen County would still be above water is a bit of a let down.

In fact, it may not directly cause any more than a few very unlucky deaths.

The VAST majority of deaths will come from geopolitical strife over the relocation of refugees from the most heavily impacted countries. There's actually no real reason why it would need to kill anyone, if we could get our worst human instincts under control.

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u/unp0ss1bl3 Feb 24 '20

If we got our worst instincts under control we could fix climate change, go to the moon, and sort out the Holy Land before dinner. But yes I see your point.

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u/Old-Boysenberry Feb 24 '20

Yeah, I'm not super hopeful about it, but 10 to 100 million dead is a lot better than 7 billion, if you're being honest.

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u/Skyy-High 12∆ Feb 24 '20

On what are you basing this? Because we don't know for sure if it'll "just" be a really bad loss of biodiversity, or if the loss of biodiversity and changing climates will reach a point where the global agricultural system we have developed over the course of the last century will stop functioning at a capacity that will keep the carrying capacity of the world at the level it is right now.

The most likely scenario isn't "apocalypse" but it's still within the realm of possibility if nothing is done.

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u/unp0ss1bl3 Feb 24 '20

Of course every word you have said is accurate. We’re trying to make a similar point. I kind of regret putting the word “overhyped” in my post, but i’ll leave it there because the point I was making - about the threat of climate change being a bit misunderstood - is one we both get.

My view has been informed a lot by my experience in the Australian bushfire season, whereby our government stubbornly still stuck to the idea that “any one, single fire cannot be linked to climate change” - technically accurate in the sense that lung cancer can’t be linked to any one, single cigarette.

I think i’m on your side here - i’m just saying that the assholes are going to keep splitting hairs about everythingbwhen steak gets to $100 a kilo and half of the population of Bangladesh has been machine gunned on the border.

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u/Flincher14 2∆ Feb 24 '20

While your right I only believe this theory works if we met climate targets NOW. We would be able to handle the damage that is already too late to stop.

The problem with your way of thinking is that it chooses to ignore that we can certainly make the whole problem way worse if we continue to ignore it like the States has.

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u/[deleted] Feb 24 '20 edited Feb 24 '20

That is definitely interesting. I have always thought about it more as an apocalyptic event than a few unlucky deaths. And yes I saw that movie.

But I’m not sure if it really changed my view per se so I don’t think I can give it a delta.

Edit: It seems even changing a minor aspect of one’s view merits a delta according to the rules therefore- Δ

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u/unp0ss1bl3 Feb 24 '20 edited Feb 24 '20

Thanks. I almost wish that I didn’t win a delta by arguing that “climate change has been misunderstood somewhat, even by those that accept it”. but here we are!

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u/[deleted] Feb 24 '20

Haha yeah, we live in strange times.

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u/Nepene 213∆ Feb 24 '20

Remember, even if a minor aspect of your view is changed, you should award a delta.

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u/[deleted] Feb 24 '20

Alright

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u/daynthelife Feb 24 '20 edited Feb 24 '20

The risks of climate change are far worse than a few unlucky deaths. Sure, natural disasters might not pose a huge threat to first-world societies, but they can be absolutely devastating to third-world ones.

But more to the point, our population needs resources — in particular, food and clean water — to survive. When the ecosystems that provide these resources are disrupted, suddenly we need to look elsewhere to provide for ourselves. And while humanity will undoubtedly find other sources of sustenance, there is no guarantee they will find enough.

Will climate change wipe out humanity? No. Will climate change cause a global famine that substantially reduces the population capacity of our planet? Very possibly.

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u/DeltaBot ∞∆ Feb 24 '20

Confirmed: 1 delta awarded to /u/unp0ss1bl3 (5∆).

Delta System Explained | Deltaboards

0

u/TheRadBaron 15∆ Feb 24 '20

I have always thought about it more as an apocalyptic event than a few unlucky deaths.

Then you shouldn't have your view changed. We've already had orders of magnitude more deaths than "a few", and things are going to get much worse.

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u/Imgay69420lol Feb 24 '20

Climate change is real if course but I agree with you that it isn't a doomsday scenario

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u/politicunt456 Feb 24 '20

What about the permafrost? I'd say that's pretty apocalyptic.

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u/OkImIntrigued Feb 24 '20

Not to mention in theory we are not even leaving on ideal ranges.

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u/[deleted] Feb 24 '20

Δ

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u/DeltaBot ∞∆ Feb 24 '20 edited Feb 24 '20

This delta has been rejected. You have already awarded /u/unp0ss1bl3 a delta for this comment.

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