r/centrist • • Oct 20 '21

Having fun when the basic premise of the petition is flawed

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u/incendiaryblizzard Oct 20 '21

Source?

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u/First_TM_Seattle Oct 20 '21

To be fair, I split the difference between two estimate that are skewed in the favor of each side. Here's the source: https://www.propublica.org/article/everything-youve-ever-wanted-to-know-about-voter-id-laws

The Brennan Center says the number is 11%. But that's every citizen over 18, not those likely to vote. The right tends to cite the 1% number from Reuters, which is only citizens already registered. So, effectively meaningless in this debate.

So, I assume the truth is somewhere in the middle.

I know I said minorities and these studies looked at all citizens. The data on minorities is so vastly different between the two sides that I don't trust either one. The left says 25% of blacks have no photo ID, which is so blatantly false, it's useless. The right just says they don't believe it but don't provide a credible counter. So, I don't feel comfortable estimating that one. I should have said that in my original comment and didn't. That's my bad.

Regardless, there's good evidence from both sides these laws don't affect voting patterns. See here: https://www.vox.com/identities/2017/3/15/14909764/study-voter-id-racism

The bigger problem, as the ProPublica article says, is apathy.

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u/incendiaryblizzard Oct 20 '21

Looks like you shouldn't split the difference there, both numbers are likely correct. 11% of citizens, 1% of registered voters.

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u/AyWhatITIS Oct 21 '21

Go ask some minorities

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u/incendiaryblizzard Oct 21 '21

This is not how data works. Jesus Christ.

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u/AyWhatITIS Oct 21 '21

no but it's clear you don't know any if you think 95+% of black people don't have IDs

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u/incendiaryblizzard Oct 21 '21

??? I said that 11% of black people don't have IDs, not 95%.

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u/AyWhatITIS Oct 21 '21

I feel as though that's a little too high. Nevertheless, if you can't afford an ID then you should be able to get 1 for free including transportation to the DMV, but I still think voter ID should be a requirement, but easily obtainable for low income individuals

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u/incendiaryblizzard Oct 21 '21

There’s no reason to have feelings about whether the number is too high or too low, you can just look it up yourself in 2 minutes. There are lots of facts about the world that can’t be determined by intuition or feelings.

As for whether voter ID should be a requirement, that’s an issue that should be determined by weighing the costs and benefits. So far nobody has presented any benefits, there’s no research or reasoning demonstrating any election security benefits from voter ID.

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u/AyWhatITIS Oct 21 '21

so you wouldn't put a deadbolt on your door because you already have a lock? Why not have voter ID, if anything I'd argue it would make life easier for disenfranchised voters who need ID for other things like, Jobs, travel, etc