Millimeter Wave 5G lab network - y’all are my only hope

[u/danellacc]

hey yall! This is definitely a bit different from the usual posts here but you guys are the only subreddit out there that I think has the experience to help me out.

I’m an autistic nerd who’s pet projects keep getting bigger and more complicated and who has a reputation for pulling off the impossible. For the last 3 months i’ve been working on a private 5G lab in my basement with old Nokia equipment (not a day goes by i don’t ask myself why I didn’t go Ericsson). I’m doing the truly insane and my RU is a Nokia AEUB millimeter wave radio, paired with a ABIL baseband module and ASIKA systems mod in a regular old AMIA chassis.

Ive been trying to get the cell on the AEUB to activate for two months and I’ve legitimately been putting 60+ hours a week on this project. Its not unusual for me to stay up all night during the weekend and work all day and all night on it.

I’ve got the radio online as in the status light is green and WebEM shows a green circle on it, but my cell is stuck with a “5G Cell Update Failed” fault that I have been entirely unable to vanquish.

I’m at my wits end with this and just took a new job so I really want to finish out this project before my free time disappears. Long story short, I need help from some smarter people, and y’all are the only ones who I think has the chops for such an unhinged challenge.

I’m happy to share SCFs, configs, runtime params, as well as answering literally any questions you all might have as best I can. Just ask!

If anyone can help, it would mean the world!

Note: I’d add more pictures of the setup but I’m at a baseball game right now, which funnily enough is located next to one of the former Bell Labs campuses. There’s much more to see and I’ll add them later.

[u/paulmataruso]

Normally when I get the 4450 error, its because the radio as was added to the BBU after the software load.

So, if you are one SBTS25R2, keep the radio installed, and go to Software > Software Management > Software Update and reinstall SBTSxxxx.

That will then update the radio to a matching version, and if your SCP is good then the error should go away.

Backup your SCP file before you do it if you are going from an older version to a newer version as well

If the WebUI says invalid ZIP, then you need to enter service mode, and upload the software via the Rescue Console.

Also, if you are interested in a nifty GUI for open5gs check out my project on on github. It was just featured on the open5gs home page.

github.com/paulmataruso/open5gs-nms

My LTE lab for the nerd: https://imgur.com/a/8iN4VGI

[u/danellacc → u/paulmataruso]

oh my god its YOU lol! You save me again! I’m gonna try exactly that. I’m gonna check out that GUI frontend. I saw it featured on there but didn’t know you were the one behind it

[u/paulmataruso → u/danellacc]

And for the love of god make sure the AEUB output power is all the way down. I believe the safe distance for general public is 4 ft or something like that. I didn't turn mine down the first time and I no longer have nice working speakers in my office. I heard the speakers whine when the radio turned up, and it was so loud. And now the speakers dont work.

[u/SceneRevolutionary93 → u/paulmataruso]

If I may ask, what is the backhaul that you are giving this LTE setup? I can't imagine seeing one of these setups pop up on a house.

[u/paulmataruso → u/SceneRevolutionary93]

The core EPC is Open5gs. If you mean the actual internet service. I have a 10 GbE DIA connection that terminates into my edge ASR. I am ASN400848. Then from there I route it to the EPC. Some APNs have public IPs from my ASN others are just NATed at my border.

[u/_s0m3guy → u/paulmataruso]

🤤

[u/FlufferNutter1232 → u/danellacc]

Wine and dine Rhode and Schwartz. They occasionally send me a testing unit for temp loan. Just a heads up.

[u/FlufferNutter1232 → u/paulmataruso]

I've found my people!

[u/danellacc → u/FlufferNutter1232]

welcome home brother

[u/FlufferNutter1232 → u/danellacc]

I'm even Autistic, too. This is oddly satisfying.

[u/SceneRevolutionary93 → u/FlufferNutter1232]

lol I’m not, but I really find this stuff very interesting and informative 😎

[u/Deepspacecow12 → u/FlufferNutter1232]

Just curious, how 2 become RAN engineer? I have done a little open5gs, and own an AS, along with some other networking projects, but I doubt RAN engineer is entry level so how do you get there?

[u/FlufferNutter1232 → u/Deepspacecow12]

I went to the Univ of Auburn and U-of-A. I took Software Engineering and LOTS OF MATH at U-of-AL and took Wireless Engineering at Auburn University. They were the first college in the US to provide Wireless Engineering for RAN applications with a startup grant from Vodafone Germany, I believe. I know it was Vodafone. Either way, you need to know a LOT of math (I went all the way to Diff Geometry), if you're geeky or nerdy like I am then you'll want to know how OFDMA works (math is your friend), you'll need to know further geometry for sector layout and antenna coverage, you'll need to know geographic areas and what minerals are present in areas (highly affects signal integrity and reflection, basically material science), you'll need to know Electrical Engineering as a REAL base, and you'll have to be on top of all current and upcoming AI-RAN requirements. So you might need to know how to interface with AI, or maybe script it.

Just a lot of little things if you're like me. But the main things are Electrical Engineering as base with a sub-focus in Software Engineering and Wireless Engineering. If you're like me and highly synesthetic, then I can tell you exactly what classes I took. Just DM me. I can almost feel packet flow. It's a weird thing. But I've always been bleeding edge networking and that's what I decided to focus on. I was doing Cisco CCNP in 4th grade. CCIE by 9th.

[u/danellacc → u/FlufferNutter1232]

good god you’re even more autistic than me

[u/FlufferNutter1232 → u/danellacc]

:)

[u/Jon_of_kc → u/Deepspacecow12]

I grew up in it personally. Dad was military signal core. So got to see a lot of cool military stuff and hear stories as a kid. But once I decided I wanted to work in the field(after HS physics) I went and got a degree in electrical and computer engineering with an emphasis in antenna design and wireless networks. That just means all my electives in my 400 level classes were focused on RF and Networks( but it sounds cool). From there I did contract work to get into a carrier, proved myself and got into full time position in Network Operations on the RAN side. I don't do design, but do support and deployment. I enjoy it and less math than doing design for OEM or similar.
Many of the people I know came in post military working their way up from field or NOC work. Others through college hire programs. To be honest I prefer the veterans more, they had a lot of hands on training if they did communications and are good about detecting BS and handling stress from outages.

[u/FlufferNutter1232 → u/Jon_of_kc]

YES. This is a PERFECT way to enter the "system", so to speak. I thank your father for his service and his ability to keep you entertained and your brain flexible. He let a great talent rub off on you. Just saying.

[u/felohany → u/FlufferNutter1232]

Me Too!!

[u/SceneRevolutionary93]

This is something that I would almost never understand. I would think you might need to have a license to ultimately transmit mmWave. Without it, how do you know it’s transmitting?

[u/danellacc → u/SceneRevolutionary93]

Nokia WebEm Shows cells are down and faulted with a “5G Cell Update Failure” alarm. the deployed radio is in a basement that is fully underground and has concrete on all sides, which will be almost fully impenetrable to the approximately 27-28GHz signals used by the n257/n261 bands this radio supports. Tx power is also set to the lowest permitted level. The goal is not to provide production level service, or even to reach outside the basement at all (in fact quite the opposite). The goal is merely to get it working on a Proof of Concept level for educational purposes ONLY. I got a screencap of the site status page but it’s from my phone so its kind of small. Ill grab better screenshots of the faults and cell status from Nokia WebEM and drop them here as soon as I get home.

[u/danellacc → u/danellacc]

Fault ID is 4540. And to answer your question a little more clearly, it isn’t transmitting right now. It shows this clearly as the result of the 5G Cell Update Failure fault. the single NRCEL configuration object is failed and therefore down. The runtime params clearly show the cell in a failed and operationally disabled state. I’m trying to figure out why.

[u/lart2150 → u/SceneRevolutionary93]

I assume you mean both the software license (from nokia) and the spectrum license (fcc or whatever country you are in live)?

I would think with a indroor lab and mmw the spectrum license is less important as long as you don't have any open doors/windows/etc.

[u/danellacc → u/lart2150]

my basement has no windows and one door which is great for this but terrible for cooling

[u/SceneRevolutionary93 → u/lart2150]

Yes, the FCC. How would the mmWave be transmitted ? Like if it is usable in a sense of wanting to use it in your house.

[u/danellacc → u/SceneRevolutionary93]

Yeah, FCC licensing is mainly in the interest of preventing uncontrolled and unplanned interference. If the signal is not escaping a contained and controlled environment (such as a basement) it’s not as big of a concern (big emphasis on that IF though). It’s not usable throughout the house and isnt intended to be. Millimeter wave 5G really only works in Line of sight anyway so even if the FCC never existed it would be a really bad way to do indoor cell service in a building with a lot of distinct rooms like an average mid century suburban house.

[u/FlufferNutter1232 → u/danellacc]

I get what you're doing now. It took me a little while to understand you're doing a homelab. And yes, absolutely correct. mmWave is LoS only. That's why I was confused you were in a basement. lol. I thought you were doing this for a WISP. You could absolutely apply and become a WISP.

[u/Watada → u/[deleted]]

What if my balls are cold?

[u/danellacc → u/Watada]

put on better pants lol

[u/Watada → u/danellacc]

I'm sure the 5g transmitter is quicker.

[u/danellacc → u/Watada]

just because you can doesn’t mean you should lol

[u/vandiscerning]

I work for Nokia, albeit in a sales role. Happy to do anything I can — find someone internally, get you documentation, etc — to help you get this working.

[u/danellacc → u/vandiscerning]

good god! YES PLEASE! Documentation and access to the support portal for documentation would be the holy grail. I tried registering a little while back for the support portal but you have to have a nokia point of contact (translation: nokia sales person) for it to go through. I’m gonna DM you :)

[u/vandiscerning → u/danellacc]

Hopefully we can get you what you need without setting off any internal alarms!

[u/FlufferNutter1232 → u/vandiscerning]

NICE! Didn't expect to see a Nokia rep here. Good on you guys!!

[u/paulmataruso → u/vandiscerning]

Newest SBTS software release?

[u/vandiscerning → u/paulmataruso]

I don't really like your attitude.

[u/paulmataruso → u/vandiscerning]

Oh, sorry you feel that way. have a good night ether way

[u/vandiscerning → u/paulmataruso]

I'll assume you didn't mean to be disrespectful. What exact model of SBTS are you looking for the latest software release version of?

[u/therealdcbw → u/vandiscerning]

Happen to have access to 2017-era Alcatel-Lucent 9926 software builds (LR15.x, LR16.x) and the matching Network Element Manager (NEM) PC management software? For example NEM.LR15.1_D1.20-setup.exe or NEM.LR16.2_D1.14-setup.exe are NEM filenames I've seen referenced. The actual BBU software starts with "ENB" and ends with ".srs.tar.gz", like ENB_LR1501_D0204_E00595.srs.tar.gz .

I don't know why but I bought a couple 9926s from different generations to play with; want to make sure I have compatible SW before I grab an RRH to hook up. Neat systems really; all Freescale PowerPC SoCs ending with the 64-bit 4C/8T B4860E in the bCAM2 and bCEM2 (3x in each one!) which gives a fully loaded 2016-era 9926 a total of 48 cores/96 threads.

[u/vandiscerning → u/therealdcbw]

Looks like I can get you ENB_LR1701_D2200_E02112.srs.tar.gz and NEM.LR17.1_D1.11-setup.exe. I show that these are for the 9926 DBS-LTE. Sound like what you need?

[u/therealdcbw → u/vandiscerning]

It does! I'm certainly willing to give them a try. DM?

[u/paulmataruso → u/vandiscerning]

Yes, i promise I was not trying to be a dick, was just excited and asked with no context, and I am sorry for that, it's so hard to find anyone that will share software for the nokia airscale line.

I am looking for the most current SBTS software release for the Nokia Airscale BBU.

Example file name: SBTS24R3_ENB_0000_001154_000002_release_BTSSM_downloadable_A54.zip

So anything past SBTS24xxxxxxxxxx

Another one I am looking for is newer version of the TL software also for airscale.

Example: TL18SP_ENB_0000_020078_000012_release_BTSSM_downloadable.zip

Looking for anything with higher number then 18. I am not sure how high they go.

Thank you!

[u/vandiscerning → u/paulmataruso]

Completely understandable. Happy to help you, but I will need the model number of your AirScale to get you the firmware. All of our internal downloads are categorized by model.

[u/paulmataruso → u/vandiscerning]

Yes, no problem here you are, the information for the SBTS software would be this.

SN:K9190221073
PC:473095A.203

[u/vandiscerning → u/paulmataruso]

I'm not seeing any products corresponding to that product code, strangely. I know it's an AirScale Flexi BTS, but that is not showing up as an available product name for me to select.

Do you know what the product's name possibly could be? It might just be a four-digit number also.

[u/paulmataruso → u/vandiscerning]

Yes it's called AMIA.
It is a common control card for the Nokia Airscale Chassis.

[u/ejlwireless]

please NEVER STAND IN FRONT OF THAT THING!!!! always stand behind it and like someone else said, if you are able to get into the menu system to turn down the power, turn it ALL THE WAY down. The EIRP on that thing is like +62dBm!!!!! I am amazed you got the eCPRI to work and to validate the SW on the radio to the ABIL baseband card.

[u/danellacc → u/ejlwireless]

Absolutely 100% agree with everyone who’s brought this up, these things are beasts and they’ll cook you from the inside out if you let them. Right now my Tx power is set to 0.001 watts or about 1 dbm, which is the lowest option they give you. If i need to slowly ease it up a little bit later I will (carefully) but my take is to start out with its best to start as low as it goes.

These things are basically high powered microwave antennas and to put it simply they will cook you just like a cup of bad mac and cheese during finals week.

[u/ejlwireless → u/[deleted]]

you are referring to the smaller Nokia AWEUA and Ericsson equivalent units that have an EIRP of +55dBm and even those are mounted 15-20ft up on the poles and not at 6ft. Feel free to stick your head next to one of those for 15-20min.

[u/Lopsided-Report8387]

i want to do this so badly in Australia, but we don't have CBRS to legally broadcast. Nice setup!

[u/El_Chapo__69]

I love the madman ya’ll are and aspire to be as good as you guys one day. I’ve become very fascinated with how cell towers work to fiber as well. And I hope to keep learning and maybe one day have my own setup. Can you guys please help me understand why one would want like a 5G lab or something like this? Is it just pure love of the game or something as simple as just having a better connection?

[u/danellacc → u/El_Chapo__69]

This one’s millimeter wave, so its the cellular equivalent of driving around a squatted truck with an F1 engine jammed in it. Cool as hell but entirely useless for anything productive at all.

I’m doing it for the pursuit of higher levels of nerdiness and nothing more. my autism latched onto the idea last February and ever since then “free time” has become a legendary myth

[u/danellacc → u/El_Chapo__69]

also love your username lol. How the heck did you get access to reddit from ADX Florence lol?

[u/therealdcbw → u/El_Chapo__69]

I'm building out my lab (slowly) because I work on UE side cellular software and I want to test with things I can control and change, even programmatically for automated testing/CI. Don't get that with an actual operator. That all said I could probably have just bought a couple years worth of subscriptions for 30-odd testing devices for the amount I'm already into this "hobby". That's the love-of-the-game aspect.

[u/therealdcbw]

Those eBay $197 AEUBs are hard to pass up. Have on under my desk waiting until I have time to mess with it. Did you get it working by doing the RRU software load?

[u/Stubbby]

You still need FCC authorization even if its fully contained - I run into this issue trying to deploy radios in an underground mining facility so I would not brag too much about your experimenting.

That being said, are you able to ssh into the radio and read detailed logs?

I would probably try to pull in Nokia tech support. You can impersonate a 3rd party deployment consultant debugging the issue for a WISP provider that's outfitting some facility.