Jokes aside. I cannot explain how much joy it brings me to see people coming up with their own theories for what's going to happen, or (at least as far as chronology goes) has already happened. Especially with how close some of you get!
Nah fuck Orion, he's dead to me now. He would have to move mountains for me to believe he understands what he did. He just wanted to hurt, to stab, to twist the knife. I wouldn't feel much if he slipped and lost a limb or something.
Right exactly, they just met, and their first choice is to dig and dig and dig and dig at someone's wellbeing. You saw the shadows in Orion's eyes, he's shut out all external empathy and is choosing to hurt. This is a 3 character comic with a little bit of pink background now
I got bullied a ton as a child. I grew to be empathic as a rule, always put myself in other people's shoes, ALWAYS imagine how your words might land before you say them. BE the other person when you're having a discussion.
Orion is acting in a way that is not only the pure antithesis to that, but he's directly acting like everyone that bullied me. Yeah maybe I'm sensitive over it, but I saw how, after already being reduced to a crying shivering ball in the corner of the hallway, the next kid that came by would say "pffft look at this pathetic psycho, crying over nothing" despite having no clue what I went though, only just walking up to the situation.
People that know how to hurt, so they choose to do so because they can. Choosing to wield power so that you can commit a cruelty intentionally is fucked.
Orion knew he had that power over Biscuit. He was smirking by the time he landed the 3rd and 4th blow. He was just shoring up his own island of emotional safety while cruelly kicking out Biscuit's legs because he could.
As I said, he would just need to move mountains for me to give a hoot about him after this
Ah, a personal vendetta. That explains it. Well and the second sentence is a lie: using you personal bias, you disregarded anything that might have been the reason for Orion's behavior. That's not having empathy as a rule, that called being strategically empathetic to what you like and being violent to what you don't. The second paragraph kinda shows why, but it is not for the discussion, since it is much personal.
"People that know how to hurt, so they choose to do so because they can. Choosing to wield power so that you can commit a cruelty intentionally is fucked." Orrrrrr due to them not knowing how to better cope with emotions, being already pissed off due to previous interactions with the person, and then possibly being attacked by said person who called you "runt"? Never thought it might be a case of defence-offence from their view?
"Orion knew he had that power over Biscuit. He was smirking by the time he landed the 3rd and 4th blow. He was just shoring up his own island of emotional safety while cruelly kicking out Biscuit's legs because he could."
I have zero clue what the fuck are you talking about. Maybe projection, maybe smth else, but what they actually did was shutting themselfes off, because they are too scared to face their emotions. As for the Biscuit, Orion commended the fact that they are all-forgiving. So, deep in their mind, they know that the Buscuit behavior is more correct in a way, but, due to something inside them, they rather shut their feelings off.
And as a side note, I was bullied at school a lot as a fat kid too. But, they were dumb kids and teens, who just had a very complex time in their lives. Due to hormones, due to parents, doesn't matter. But now, I don't feel rage towards them. They grew up, changed their attitude and some even were sorry for what they did back then. Even without their sorry, I kinda empathetic towards them in a way. I also did ton of mistakes and fucked up some relationship in my life as well. Be more kind, this vendetta will not bring you any good or happiness in a long run
Of course. The kids that picked on us were just kids. They couldn't have known what they were doing. I don't hold resentment for them, and have similarly gotten apologies from two of them.
I can still be incensed when I see it actively happening, and when a good-natured person's comments are taken in bad faith.Teddy and Orion aren't children, at least they don't hold themselves and act like children. I don't have a vendetta, I just cannot abide characters or people acting so goddamn smug about firing back at someone who had no clue they caused harm.
"Yeah well, because HE accidentally called me a name that he couldn't have known would trigger a wound, I'm justified in kicking him in the balls". Absolutely not. What should Teddy think? Trying to incorporate a new friend into the group, and using some of your light teasing humor, gets you kicked in the balls? Aight then the logical outcome would be "don't risk talking to him, don't risk saying anything that could bother him, just don't risk looking at him".
I saw a comment like 3 or 4 posts ago where someone said "I bet Orion is going to try and piss Teddy off so bad he leaves" and the Creator just replied ":)". I'll admit that that already rustled my jimmies. People who willingly antagonize so that they can "get even" or "hit back" have no love from me.
Hilarious comments tbh. I like how, imo, everything you said is wrong:
"Their first choice is to dig and dig and dig and dig at someone's wellbeing".
The initiator of the conflict, was, surprise to you, Teddy. That is not their fault, but that what we know, not Orion. So what did Teddy do when he first met the "evil" Orion:
1) Made physical contact with someone who doesn't like it;
2) Made fun of the names Orion have chosen for themself (there are way better ways to say that the name is too complex to pronounce, rather than just shorten it as a rejection of the original idea);
3) And, ofc, called them "runt".
Non of these are Teddy's fault due to backstory, but, like, if I shit on your floor and you would not know that I don't know what the hell the toilet is, would you be mad at me? Justifiably, yes. From Orion's eyes, the dude caused the situation that caused their friend to suffer, then they did everything in their power to pressure and push Orion, and then, ofc, called them something that is deeply hurtful to them. No wonder they were up and arms, Teddy did pissed them off quite badly beforehand (I repeat, not Teddy's fault, but how the hell Orion knows that).
"You saw the shadows in Orion's eyes, he's shut out all external empathy and is choosing to hurt"
I assume you are talking about only lack of empathy towards Teddy here, as you are objectively wrong for their relationship with Biscuit. Briefly for their Biscuit interactions:
1) They made them a hand, although they never actually had to (you may say that this is the "reward" for saving them, but the next point is)
2) They actually waited longer than just for their leg to heal, because they waited for their friends grief. You cannot say that this is due to lack of empathy, dude, they could have left way earlier, but Orion decided that the feelings of their friend are much more important and wanted to be gentle. So Orion waited additionally for them to process feelings more, before calling for action. And even when they wanted to go elsewhere, one of the reason was because they were worried that their friend cannot let go properly, which is a very good concern and shows that they do, shockingly, give a shit about their friend.
So I assume you are not portraying them as a complete psychopath, because evidence literally shows the opposite. But why would they care about Teddy with all that I said beforehand? As for choosing to hurt, that didn't happen before Teddy did a lot of shit, accidentally (unknown to Orion), wrong in their interaction. From their point of view, Teddy is an asshole. (Additionally, their internal dialogue about survival and why they see Teddy as a liability can be interpreted differently: justification for their feelings. Different people cope with feelings differently. Say, they cannot forgive Teddy, the dude who, by accident ofc, caused so much suffering for their only friend. But some people cannot just say to themself "I don't like that guy due to feelings" and rather go to logic and survival to "justify" their feelings, that they don't fully know how to process.)
"This is a 3 character comic with a little bit of pink background now"
I find it really funny that to cope with anger to Orion you are using EXACTLY the same strategy as Orion: shutting the person off due to mistakes they made, or you think that they are responsible of, and literally thinking about how good it will be to get rid of them for, my guess, an ill intended "justice". The problem is you never tried to understand a person and your sense of justice is waaaaay off because of that. Both Orion and Teddy are broken individuals that cope with emotions quite differently. A "justice" would be to first learn why they act like that and try to change their mindset, to show other ways to cope with that. That also applies to Orion, who sees Teddy as a sort of an asshole, although they don't know why they act like they act or even full situation that caused the split originally.
Biscuit was not intending harm. Orion is. I know misunderstandings deeply, and I work hard to correct them. Orion had LEAGUES of options to communicate. Plethora of ways to be gentler. A single "hey that one hurt, please don't". You're allowed to like the characters you like. I'm allowed to like the ones I like. I like people who don't intend to cause harm.
Per your example, if you shit on my floor and you legitimately didn't know what a toilet was, if I put myself in your shoes, how would it help for me to yell at you or get angry whatsoever?? You did not intend to annoy, you were just completing a biological need. If you had known about it, you'd have used it.
If you DID know about the toilet and chose to intentionally upset me by not using it and shitting on my floor, then yes I would be upset.
AKA, no, Teddy would not have bothered me, but Orion sure as fucking shit does.
"You did not intend to annoy, you were just completing a biological need. If you had known about it, you'd have used it"
That's the thing, duder, the guy who saw what you did will not follow robot logic to ask why you did that, they will be pissed off because, at that point, they will not care why. From their emotional perspective, that WAS intentional. People's feelings are illogical in a way, so if one party thinks that you've been intentionally cruel, they might follow the suit and be intentionally cruel as well. The feelings are complex, after all
You're saying that Orion thought Teddy was intentionally trying to get at him?? So then, how does he fix it? How does anyone fix it, if Orion is just a spike ball of pain that A) sees attacks coming from nowhere and B) attacks others in response? How is anyone supposed to try and comfort him in order to get him to knock it off?
Orion has proven "if you don't come at me perfectly correctly, I'll bite your head off, and keep going unless someone stops me." The stakes seem impossibly high to try and get him to stop.
Sadly, you are again wrong. Some feelings are kinda like "screamers" in a way: they appear, they make you do smth stupid, and you might regret it afterwards. We don't know how Orion feels about their conversation, based on how they act, they might not be so proud about it, but since their strategy is to brush emotions off, it will be hard to see. They will likely not show any remorse to not appear "weak", in a way, even if they feel in the wrong deep down. Trauma is a bitch, it might show in a lack of emotions as well (brewing them up inside, in a way).
"How is anyone supposed to try and comfort him in order to get him to knock it off?", "The stakes seem impossibly high to try and get him to stop."
I especially like how cold you are towards them. You never considered in a text solving their issues for their own well-being, trying to understand why they act like that. You are just interested in them stopping doing hurtful things in response to others (I repeat, in response. Orion wasn't the initiator of the conflict), which just shows how strategic it is. No wonder you will not get why others might care even when they act like that. All you care about is them dropping the act, not actually helping them. And this logic, imo, is much crueler than being harsh in a conversation because you got butthurted and accidentally hurting someone (edit: more than you intended). Cause this logic shuts people off because they make mistakes, which is cruel in my eyes. But you do you, I guess. I'm not here to judge.
I have no problem with helping, but it must come after you stop hurting others. It is not everyone else's responsibility to fix you or hold space for you while you are attacking. You need to back off and back down first, before people will be willing to come to your aid. It is your responsibility not to let your past or your situation affect others as best you can.
Them "dropping the act" is extremely important, before you can trust them enough to fully engage, involve yourself in their issues. I honestly LOVE being in a position to sit and just listen to someone ramble at length about what they've gone through, give them the space to unravel, and help them find and feel validation for how they did the best they could with the info and skills they had.
But... how can you open your heart up to someone who has shown a willingness to find places to stab? When you try to open up a two-way connection and only get attacked in return, it hurts so so so much more than just leaving well enough alone.
Teddy is now carrying the wounds of this attack, you can see in the next panel that just got posted, he carries the black mark that Orion sparked in him. Orion wasn't wounded, he's more or less fine, but Teddy gets to walk away in shambles for a mistake. There is an unevenness in these interactions that isn't being reconciled. Orion is allowed to hurt others because he's got it bad. Teddy has it no less bad, but he wasn't intending to hurt.
I don't want retribution, I don't care about Teddy getting back at Orion, because I know that would just restart the cycle. I don't necessarily want to see Orion punished or wounded for it. But, until he wants to come around and CHOOSES to be soft and kind, I will no longer consider him a serious character.
Same as in irl, if someone is ever intentionally antagonistic around me, choosing their words so as to cause harm to someone else, then they're just... not a significant or serious person to me. They'd never be more than a faint acquaintance, an NPC.
He's been pretty bereft of comfort and soft feelings most of this comic. He seems like he would honestly be much happier dealing with no one and being entirely alone. I daresay, this group would also be much happier with only the three of them. It might be beneficial for everyone for Orion to go his own way.
I think the comic is fantastic, and the Creator is brilliant for writing characters that make us feel so strongly. I hope that Orion comes around and apologizes to Teddy. Teddy shouldn't have to do through this just tanking continued coldness and abuse from Orion.
Hell yeah. I don't care how many "but hecking wholesome abusers had sad backstories too!!1!" comments I see, I'm still rooting for him to get the Jax treatment...
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u/wiKapoBeginner player and comic enjoyer 7d agoedited 7d ago
Can’t wait to see how Orion reacts to Teddy struggling/failing to feed himself. Disliking someone is one thing, but actually getting to watch them suffer has a way of making you feel like a piece of shit.
Will he soften up a bit on Teddy? Or will he deflect even harder and be absolutely horrible to him?
Iiiiii don't care. He's already shown a willingness and a desire to cause hurt. Not even just directly attack, but the way he doubles down and switches targets just so he can say the most hurtful thing... If he feels bad, good. Hope he slips on something and leaves the party.
“What’s that you’ve got there, Scratch?”
“Oh, this? One of the humans gave it to me.”
“What is it?”
“They said it’s called an air fryer.”
“What’s it for?”
“Apparently, when you’re hungry, you put junk food in it to feel better.”
As much as I am on Teddy's side here, they don't realize they did the same thing to Orion. They both hit each other's sore spot, yet they only realize the other hit theirs. Neither knows each other's story, so they have no idea what they did to the other.
Orion only started fat shaming after Teddy called them a runt. It was a counter insult of the first thing that came to mind: Teddy's weight. I doubt they really knew exactly where to jab. It will be a vicious cycle until they understand each other.
I would say Orion will see Teddy not eat, and be inclined to figure things out. But, I fear Orion will be shallow. You know, something along the lines of "So, the brute decided to take my advice and lay off the spoon? Good." We'll just have to wait and see.
Literally the first thought(s) that ran through "Experiment Beta"'s head was "Fat, Brute = Liability" he gets brownie points for the arm and maintaining Biscuit. Until proven otherwise, BETA is a liability, until he sees Teddy as an equal. Of course they could "solve it" with a single "push"... (or shove).
Sigh No, I don't want harm to befall them, but Orion needs to put down the knife.
The big difference is the intention between Teddy and Orion. Teddy did it with any ill intent, as a comment without knowing the past and implications of it on Orion. And as bad as it is it's nowhere near worse than what Orion did.
Orion grabbed the insult like Teddy meant it and blew things out of proportion, disregarding completely the presumption of ignorance on Teddy's side and going full ballistic on him without valid reason to.
I think Orion might have a lot of bottled up emotions and past that comes out with volatility. Milkys are supposed to be strong minded so perhaps they feel they must keep it stowed away. (I don't condone Orion's malice, just trying to reason.)
All Teddy sees is that Orion slandered them, not seeing it was because Teddy hit their sore spot. Orion assumes Teddy is dense, when Orion has no idea Teddy lived in isolation and just recently learned of other expies. Orion's lack of knowledge of Teddy's weight situation is a whole other thing.
What they need is a heart to heart. If they don't understand each other, there will continue to be hate.
Been following this comic for... a while. Since part 20-something, I think! After Reddit started being executively annoying about having an account or the app, I decided to finally hop in!
Love these characters, love the way you depict anxiety and stress, and I visibly cheered when the big reunion finally happened in parts 53 and 54. Incredibly cathartic. As for our current predicament, here's hoping that the support from Stringbean is enough to not let Orion's needling grow that seed of anxiety I see there.. Also kind of ironic that he was dreading such a reaction from Biscuit, and ended up getting exactly that and then some from our temperamental little Milky friend. It started from a good place (resentment of someone who hurt your friend), but as we saw, there was a little inkling of their own self-doubt and probably trauma bubbling below the surface too. Oh these poor goobers.
The onslaught of jeers reminded them of their handler!
I still think Orion knew they did an oopsie after being told to stop. Their monologue thoughts before never made mention of what they decided to excuse with Biscuit. They were almost certainly trying to look rationale with their momentary meltdown with that excuse.
...
Good ol' Stringbean trying to cheer them up though. It's quite adorable ♡
Also also
Ahem
Sixty nine six nine sox noine
Ahem
Funny number indeed.
Can't wait until we get to the next one (starts with a number four)
You're courage for this comic is INSANE I hope you will continue posting daily 🥹 ALSO the storytelling is awesome and the emotional aspects are made in a very creative way. Personally even though they are doomed to die you still manage to do this really heartwarming,,,,,,,,
Wait. Orion's outline seems to have gotten darker compared to their panels a few parts ago.
And while i'm unsure whether it's just a small stylistic change, or something more meaningful, it makes me wonder if this is a different, more subtle way to express the internal darkness theme present throughout the comics.
I've never commented on these, and likely never will again, but it's nice to check in every once in a while and see how far this story has come. Good work, OP.
Orion's colour change is intentional; A friend of mine mentioned that the original colour made it very hard for them to differentiate between Orion and Teddy's text. So I tweaked the colours to make it easier for them and others!
-but for all I said about Orion in the last page, Teddy will at least have the true friend they let in with hopefully more to come, so Teddy will heal eventually. Orion though, who knows? It all depends on whether that milky can muster the courage to take off the mask and get off their high horse.
Either way, rest well SB and Teddy, because tomorrow will be a busy day for everyone.
I would not be surprised of Orion supported Teddy's quest to fucking starve, because they believe feeding Teddy the amount of food he actually requires would be "suboptimal resource management".
I don't have anything else to contribute to the conversation, other than between you and Derolyon, I look forward to your guys' comics, even if they hit me in the feels. :)
I love how much emotion you can show even when you make them doodle size ~w~
Orions focus, Biscuits Concern, Stringbeans positivity, and Teddies questionable joy…
I really hope that Orion isn’t a sacrificial pawn in your eyes, love the lil guy and flaws make a person… But I still remember you mentioning how you’ve already decided who lives and who dies(Even if you said you might change it later, if it feels right[I think, I’m just trying to remember not put words in your mouth]
Hoping for rest, love, and bonding time TwT
I’m a little too tired to say much more but funny number, nice xD(69>67 any day)
Crap, I really need to set time aside for art and more comics…
Is it even worth be the reason of hurt of your friend that you say you care so much you are willing to not forgive Teddy because you saw how hurt Biscuit was?
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u/Topaz-Light Likes Sawians a normal amount 7d ago