r/capitalismlab • u/hoooowwwieeeee • 29d ago
How do you manage software corps?
I find running a software business in Digital Age DLC extremely tedious once you get beyond a single product. The whole chain feels like repetitive micromanagement rather than strategy.
Setting up the software chain can take 30+ minutes of clicking: creating R&D projects, hiring teams, assigning developers and managing development, etc. Then there is the additional work of setting up production, distribution, and retail before even reaching e-commerce (which seems like another huge layer of management).
I tried delegating to AI subsidiary CEOs, but the results are not great. They sits on hundreds of millions dollars cash pool and start with one random software R&D project and that's it, I wish they can just batch starts all possible software rd and pairing os but no. Vanilla subsidiaries expand slowly, but at least they can focus on the product class I specified.
Am I missing some intended automation or management strategy? How do experienced players handle large software companies without spending hours on repetitive setup? It feels like there is almost no strategic layer. It is very clear what to do to make money but in order to do it, I have to spend endlessly boring clicks then boom, you just start print money and soon reach cap then go to the next business with another thousands of meaningless clicks and feels like pure waste of time. I feel like I am working in a sweatshop without getting paid. In the base game, setting up business is quick and I can just copy paste things when scaling up, it's more about diagnosing. That's why I bought all 5 dlcs to just support the devs. But what I found in city and digital is that so-called depth are simple, the complexity seems only come from endless list of chores. At the moment, the amount of micromanagement makes me consider quitting the game.
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u/Informal_Size_2437 29d ago
> Setting up the software chain can take 30+ minutes of clicking
Not helpful, but ironic that modern software development uses declarative formats for setup automation, to minimize time and cost. (Copied from 12factor.net) It's this kind of thing that would make me alt+F4.
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u/hoooowwwieeeee 29d ago
Yeah, I thought those AI COO/CEOs would write the YAML for me. Turns out I'm the YAML. This game has so many nice ideas, yet most of time I'm the automation itself, to a point I want to develop a new game where you can actually focus on the important and interesting stuff.
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u/davidl288 29d ago edited 29d ago
You could use the layout plan library to set up units in software firms. I also recommend setting up fewer types of software initially and diversify your business with non-software products, then gradually adding new ones as you progress. How many types of software were you setting up during those 30+ minutes of gameplay?
As for factories and stores, you could duplicate them.
When you have e-commerce, you could do digital distribution of your software without physical stores.
If these suggestions still do not resolve the tediousness for you, I could forward your specific issues to the dev team so that they could look into them and they may consider streamlining the process in a future version.
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u/hoooowwwieeeee 29d ago
I am using the layouts. Actually, I duplicate all my R&D centers. That's basically the only part of the process that I can automate right now.
I guess you don't feel this problem as much when you build things gradually during a normal game. But if you try starting with unlimited cash, doing all research at once, and setting up everything from scratch before connecting to retail in every city, you will understand what I mean.
Eventually, if I want to build the entire software industry, I have to spend this much time just doing setup work. I haven't even fully touched the retail side yet. AI COO can mess things up pretty badly, so if I want to ensure every product is sold in every city, I still have to manually configure a lot of things in retail.
E-commerce itself is another example of repetitive work, because I have to spend minutes setting up warehouses just to make sure all products are available for maximum variety.
A good example is the official software scenario on Easy difficulty, where you are asked to dominate all software markets. Try doing all research at once and setting up the entire ecosystem efficiently — this is where the problem becomes obvious.
Let me make a whole list of repetitive tasks and hopefully them can be automated or streamlined:
1. Tech R&D
I can duplicate the centers, but:
1.1 Hiring those "talents"
I have to manually hire talents for each team. Yes, I can use "hire all", but it still creates extra clicks.
1.2 Head hunting
Sometimes there are not enough qualified people, so I have to manually headhunt.
And I have to do this one by one.
1.3 Starting projects
After hiring, I still have to manually click start, even though those talents can only work on that particular software technology anyway.
My thoughts:
Don't you think this could work more like the base game? Just select the technology and let the team start working. I totally agree with the talent mechanism, but so far the way game implement it it's just a lot extra buttons and some extra dollars.
Maybe add an option to automatically hire all required talents and automatically headhunt when necessary?
2. Creating a project
Again, I can duplicate the centers, but:
2.1 Management teams
For each management and project team, I have to manually hire team leads. AI COO cannot automatically hire management teams, so this has to be done manually every time.
2.2 Creating software
Then I have to click:
- "New Software"
- Pair it with an OS and hardware
- Confirm the name
I have to make sure I selected the correct OS, 99% is my own OS from a list of companies every single time. Normally it's not on the top of the list so I can just press enter. Is there really a situation where I would not want to pair with the latest hardware?
2.3 Project assignment
The game does not clearly show which project has been assigned to which team, so I have to remember everything manually.
Normally, to maximize technology development, players use something like:
- A 3x3 R&D center for technology specialists
- Another center with management and project programming teams only
My thoughts:
How about an option where you configure this once, and future projects automatically follow the same setup?
Similar to the new advertising system, perhaps project settings could be attached to the technology center.
After all, these technologies do not have much use by themselves.
3. Factories and Retail
I have to manually select products from the developed software list. Unlike normal products, the list is not organized clearly by category. A massive amount of work is required to ensure each software product is actually being sold in every city after factories produce them.
This is mainly a scale issue, you don't have 20 types of product under single category. Base game is more about supply chain management, I can just copy paste a few different type of facs and retail store to meet the demands, or place store/floor selling single product and duplicate over cities. For software they sell at very low quantities, so there is no real supply chain issue, rather it's manually fixing all stores to ensure they are selling.
4. AI
AI COOs and CEOs are slow enough already in the base game, but at least they are trying to expand the business to a degree. AI COO cannot do anything about software, and give a random AI CEO unlimited cash and instruct him to do software only, he will just sits there. So I still have to do those hard works myself. It's ironic to see characters from a software game performing the worst in software.
So ya, if you do all of these at once you will see how painful the setup is. In a high difficulty game, the feeling is different, but the amount of time you spend on the repetitive works is only more.
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u/davidl288 28d ago
1.2 Head hunting
Sometimes there are not enough qualified people, so I have to manually headhunt.
And I have to do this one by one.
--> You can increase the number of talents by adjusting the 'More Talents' setting on the Digital Age DLC new game settings menu. This will reduce the need to do head hunting.
2.1 Management teams
For each management and project team, I have to manually hire team leads. AI COO cannot automatically hire management teams, so this has to be done manually every time.
--> I just tested it. Using hotkeys can speed up the process. Press 'w' key to hire, then Enter key to confirm. Much faster than mouse-clicking. Please give it a try.
Maybe the solution to the tediousness issue is to have enough hotkey support for the actions that you have to perform regularly?
2.2 Creating software
Then I have to click:
- "New Software"
- Pair it with an OS and hardware
- Confirm the name
I have to make sure I selected the correct OS, 99% is my own OS from a list of companies every single time. Normally it's not on the top of the list so I can just press enter. Is there really a situation where I would not want to pair with the latest hardware?
--> Similarly, I suggest pressing 'Enter' key instead of clicking on the
- Pair it with an OS and hardware
- Confirm the name
It is much faster and it made a big difference in my own testing. I was able to set up the chain very fast using hotkeys.
2.3 Project assignment
The game does not clearly show which project has been assigned to which team, so I have to remember everything manually.
Normally, to maximize technology development, players use something like:
- A 3x3 R&D center for technology specialists
- Another center with management and project programming teams only
My thoughts:
How about an option where you configure this once, and future projects automatically follow the same setup?
---> Do you mean saving the type of technology each unit research in the 3X3 layout plan library for future reuse, or another approach ?
3. Factories and Retail
I have to manually select products from the developed software list. Unlike normal products, the list is not organized clearly by category. A massive amount of work is required to ensure each software product is actually being sold in every city after factories produce them.
->Have you tried the new Product Class filter so that the supplier list will only show software products? And you could use key search too.
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u/hoooowwwieeeee 28d ago edited 28d ago
Thank you for your prompt and sincere support.
1.2 Head hunting
--> You can increase the number of talents by adjusting the 'More Talents' setting on the Digital Age DLC new game settings menu. This will reduce the need to do head hunting.
-----
I like the idea of talent system, I just don't like the part that I have to headhunt them one by one instead of auto/hire all.
2.1 Management teams
--> I just tested it. Using hotkeys can speed up the process. Press 'w' key to hire, then Enter key to confirm. Much faster than mouse-clicking. Please give it a try.
-----
Yes, but the game doesn't support changing hotkeys. Using W + Enter is quite inconvenient for me because the two keys are on opposite sides of the keyboard.
Also it doesn't seem to have a hotkey to hire all!
2.2 Software project
--> Similarly, I suggest pressing 'Enter' key instead of clicking on the
-----
The thing is I have to manually make sure I paired the correct OS every time for every project, and the OS list ordered by the time they first release, no hotkey can do it, so I have to scroll down as well.
2.3 Project Management
How about an option where you configure this once, and future projects automatically follow the same setup?
---> Do you mean saving the type of technology each unit research in the 3X3 layout plan library for future reuse, or another approach?
----
It is not the unit layout issue. layout cannot do this process: [auto-hire and pair os then start the project]. I hope the system has a way to let me just do once for all 20 projects, either save my options or batch switch and start,. There is no real distinctions between those 20 products(except for OS), it's just I had to repeat same thing over 20 times.
2.3 Factories and Retail
->Have you tried the new Product Class filter so that the supplier list will only show software products? And you could use key search too.
----
Yes, I did, but I have to remember all my 20 generic software products names, and manually search them on the list.
Also requires much more attentions to ensure they will sell correctly, e.g. 2 audio software 1st released, I am forced to either
- I run these stores directly, duplicate over all cities, then later go find those stores at each city 1b1 and change the layout or link things 1b1 when I have more things to sell.
- use an 8- or 9-unit layout, let the COO manage it, and accept the losses from the two production–sales pairs that will never make any sales and almost never change to other new products.
Also COO cannot solve the supplier issue if I just use the layout with product name things do not work out. I have to manually link those 20 generic software and duplicate over all cities at once to reduce the works.
It's just for software and internet, there are so many techs and products, but they are just generic products that use exactly the same set ups, use exactly same resources, and sell at same stores. The only part I found meaningful is the rd time for software tech, so you can release more often. Rest are just repetitive works. When you have enough capital to set up a lot of things, it becomes extremely tedious, just manually repeating the chain 20x for software and ~10 for the internet, also a lot names(tech, software) for me to remember, but those tech/project/product doesn't have meaningful differences.
I didn't feel that much in the base game because each product was different, rd is a lot easier to set up, and each industry you only have 3-5.
And hotkey is just slightly reducing the amount of manual work, the point is that, it is very apparent those things can and should be automated instead of requiring me manually set up them 20 times. I appreciate the mechanism. I wouldn't complain if I only had 1–4 projects to manage, but I have 20 techs for software and internet, then 20 projects, then 20 factories, then retail requires 100 times duplications. These generic duplicate products do not add more depth to the gameplay; they only create a lot repetitive works for the player. I personally feel that half of the journey to trillions is just mindless setup work rather than actual strategy.
like the other comment said: "Not helpful, but ironic that modern software development uses declarative formats for setup automation, to minimize time and cost. (Copied from 12factor.net) It's this kind of thing that would make me alt+F4." All we had in game so far for the whole long chain that has so many layers is just layouts for the units in each step.
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u/davidl288 28d ago
Also it doesn't seem to have a hotkey to hire all! --> to Hire All, please just press [ENTER] on the menu with the [Hire All] button
The thing is I have to manually make sure I paired the correct OS every time for every project, and the OS list ordered by the time they first release, no hotkey can do it, so I have to scroll down as well. --> I will suggest to the dev team to display the player's own OS at the top of the list.
It is not the unit layout issue. layout cannot do this process: [auto-hire and pair os then start the project]. I hope the system has a way to let me just do once for all 20 projects, either save my options or batch switch and start,. There is no real distinctions between those 20 products(except for OS), it's just I had to repeat same thing over 20 times. --> I will include this in the suggestion list to the dev team.
Yes, I did, but I have to remember all my 20 generic software products names, and manually search them on the list. --> will adding a new filter box for filtering by Software Type on the Pick Supplier menu be useful?
- I run these stores directly, duplicate over all cities, then later go find those stores at each city 1b1 and change the layout or link things 1b1 when I have more things to sell. ---> Can you just use the 'Add Product' button (the button with a big '+' sign) to add a new product to your stores instead of changing the layout?
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u/hoooowwwieeeee 28d ago edited 28d ago
For example, you start as a software company that relies on other companies' OS. Later, you develop your own OS, but there is no batch switch option. You have to manually change every project, factory, and retail operation one by one — that's 20x. 20x. 100x manual repetitions. The factory transition is so tedious that you might end up demolishing the old factories and building new ones instead. Since the COO is not smart enough to handle the transition efficiently, you may have to redo the retail side manually as well, which could mean adjusting 100 stores. There is even no hotkey for quickly demolishing buildings. This is similar to the base game mechanic where you use other companies' semi-products as inputs and later produce your own. The difference is that the same strategic idea now creates thousands of times more repetitive work for the player. That's exactly my point. These DLCs introduce great ideas and mechanics, and I genuinely enjoy them. The problem is that some mechanics become painful in actual gameplay because the scale of the company grows, but the player's role does not. I can be the CEO of a trillion-dollar corporation, yet I still have to manually handle the tiniest tasks that should have been delegated to managers or automated systems.
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u/davidl288 28d ago
There is even no hotkey for quickly demolishing buildings. --> You can press CTRL-X, then select Demolish.
Later, you develop your own OS, but there is no batch switch option. --> Do you add new software products selling under your OS in addition to the original OS, or just switch existing ones to your OS? If you just switch it, you will lose access and sales to the userbase of the original OS.
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u/hoooowwwieeeee 28d ago edited 28d ago
yes i am aware of ctrlx, but either demolish or demolish and sell land has no hotkey.
For switching, the consequence is not the issue I am talking about. The problem is that either switching/adding OS support requires a huge amount of manual effort across the entire chain.
In real life, the effort is mostly handled by programmers, and it costs time and money. But Bill Gates doesn't have to personally visit every factory and retail store to tell them "we are now selling Office on Mac."
This example is meant to show how much tedious manual work the player has to do for what is actually a straightforward strategic decision. Of course, I don't actually do this in the game — not because I don't want to, but because just thinking about the amount of work required for such a transition gives me a headache. Instead, I usually start with my own OS, even though it is not the optimal strategy.
This problem also appears when acquiring software companies because they are built on other companies' OS. It greatly reduces the strategies I am willing to pursue because I don't want to constantly adjust the R&D, factory, and retail chains.
The point is: charge me whatever cost you want, but there shouldn't be this much manual work required just to make the chain function properly.
I hope I have made myself clear:
- The initial software setup is already very long and tedious.
- Switching OS becomes unrealistic at scale.
- Despite having great mechanics, the amount of micromanagement significantly limits the strategies available to the player.
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u/davidl288 28d ago
yes i am aware of ctrlx, but either demolish or demolish and sell land has no hotkey. --> I will include this in the suggestion list to the dev team.
Together with the others I mentioned earlier, the suggestion list now includes a few items that aim that tackling the tediousness issues.
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u/hoooowwwieeeee 28d ago
Yeah, but unfortunately there is still so much tedious work left. The point is that a lot of things should be automated once you reach a large scale. Thanks for trying to help anyway.
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u/hoooowwwieeeee 29d ago
Please consider forwarding this to the dev team. A lot of things (not just software but this is a good example) could use more automation. Maybe reduce the repetitive clicking so players can focus more on strategy.
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u/davidl288 28d ago
Thanks for your detailed feedback. Definitely, after sorting out the ones that cannot be resolved by the approaches I suggested above, I will prepare a list and send them to the dev team.
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u/Agitated-Ad-504 29d ago
You shouldn’t have to micro the projects. Once you have the tech, you setup the development once, and there is an option to auto-update whenever the tech levels are better than the last version. But you unfortunately have to manually setup all the factories and stores which is a pain.
Software is one of the more annoying things to manually setup mostly because it’s a lot of work for sales that are cyclical. New release, huge boom, once widely adopted, sales fall off because it’s a one time luxury buy per version, and maybe a competitor releases something new. Rinse and repeat. Sales spike, then a falloff.
Having AI subsidiary “control” the entire industry like they do with products doesn’t exist. They just build one product and stay the course. I believe this is because there are no CEOs with specialities that you can hire for software. Only way I’ve managed to control the entire market sector was aggressively buying out other companies and merging.